Author Topic: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe  (Read 33744 times)

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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #50 on: October 11, 2012, 03:52:04 PM »
The 28oz Certified were at least $1/can more than the 35oz Italian here too. The 35oz have never been DOP - just "Italian."
Oh..OK. The DOP here are 28oz also.
I'm think I got it now. Going to ask for 35oz "Italian". Thanks.
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Offline MrPibbs

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #51 on: October 24, 2012, 06:51:29 PM »
I read this thread and understand the quality and unique connotation intended when someone recommends using authentic, Italian certified, San Marzano.  I know there is no comparison to the Georgia Vidallia from other locations promoting Vidallia/sweet onions.  Similar problem highlighted on 60 Minutes about French Truffles.

Having been using 6 in 1 and Bunto's, I want to try the authentic San Marzano's to see what they taste like.  Can you guys please give a link(s) to the best place to get a home user quantity to make sure they are the real deal?  I saw these La Valle at PennMac that seem to be DOP Italian SM, but at that price, I'm not sure.

I did see the Strianese at the earlier posting if that is the best place to get them.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #52 on: October 24, 2012, 07:33:12 PM »
Like anything else, the quality of DOP San Marzano tomatoes varies widely. I used a can of DOP Strainese tomatoes last weekend, and they couldnít hold a candle to a typical can of Cento Italian (35oz) Ė not even close. IMO, paying for DOP SMs is a waste of money. There are other, often much better, tomatoes available at a fraction of the cost.

Those La Valle SM tomatoes you pointed to are not DOP SMís. The La Valle DOP come in a green can and say DOP on the front label: http://www.pennmac.com/items/2626//la-valle-dop-san-marzano-tomatoes-28-oz Shipping on tomatoes is going to be expensive. You canít find any DOP SMs locally?
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Offline TomN

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #53 on: October 25, 2012, 12:51:52 AM »
I thought the taste of Gia Russa brand was good.

Offline MrPibbs

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #54 on: October 25, 2012, 10:11:22 PM »
Like anything else, the quality of DOP San Marzano tomatoes varies widely. I used a can of DOP Strainese tomatoes last weekend, and they couldnít hold a candle to a typical can of Cento Italian (35oz) Ė not even close. IMO, paying for DOP SMs is a waste of money. There are other, often much better, tomatoes available at a fraction of the cost.

Those La Valle SM tomatoes you pointed to are not DOP SMís. The La Valle DOP come in a green can and say DOP on the front label: http://www.pennmac.com/items/2626//la-valle-dop-san-marzano-tomatoes-28-oz Shipping on tomatoes is going to be expensive. You canít find any DOP SMs locally?


Craig, I am looking at our local groceries over the weekend.  Do you know which specific Cento Italian 35oz label you mentioned above?  (Being a novice, I don't know if they also have a quality diversity like you just showed me with the La Valle SM at PennMac.  Thank you!

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #55 on: October 25, 2012, 10:20:31 PM »
There is only one Cento that comes in a 35oz can, the "Italian." it is very good in my experience.
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Offline toyman

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #56 on: October 26, 2012, 11:44:49 AM »
Here's a link to some interesting info on San Marzano's.  http://www.sanmarzanotomatoes.org

The problem is that calling non-DOP San Marzano's, San Marzano's is that it is misleading.  As I got further into pizza, I wanted San Marzano's.  Initially it was based on price and I bought less expensive can's of San Marzano's, which I later found, much to my dismay, that they were not truly from the San Marzano region of Italy as I expected they were.  Anytime confusion is created in the marketplace, it can become an issue.  Those who only look topically into SM's may never try true (by the Italian definition) SM's, and that's an issue IMHO.  You can grow a plum/roma tomato and call them SM's if you want, but they are not, which is my opinion about American grown SM's.  If the tomato companies weren't trying to acheive sales from the SM name, they would make it very clear that they are not from the SM region instead of making it look like they are.  Why do they do it??  For sales, period, and it works. 

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #57 on: October 26, 2012, 03:27:00 PM »
San Marzano is also a variety of tomato, so while it's potentially confusing, it's not necessarily misleading to label San Marzaro tomatoes as San Marzano even if they are not DOP.
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Offline toyman

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #58 on: October 30, 2012, 10:53:35 AM »
San Marzano is also a variety of tomato, so while it's potentially confusing, it's not necessarily misleading to label San Marzaro tomatoes as San Marzano even if they are not DOP.

