Author Topic: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina (Read 113936 times)

pythonic · « **Reply #660 on:** April 01, 2012, 11:38:22 PM »

Much better results this time. I must have under kneaded it last time because this time the crust was perfecto

Had a friend over who prefers "sh*t on a shingle" vs deep dish and he raved over this one.

Nathan

pythonic · « **Reply #661 on:** April 01, 2012, 11:39:00 PM »

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #662 on:** April 09, 2012, 11:56:26 AM »

Nathan,

That there's a thing of beauty....very inspiring. I'd like to give this a go.Can you please tell me which final dough recipe you went with...thanks.

Bob

pythonic · « **Reply #663 on:** April 09, 2012, 02:44:07 PM »

Bob,

Here is the recipe I used below. Sorry for not having the exact percentages but I just scribbled it down real fast.

Total flour - 143.01g (107g all purpose and 36g semolina flour)
Water - 63.54g
ADY - 1/4 tsp
Salt - 1/4 tsp
Sugar - 1/2 tsp
Corn oil - 17.16g
Olive oil - 8.58g
Butter (softened) - 8.58g

Nate

rcbaughn · « **Reply #664 on:** April 12, 2012, 06:26:10 PM »

So with the pie on the very first page, the olive oil AND corn oil are added to the dough in those percents, and the pan is slightly oiled with corn or olive oil to prevent sticking? I didn't catch that in any posts. Thanks!

Garvey · « **Reply #665 on:** April 13, 2012, 12:10:26 AM »

RCB: yes, that is all correct.

Btw, you may want to take a look at VCB's recipe (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,16859.0.html), since he gives the full procedure in a PDF. Even if you don't use his exact formulation, it will show you the "dao of deep dish", as it were.

rcbaughn · « **Reply #666 on:** April 13, 2012, 01:47:46 AM »

Thanks so much! I mixed up the dough with the 15% semolina post on the very first page, and man did my dough turn out oily for sure. I am a bit worried, it looks striated with oil even after a good amount of kneading, I'd say 2 minutes after the 25 minute rest. I am going to go look at that post now and see if his looks similar. Thanks a lot for the tip on that post again, much appreciation as always. Nice to have a good bunch of people to talk to. -Cory

dwillingm · « **Reply #667 on:** July 16, 2012, 03:09:26 PM »

Quote from: BTB on March 31, 2008, 10:25:45 AM

Next I added some drained 6 in 1 sauce to which I added Penzeys pizza spices, minced garlic, white pepper, sea salt, ginger, a good dash of honey (key ingredient) and a few pieces of small diced plum tomatoes. I usually don't like a chunky pizza sauce at all, but strangely have come to love it in Chicago Style pizzas. I then put on a healthy amount of grated parmesan cheese from my specialty Italian deli. On top of that, I also added several pieces of sausage that I had left over from the links. I baked the pizza on my pizza stone on the bottom oven rack, which I previously heated up for an hour at 475 degrees F. I reduced the heat to around 450, turned the pizza 180 degrees after 15 minutes, put the oven's convection (fan) feature on for the last 10 minutes, and then took the pizza out after cooking for around 22 minutes. I was going to cook it for 25 minutes, but the little pieces of sausage on top were starting to burn a bit. See Pics below.

Hi,

For a 14" pizza, can you recommend the amounts to use for the following ingredients?

drained 6 in 1 sauce
Penzeys pizza spices
minced garlic
white pepper
sea salt
ginger (fresh?)
a good dash of honey (key ingredient)

Thanks!

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #668 on:** July 16, 2012, 04:03:36 PM »

For a 14in. I would probably use around 3 cups of sauce...jus make sure you have a nice even layer about 1/4 to 1/2 in. thick.
I don't want to get in trouble with you so the additions are gonna have to be your call....I'm sure most would agree. It's YOUR pizza and YOUR tastes....but if you must have a jumping off point than the best I can tell you is to dress the empty pan with your additions, sprinkle them arond in the pan as if you were topping a baked potato....then transfere that into a bowl, mix with sauce. I just salt an pepper the sauce after I've put it on the pizza.

Milsco · « **Reply #669 on:** July 18, 2012, 08:49:04 AM »

Hey Team,

Huge thanks to the boys who have contributed and guided the group on this topic. I had been working with Mom's old recipe which was just so far away that I don't think we'd make it to this level in 100 years of tweaking! I'll be passing along my thanks to BTB, Loo, Pete, VCB, and the rest of you in the form of a donation to the site.

