Author Topic: leoparding  (Read 20069 times)

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Offline widespreadpizza

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leoparding
« on: February 05, 2008, 07:19:13 PM »
I have been struggling with consistently achieving the nice small leopard spots in my WFO.  Granted it is not as low of a dome as I wish it was,  it's 42"x16" , but it cooks a pie as slowly or quickly as I want it to.  I can go anywhere from 5 minutes to sub 60 seconds.  I have randomly had very good success with the appearance that I am looking for,  but want to be able to get there consistently.  There are so many variables that I cannot nail it down.  Here is a synopsis of what I've been experimenting with.


All Caputo 60-62%  2.5% salt both natural and commercial leavening.
All doughs mixed with my Bosch universal mixer from 5-12 minutes.
All doughs fermented at either 61 or 68 degrees or a combination of both warmer towards the end
All doughs bulk fermented for apx 3/4 of total time then balled in sealed palstic containers, anywhere from 12-36 hours total fermentation
All bakes under 90 seconds but closer to 60
Oven heated up to at least 850 floor an well over 950 dome
250-265g dough balls for a 12 inch pie

I know some of my batches have been what I am looking for,  but i don't know what the most important factor(s) are.  I am guessing that you all might say mixing, fermentation, and heat.  I did just borrow a variac from a friend to see what slowing down my mixer might do,  but have not tested yet.  I really hope some of you want to discuss this in detail and my hope would be that someone can tell me the answer,  or at least tell me where to focus.  I have been wanting to post about this for a while,  but I was trying to figure it out for myself.  I eagerly await your feedback.  Thanks -Marc



« Last Edit: February 06, 2008, 12:07:05 AM by widespreadpizza »


Offline scpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #1 on: February 05, 2008, 08:49:42 PM »
I have no WFO nor experience with them.  However I was reading an article discussing leoparding and in addition to the oven characteristics which of course are critical the other key factor behind leoparding was dough surface moisture.  Thus you may want to play with:
- overall dough hydration
- use of bench flour
- dough ball rise conditions (e.g. try a breathable container)

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #2 on: February 05, 2008, 10:02:19 PM »
scpizza,  thats something i was wondering about,  but kind of dismissed it a while ago, I guess that I shouldnt have.  I would love to read that article if it is online,  please point me to it.  I have been hesitant about using a breathable container so that the surface of the dough doesnt dry out,  but will give it a shot.  It has been my practice for a long time to makes sure that pretty much my entire cornice gets very lightly covered with flour as I stretch it out to prevent any ugly unloading problems.   Anyone else have any clues for me.  I would appreciate them.  -marc

Offline November

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #3 on: February 05, 2008, 10:28:29 PM »
I couldn't agree more with scpizza (or rather the article he read) on the bench flour factor.  To get optimal browning I take the silicone brush that I use to spread the oil on the dough balls earlier in the process and brush off the rim of the pizza just before putting the toppings on.  The oil residue, which I purposely leave on the brush, helps to remove any extraneous flour.

- red.november

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #4 on: February 05, 2008, 10:29:16 PM »
Heat may be the most important factor.

The size, number and color of the spots seem to be related to the dough composition.

I don't think mixing has much to with it. Batches I make with both my food processor and fork mixer all come out with nice leoparding.

Bill/SFNM



Offline David

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #5 on: February 05, 2008, 10:41:17 PM »
Age / temp of dough?
If you're looking for a date... go to the Supermarket.If you're looking for a wife....go to the Farmers market

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #6 on: February 05, 2008, 11:05:45 PM »
Bill, when you say composition do you mean the overall recipie,  or type of flour used?  I am assuming you mean hydration/salt/yeast.  Also what do you think about trying a vented container, is that your practice?  Thanks all,  keep the input coming.  -marc

Offline scpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #7 on: February 05, 2008, 11:36:04 PM »
Can't seem to find the article now.  First thing I would try is the breathable container.  Not open air so ball crusts over, not totally sealed so ball is slimy, something in between.  Can also use a cloth barrier to help achieve right balance.  Result is you don't need as much bench flour.

Reduce bench flour further by:
- making the pizza very fast
- transferring pizza onto the peel only after dressed
- using very hard wood peel
- sliding into oven immediately (on peel only a few seconds)

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #8 on: February 06, 2008, 01:45:02 AM »
Bill, when you say composition do you mean the overall recipie,  or type of flour used?  I am assuming you mean hydration/salt/yeast.  Also what do you think about trying a vented container, is that your practice?  Thanks all,  keep the input coming.  -marc


marc,

I mean ingredients, time and temp of fermentation, etc.

I use sealed containers for fermenting and proofing (with just a little pinhole in the lid to allow excess gas to escape). Never seen condensation in the container, but I live in a very dry climate.