We'll have to agree to disagree on the misleading portion.  If it didn't help sales, it wouldn't be done.  San Marzano's are known tomatoes, especially in the food industry.   


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #59 on: October 30, 2012, 11:04:19 AM »
We'll have to agree to disagree on the misleading portion.  If it didn't help sales, it wouldn't be done.  San Marzano's are known tomatoes, especially in the food industry.   

A fact is a fact. Calling a San Marzano tomato a San Marzano tomato is not misleading. It is what it is. I don't disagree that is is done to help sales, but what isn't? That doesn't make it wrong or misleading.

If someone in the food industry can't figure out the difference between DOP and non-DOP SM's, tomato confusion is likely the least of their problems.
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #60 on: October 30, 2012, 11:41:21 AM »
San Marzano is also a variety of tomato, so while it's potentially confusing, it's not necessarily misleading to label San Marzaro tomatoes as San Marzano even if they are not DOP.
It may not be against the law.....but c'mon, they are being VERY misleading. Most home cooks don't understand the importance of the letters DOP such as you do Craig. Of course, as in all cases, let the buyer beware....
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #61 on: October 30, 2012, 12:13:29 PM »
It may not be against the law.....but c'mon, they are being VERY misleading. Most home cooks don't understand the importance of the letters DOP such as you do Craig. Of course, as in all cases, let the buyer beware....

Most home cooks - and by most, I mean the VAST VAST MAJORITY - have never even heard of a SM tomato, so how can they be misled? Of the few who have, what is their excuse for not educating themselves?

You say most don't understand the importance; when it gets down to the nut-cutting, what is the importance of the letters DOP? I've had dozens of cans of DOP SM's that were vastly inferior to other non-DOP tomatoes? Who is misleading who anyway? One might argue that putting DOP on a can (legitimately) and marketing it as as an indicator of superior quality (to help sales...) is what is really misleading here.

"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #62 on: October 30, 2012, 12:41:17 PM »
I was going to add "certified" too. But never the less, even without any "labeling"...they put pictures and stuff like that on their cans to help lead the unaware into buying a product that has the appearance of being the real deal expensive tomato product that they hear all the big time chefs saying they should seek out.
They don't have an excuse for not being educated cause they are stupid idiots that follow stupid tv shows.I am the new stupid idiots advocate! (Hope I spelled that right!)  :-D
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #63 on: October 30, 2012, 01:05:04 PM »
If someone in the food industry can't figure out the difference between DOP and non-DOP SM's, tomato confusion is likely the least of their problems.

This isn't about the food industry. It's about products that are available in consumer-size quantities at retail prices; products that are marketed to people who have no idea that the label on the can might not accurately describe what's in the can.
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #64 on: October 30, 2012, 01:51:24 PM »
This isn't about the food industry. It's about products that are available in consumer-size quantities at retail prices; products that are marketed to people who have no idea that the label on the can might not accurately describe what's in the can.

I was simply responding to toyman who wrote: "If it didn't help sales, it wouldn't be done.  San Marzano's are known tomatoes, especially in the food industry."  

"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #65 on: October 30, 2012, 02:00:23 PM »
Craig,
Do you have a connect for some good pizza tomato's? I think I've found a way to ship 'em.Thanks...
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #66 on: October 30, 2012, 02:25:40 PM »
I was going to add "certified" too. But never the less, even without any "labeling"...they put pictures and stuff like that on their cans to help lead the unaware into buying a product that has the appearance of being the real deal expensive tomato product that they hear all the big time chefs saying they should seek out.
They don't have an excuse for not being educated cause they are stupid idiots that follow stupid tv shows.I am the new stupid idiots advocate! (Hope I spelled that right!)  :-D

Now you don't even want them to put pictures of plum tomatoes on their cans? Seriously?

I can count on one hand how many "big time" chefs I've heard mention SM tomatoes in my lifetime. This is a "problem" that affects almost nobody, and to listen to you guys one would think it is going to bring down our whole economy. Where does this hatred come from?

I'm still waiting for someone to explain why it's not misleading to put DOP on a can of tomatoes that is inferior to less expensive non-DOP tomatoes???
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #67 on: October 30, 2012, 02:26:39 PM »
Craig,
Do you have a connect for some good pizza tomato's? I think I've found a way to ship 'em.Thanks...

