Author Topic: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!  (Read 377401 times)

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Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #220 on: July 23, 2011, 03:16:13 PM »
I could see a 20 liter mark on the water but it was short of that, maybe 16 liters (1000 grams/liter)  or 16,000 grams

Dear Danny, this might help!
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/


Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #221 on: July 23, 2011, 03:47:38 PM »
the dough (about 1500 grams) keeps sticking to the wall of the mixer bowl without human intervention. For now, I am not going to make any attempts to modify the fork's rotation speed until I understand the mixer as it is. I will keep you posted. Have a great weekend!

Congrats on your shiny new toy. You have already found that the fork will push dough out of the way to the side of the bowl if it is rotating too fast. Sometimes I simply use one hand to control the speed of the bowl and the other with a rubber spatula to keep the dough engaged in the fork and using one eye to judge the consistency of the dough and the other eye to watch YouTube videos of Rebecca Black.

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #222 on: July 23, 2011, 04:08:11 PM »
Dear colleagues, here is an interesting new Youtube video from EatItalina.com:

Quote
Yeast depends on the temperature inside, depends on humidity on it's other place, how long of fermentation you want to do it at, what kind of fermentation you want to do it- if you want to use the cooler or just use the natural way.

So, every place have a different way of making the dough in Italy. There's no formula, can you use for change that, we change all the day.

No formula for yeast quantities? Where have I heard that before?  ;D

scott123

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #223 on: July 23, 2011, 04:19:33 PM »
1) why was the water already "dirty" like it had yeast already in there at 2:56 ?

I'm about a 30 minute drive south of A Mano and I just poured a glass of water and it was crystal clear (it tastes like a swimming pool, but that's another story). My best guess is that he added the yeast once and then someone said "hey, we need to film that, let's do it again" or perhaps it was a second take.

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #224 on: July 23, 2011, 09:42:02 PM »
You have already found that the fork will push dough out of the way to the side of the bowl if it is rotating too fast.

Dear Bill, I am beginning to understand or, perhaps I should say, "realize" this mixer's virtues. She is moody and has a peculiar rhythm. The last batch of dough I made with her had a texture to die for, a true pleasure for the hands to touch and hold. Since this afternoon I have been doing nothing but mixing one batch of dough after another. (Almost all my neighbors now have a piece of dough to bake!) As you rightly mentioned earlier, the rotation of the mixer bowl ought to be slowed down manually by use of hands. (I learned to do away with the spatula.) And, as the amount of dough hydration is increased, less intervention is needed. Making dough with this mixer is a task. She makes me sweat; nonetheless, she makes it worth your while with the beautiful texture she endows the dough with. The picture below shows before (the left one) and after (the right one) I learned to touch her!!! I still need to explore her more.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 05:59:53 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #225 on: July 23, 2011, 10:12:57 PM »
Omid:

One important step in my particular regimen using this mixer: after the main mixing phase, I give the dough a riposo for about 20 minutes and then turn on the Santos for a few more turns around the bowl. The difference in texture after this is notable. Whether it matters down the line in the final product is debatable.

FWIW, I have a batch of Santos dough fermenting to be baked tomorrow to verify whether the Tartine method is superior. I'll post results tomorrow in a separate thread.



 

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #226 on: July 24, 2011, 12:35:20 AM »
Below are the pictures of my first Santos-mixer pizzas (56% Hydration):
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 06:11:13 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #227 on: July 24, 2011, 12:36:21 AM »
Continuation:
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 05:39:53 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #228 on: July 24, 2011, 12:37:24 AM »
Continuation:
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 03:07:45 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Zeppi

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #229 on: July 24, 2011, 09:36:06 AM »
Geez!!............Beautiful !!....now I'm so hungry for  :pizza:!!



Louis


Offline Zeppi

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #230 on: July 24, 2011, 10:47:33 AM »
Omid, attractive looking pizza.  :-*

Color corrected it....lookatdat milky cheese!





Piece of art!!


Louis
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 10:59:17 AM by Zeppi »

Offline Barry

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #231 on: July 24, 2011, 10:53:42 AM »
Hi Omid,

If you view the Eat Italiano video again, at about 7:20 , you will notice a "fixed paddle" positioned flat against the side of the rotating bowl, and directly in front of the rotating fork. This seems to scrape the dough away from the sides, and into the arms of the rotating fork.

Your Santos mixer appears to be identical to that used at A Mano, excepting for the "fixed paddle" feature.

Your new dough looks great. I suspect your pizzas would be even better if you could cook them is a 900 deg F wood-fired oven!

Kind regards.

Barry in Cape Town

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #232 on: July 24, 2011, 11:58:26 AM »
Geez!!............Beautiful !!....now I'm so hungry for  :pizza:!!

Dear Louis, thank you! Have a great day.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 12:57:19 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #233 on: July 24, 2011, 12:31:32 PM »
Hi Omid,

If you view the Eat Italiano video again, at about 7:20 , you will notice a "fixed paddle" positioned flat against the side of the rotating bowl, and directly in front of the rotating fork. This seems to scrape the dough away from the sides, and into the arms of the rotating fork.

Your new dough looks great. I suspect your pizzas would be even better if you could cook them is a 900 deg F wood-fired oven!