I used BTB's 6/12/6 oil formula along with his 75/18/7 flour. Dough came together wonderfully. Only issue was not giving the cup a coat of oil/water before taring, that's the only reason I can think of to come up 19 grams short. 90 minute proof then into the fridge overnight.

The only pan I had was a 16" pure shiny aluminum, so I gave it two rounds of seasoning. Not sure how I pulled off the second one as the first set off the smoke alarm, woke the baby, and had the wife complaining of oil smell for the next two days. Anyways, it's probably 1/10th of the way to the full black outside we all find at Lou's.

I used a full 28 oz crushed San Marzano + 14 oz diced Muir Glen, but kept the additives to pinches (salt, white pepper, onion powder and minced garlic) and Tbsps (honey and light brown sugar). Think this came up flat so I may dial up seeing how BTB advises small amounts for his 9" and I am working with 16".

Laid the cheese in a "shingle pattern" to divert water away from the center, pressed in the sausage on one half, and spread the sauce. The other side got fresh basil and paper towel pressed tomato slices. A few sprinkles and off to the oven.

Had the oven at 500, dropped to 450 at entry. All was going smooth until I noticed the edges of the crust browning at 15 minutes! I threw a sheet of foil over top and dropped to 425 for the remaining time, and the sides made it pretty well, actually. Sadly, the bottom was more crisp than I would have liked.

All in all, the "crowd" went wild and I really liked my first try. I'd still say I am a good distance from the ultimate goal, but was thrilled with how easy this was and how close it came!

Would love to get feedback on the images of my process here (https://www.dropbox.com/sh/dxg7fpixhe6ckiw/m41jnqkna9), and a few specific questions:
1. Is getting the crust cooked right a matter of pulling the pizza frequently and checking the bottom? Or is it just trial and error? If trial and error, should I play with time or temp?
2. Would it make sense that my sauce seemed a bit plain given that I used 9" advice on a 16"?
3. Anyone else getting the crust sides browning up really early?
4. What is the best way to store all the flours and yeast? I had bought yeast packets but am thinking if I just need 1 tsp maybe I should be buying a jar and fridging it? How long do these things last?

Thanks again for your help and thanks in advance of your advice!

Bobino414 · « **Reply #670 on:** July 20, 2012, 01:32:33 PM »

I did a Chicago deep dish last night for a friend from India who never saw or heard of this style of pie.

I cobbled together a dough using the work of Ed (VCB), Loo, Nate (pythonic), and BTB. This was the best deep dish crust I have made to date. It had the pastry like qualities I remember from the early days at Unos. The usual suspects were in the dough but it was the mixing that made a difference. I discovered early on that the Bosch mixer could not properly mix the high oil/fat content of the dough. For years I used the KA for this dough but the mix was long and the results only so so. This time I used a food processor with the plastic mixing blade and only pulsed 20 times. This resulted in a bowlful of pea sized globs. I brought it all together by hand-about 10 seconds. This rested for about 1 hour and into the fridge overnight. The one hour rest probably isn’t needed.

Next day I let it rest for about 1 hour at room temp. I wasn’t convinced I should do this as the small pieces of butter might melt reducing the flakiness. Dough was rolled out and placed in a dark springform pan. Docked. Parbaked for 4 minutes at 475.

Each 9 inch pie was topped with 12 oz of mozz; the bottom layer was slices of homemade mozz made from Belgioioso curd. (Note to self-only buy Polly-O curd). The top layer of cheese was Grande whole milk.

The cheese was covered with very well drained and squeezed Nina brand tomatoes “packed somewhere near the San Marzano region in Italy.” These are sold by Costco, cheap, but the tomatoes only fill half the can. Tomatoes were spiced with marjoram, salt, red pepper flakes, olive oil and basil. One 28 oz can per pie.

Baked for 20 minutes.

Bottom line-just changing the mix method made a good pie into a really good pie.

Bob

kellmax · « **Reply #671 on:** July 28, 2012, 09:39:34 AM »

Okay so I made two dough balls for a 12" pie, let them rise once on warm oven, punched down, covered with plastic wrap/bagged and put into the fridge-- and they have been cold fermenting in the fridge since Friday morning around 10am. My question is this-- I plan on making them tomorrow late afternoon and I am wondering if they are still good? I read conflicting posts that 48 hr cold proof/fermenting is best, then some say it is too long. Just wondering what your opinions are!
Any help?