You can't find the Centos I use in NC? Just about everyone around here carries them.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #68 on: October 30, 2012, 03:43:20 PM »
I'm still waiting for someone to explain why it's not misleading to put DOP on a can of tomatoes that is inferior to less expensive non-DOP tomatoes???

You're waiting for someone to explain why it's not misleading to label DOP tomatoes as DOP tomatoes?

Seriously?!?

How's this for an explanation? Because the fact that TXCraig1 prefers non-DOP tomatoes to DOP tomatoes does not dictate that DOP tomatoes should be labeled as something they're not. Same reason it's not misleading to label faucets as faucets, rather than labeling faucets as toilets.

If TXCraig1 prefers non-DOP tomatoes to DOP tomatoes, then TXCraig1 wins, because TXCraig1 gets to buy what he considers superior tomatoes for considerably less money than what he considers inferior tomatoes.

Some things are just labeled what they actually are, regardless of what TXCraig1 thinks they should or should not be labeled.
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #69 on: October 30, 2012, 04:10:41 PM »
If TXCraig1 prefers non-DOP tomatoes to DOP tomatoes, then TXCraig1 wins, because TXCraig1 gets to buy what he considers superior tomatoes for considerably less money than what he considers inferior tomatoes.

And don't you forget it!  :-D

Perhaps my sarcasm is too subtle for you?

In all seriousness, IMO, putting DOP on an inferior can of tomatoes and using DOP label to market a perception of superior quality is FAR more misleading than simply calling non-DOP San Marzano tomatoes, San Marzano tomatoes.

I never suggested that they should be labeled as something they are not as you claim. DOP-qualifying tomatoes do not have to be labeled DOP - that is a choice made by the manufacturer, and I bet there are plenty who will gladly label their tomatoes DOP, even if they know they are sub-par, because they can get 2X as much for them.

So, you tell me what is worse: paying $2.89 for a can of good San Marzano tomatoes you mistakenly took for DOP because of an attractive label or paying $4.49 for a bad can of real DOP SM's?
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline Tscarborough

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #70 on: October 30, 2012, 05:24:53 PM »
What are they supposed to call them, "San Marzanos but not the ones you think they are"?

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #71 on: October 30, 2012, 05:30:43 PM »
Perhaps my sarcasm is too subtle for you?

Apparently your sarcasm is too subtle for me. Either that or you're just not very good at expressing sarcasm.

Although I used to use DOP San Marzanos exclusively, I can't tell you the last time I bought DOP San Marzanos. Still, I can say I've had much better experiences with DOP San Marzanos than I have with plain old Italian tomatoes or mislabeled "San Marzano" tomatoes, possibly excluding La Valle "San Marzanos" (in the yellow-orange cans).

(Are Nina labeled "San Marzano"? Regardless of what their labels say, Nina tomatoes suck.)

I rarely pay either $2.89 or $4.49 for a 28-35 oz can of tomatoes anymore. Even though I've had good experiences with Cento DOP tomatoes (which apparently haven't even been available for a long time), I've become a big fan of Stanislaus Saporito Filetto di Pomodoro, which costs me $5.99 for a 6 lb-6 oz can. These tomatoes are perfect for deep dish straight out of the can, and they work great for NY style, too, with a little processing. If you have never had a chance to use them for your pizzas, I'm guessing you'd probably love them.

But since you asked, I think paying $2.89 for a deceptively mislabeled can of "good" tomatoes is equally as bad as paying $4.49 for "bad" tomatoes. Just don't try to deceive me, regardless of which can you're trying to sell me. Because if you do, it's not gonna pay off for you in the end.
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #72 on: October 30, 2012, 05:33:30 PM »
What are they supposed to call them, "San Marzanos but not the ones you think they are"?

As far as I'm concerned, they should call them whatever they actually are, regardless of what they are. Why is that so hard for some people to understand or comprehend?
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #73 on: October 30, 2012, 05:38:27 PM »
They are San Marzano tomatoes.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: San Marzano Tomatoes Pizza Sauce Recipe
« Reply #74 on: October 30, 2012, 05:40:20 PM »
As far as I'm concerned, they should call them whatever they actually are, regardless of what they are. Why is that so hard for some people to understand or comprehend?

Isn't that exactly what you're complaining about? Calling a SM a SM.
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