I've mentioned this in other threads, but I would not get too hung up on the visuals like leoparding. Among the best pies I have ever made are ones with very little leoparding and some of the worst have had very nice leoparding. It is very easy to overcook a pie waiting for the spots to develop. Not sure if you can see it in my video but the spots begin forming very early and nearest the fire.

Bill/SFNM



Offline 2stone

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #9 on: February 06, 2008, 10:37:42 AM »
Hey Marc,

Alas....I have no answers, and am in the same boat you are.
I confess my desire to have leopard spots is fueled more by
the challenge of it all and the visual appeal rather than taste.

I agree with Bill that some of my best tasting pizza had few
or no leopard spots, and the spots start appearing very early.
Just when I think I am on to something...the next time I try the
same thing it doesn't happen again!

as you can see in this video, the spots started at around 30 sec
and the browning happened in the last 10 seconds.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oAwsqevZJo" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_oAwsqevZJo</a>


(it is a 60/40 mix of Caputo and high gluten... which may explain the fast browning)

regards,
willard



 
2Stone blog: www.2stoneblog.com


Offline PizzaBrasil

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #10 on: February 06, 2008, 03:45:41 PM »
If any one of you could read Italian language, go to www.pizza.it/forum and search by pontini neri and/or lipase.
There is a great discussion over there.

Luis

Offline Arthur

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #11 on: February 13, 2008, 08:33:07 PM »
Heat the oven for a longer period of time.  Even with "850 floor an well over 950 dome" you can get an 850 floor that really is just hot on the very surface.  Heat longer (50% longer) and see if you notice any differences.   Also, use almost no flour to prep the peel.

Offline Bobby Martino

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #12 on: February 17, 2008, 05:25:54 PM »
Do you get better spots after the 36 hour mark?  I use a similiar build and I find the the best spotting comes on the fourth day with just slightly wet dough at 850- 900 degrees ???

Offline Bobby Martino

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #13 on: February 18, 2008, 07:16:16 PM »
Check out the photo gallery for two new pizzas with spotting I posted today :-[

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #14 on: March 22, 2008, 01:23:42 PM »
Well,  some of these tips have helped out.  I am beginning to think that it has most to do with high heat from the side,  hydration,  apparent wetness on the outside of the dough,  and a good long fermentation.  I have been working with GM Sperry organic bread flour for a little bit.  It is rated at 12% protein and I am finding that it really holds up to a longer fermentation.  Also it is unmalted so that it is not burning on me.  I have been using the poolish method with IDY and liking it a lot.  I have been mixing 100% of the water with 50% of my flour and leaving in a 85 degree oven overnight,  and making the dough the following morning. After that I do a room temp bulk rise to double, which takes about 4 hours,  than I divide and put in the frigde immediately for a couple days,  during which the dough proofs perfectly. This flour just absorbs whatever you throw at it.  I started my experiments at 62%,  three batches later I am at 68% and think that this is good.  Last night was one of those nights with the WFO you just wish would never end, in the first 30 seconds I knew it was on.  Must have been the full moon or something.  Also the other day I was roasting a chicken at low heat,  about 325,  with hickory and decided what the heck,  and threw a few 1/2" slices of whole milk mozz down on some parchment paper.  Then I put it into the smoke filled oven with the door shut for 10 minutes rolled it up and put it in the fridge for pizza night.  It achieved an amazing amount of both color and flavor and really put the pies over the top last night.  A little goes a long way.  I recommend to anyone that can to smoke some up asap,  it was way better than anything I have bought in stores.  here the specs.  100% Sperry bread/68%spring water/2% sea salt/.2% IDY.  Next week i will be trying to duplicate this crust exactly, so stay tuned.  It had so much flavor,  people thought it was sourdough based.  -marc
« Last Edit: March 22, 2008, 04:45:00 PM by widespreadpizza »

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #15 on: March 22, 2008, 01:24:48 PM »
more, and I forgot,  bake time was apx 75-90 seconds.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2008, 01:28:32 PM by widespreadpizza »

Offline shango

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #16 on: March 22, 2008, 03:04:57 PM »
Those pizze look really nice.
pizza, pizza, pizza

Offline Bobby Martino

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #17 on: March 23, 2008, 01:22:56 PM »
I agree those pizze look gooooood!

Offline scpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #18 on: March 24, 2008, 08:49:51 AM »
Great leapording and balance between top and bottom.

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: leoparding
« Reply #19 on: March 26, 2008, 08:54:16 PM »
So due to the weather (it hit 60 degrees today!) I jumped the gun on 1 of my 4 doughs I had going for Friday night.  Same dough as above just cooked very differently.  Outside on the gas grill with some cherry wood going on the side.  Not Neapolitan,  but really good.  It baked for about 10 minutes,  addicting.  I'll post the results of the other 3 over the weekend.  Don't forget about this option,  enjoy the weather  -marc
« Last Edit: March 26, 2008, 08:56:10 PM by widespreadpizza »


 

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