Dear Barry, I thank you very much for pointing out the horizontal and vertical "paddles" fixed inside the mixer bowl. Soon I will have a customized "Piccolo" wood-fueled brick oven by Guiseppe Crisa (Forno Classico). He had already built me one, which I sold and asked him to build me another one with a slightly lower dome, smaller mouth, and slightly larger floor diameter. I can't wait! Have a great day.
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 12:56:58 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline wheelman

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #234 on: July 24, 2011, 12:37:58 PM »
omid,
those pies look amazing as always. 
did you find any further info on making the Santos run at lower speed? 
bill

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #235 on: July 24, 2011, 12:56:28 PM »
omid,
those pies look amazing as always.  
did you find any further info on making the Santos run at lower speed?  
bill

Dear Bill, I thank you for the compliment! I have already talked to an electrical engineer who thinks it is probably possible to decrease the RPM. He lives about 2 or 3 hours away from here, and I just have to find some time to drive to him. I will post the results here as soon as I find out. Have a great day!
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 12:58:42 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline JConk007

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #236 on: July 24, 2011, 03:21:09 PM »
PN,
I am interested in the fornoclassico. You say you had one and sold it?They do look really nice and ell constructed Giuseppa is an Italian builder/artisan , and  sells  on ebay? I assume  No big overhead probably allows him to be so competitive. Several posts on these ovens here  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14314.0.html and
  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13386.0.html I noticed he posted pics and I asked him about the measurements and he did not reply. Exactly as you have requested the dome looked a little and the opening quite large. My other concern was the clay chimney Pipe, are you changing that or adapting a cover to keep moisture out? Little more room is also nice what size floor? opening and dome hieght are you requesting?
Thanks for sharing.
John
« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 03:40:24 PM by JConk007 »
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Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #237 on: July 24, 2011, 06:32:45 PM »
Omid:

One important step in my particular regimen using this mixer: after the main mixing phase, I give the dough a riposo for about 20 minutes and then turn on the Santos for a few more turns around the bowl. The difference in texture after this is notable. Whether it matters down the line in the final product is debatable.

Dear Bill, I thank you for the information. Today, I kept experimenting more with the mixer. The more I use it, the more I like it! My tentative conclusion in regard to operating the mixer handsfree while making a small volume of dough is that one needs to understand her rhythm and accordingly attune the dough—in terms of hydration, temperature, and consistency—to flow with the rhythm, as opposed to working against it. Manual intervention is definitely needed in the outset. However, once the dough is oriented to the mixer's rhythm, then the hands can be retired. I hope this makes sense; it is not easy to explain.

Below is my Youtube link showing how I have tamed my Santos. Have a great night!

« Last Edit: July 24, 2011, 06:35:31 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #238 on: July 24, 2011, 06:47:11 PM »
However, once the dough is oriented to the mixer's rhythm, then the hands can be retired. I hope this makes sense; it is not easy to explain.

Perhaps there is a zen-like harmony which includes the rhythm of the mixer, but it has been my experience with smaller batches that "less is more" and that the crust can be a little chewier than I like if I knead it to the "hands-free" stage.

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #239 on: July 24, 2011, 08:36:35 PM »
PN,
I am interested in the fornoclassico. You say you had one and sold it?They do look really nice and ell constructed Giuseppa is an Italian builder/artisan , and  sells  on ebay? I assume  No big overhead probably allows him to be so competitive. Several posts on these ovens here  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14314.0.html and
  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13386.0.html I noticed he posted pics and I asked him about the measurements and he did not reply. Exactly as you have requested the dome looked a little and the opening quite large. My other concern was the clay chimney Pipe, are you changing that or adapting a cover to keep moisture out? Little more room is also nice what size floor? opening and dome hieght are you requesting?
Thanks for sharing.John

Dear John, Giuseppe Crisa's wood-fired brick ovens are all his own designs. (He has more designs than shown on his website http://www.fornoclassico.com/) Having conversed with him on many occasions and having tried his ovens, he is great at what he does. He has a sound rationale underlying his oven designs and features. Since he has immigrated from Italy to the United States as his new home, which is a different market than the one in Southern Italy, he had to come up with a design to meet the popular demand here in America—without compromising the pizza-baking virtues of his ovens, which is his principal priority. For instance, in respect to the size of the oven opening, many Americans like to simultaneously stick an entire turkey and other food items inside their brick ovens; and, if the oven opening is not wide enough, it can be problematic! Nonetheless, the oven is awesome for backyard pizza napoletana—one of the best of its kind.

His "Piccolo" model is small, yet powerful! I do not know of many wood-fired oven builders that use real specialized bricks inside their mini ovens, probably because, as he once told me, building a mini brick oven is more difficult and requires more labor and time. Giuseppe's philosophy goes against cement ovens, which are utilized in many small-sized ovens in the US.

In regard to the clay chimney pipe, Giuseppe sells full-size cover which protects the entire oven from the elements. In terms of the specifications of my oven to be built, I can not remember the measurements, which I had written down somewhere. However, I was thinking that I should go back to his original design. Since I already have had good results using his original piccolo design, I should probably stick to what I already know works! Good night.
« Last Edit: July 27, 2011, 08:12:19 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/


 

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