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #672 on:** July 28, 2012, 09:50:30 AM »

Usually dd doughs are used within 24 hours but I don't think you should have any problems kell. How is it behaving...doesn't sound like you used too much yeast an it's blowing up all over the place or you'd have said so....you'll be fine, enjoy!

vcb · « **Reply #673 on:** July 28, 2012, 10:37:32 AM »

You should be fine using your dough after 2 days in the fridge. I've made good deep dish with dough that had been in the fridge for 3 days. I wouldn't go too many days though or you might end up with beer in a ziploc. :-)

Your dough may be more flavorful and the texture of your crust may be less flaky and more crumbly than a short same-day risen dough.

I currently make my pizza dough an hour or 2 before I plan to use it and don't bother with the overnight refrigeration any more. It may just be my tastebuds, but a less fermented dough with a short rising time tastes more authentic to me.

Let us know how your dough works out for you. :-)

kellmax · « **Reply #674 on:** July 28, 2012, 03:06:22 PM »

Thank you!
The dough doesn't look too bubbly at all...it's slightly puffy...smells great,too. As long as it stays like this tomorrow I should be good.
MMM Can't wait!

OTRChef · « **Reply #675 on:** August 17, 2012, 09:08:19 AM »

According to Lou Malnati's, the only ingredients in their crust is: flour, water, corn oil, olive oil, yeast. No butter, and at least no specific mention of semolina.

BTB · « **Reply #676 on:** August 17, 2012, 09:55:27 AM »

Quote from: OTRChef on August 17, 2012, 09:08:19 AM

According to Lou Malnati's, the only ingredients in their crust is: flour, water, corn oil, olive oil, yeast. No butter, and at least no specific mention of semolina.

When you say "according to Lou Malanti's" I assume you are referring to the ingredient listing on their frozen pizza packages. Remember that there are dozens of different "flours" and semolina is one of them. So when you see an ambiguous ingredient list on a package for flour, one cannot assume much of anything as to what type of flour -- or combination thereof -- is used. Such is often a trade secret.

Butter is just brushed onto the dough spread out in a Malnati's pan and not part of the dough ingredients itself. But many like a small amount of butter into the dough mixture in any event for home made pizzas. If one doesn't like the effect or flavor it impacts, then by all means leave it out of the formulation.

Garvey · « **Reply #677 on:** September 10, 2012, 09:14:45 AM »

My last many DD pies have been based on BTB's (final?) formulation from page 25 of this thread. The only change is that I use VCB's dough weight instead, since I prefer something a bit thinner. For example, where BTB's recipe would call for about a 570g dough ball for a 12" pie, VCB's recipe is around 400g.

This weekend, I did a little something different. I bumped up the hydration level to 50%, inspired by VCB's recipe, and I did my own twist of using 2% IDY instead of 1%, just to see how the flavor and baking behavior would go.

Formulation for one 12" pie:

Flour* (100%):
Water (50%):
IDY (2%):
Salt (1%):
Olive Oil (6%):
Corn Oil (12%):
Butter/Margarine (6%):
Sugar (1.5%):
Total (178.5%):

232.49 g | 8.2 oz | 0.51 lbs (*80/20 blend of AP & Semolina = 186 AP and 46 Semolina)
116.25 g | 4.1 oz | 0.26 lbs
4.65 g | 0.16 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.54 tsp | 0.51 tbsp
2.32 g | 0.08 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.42 tsp | 0.14 tbsp
14 g | 0.50 oz | 0.03 lbs | 3.1 tsp | 1.03 tbsp
28 g | 1.00 oz | 0.06 lbs | 6.2 tsp | 2.07 tbsp
14 g | 0.50 oz | 0.03 lbs | 2.95 tsp | 0.98 tbsp
3.50 g | 0.12 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.87 tsp | 0.29 tbsp
415 g | 14.64 oz | 0.91 lbs | TF = I dunno, .095-ish, maybe...

I used 100^o F water, and with that much IDY, it doubled after about 75 minutes. I punched it down and put it in the fridge and punched down again about 75 minutes later. It stayed in the fridge for about 18 hrs total before being brought out an hour before baking. One more assembly note: I used 12 oz of cheese total (8 mozz and 4 provolone).

PROS/CONS:
The dough was great to work with. This is my new hydration level, hands down. The yeast also imparted some extra flavor, and the dough had great baking action. That being said, I prefer the more complex flavors and digestibility from a longer ferment, so next time I'd probably go with cooler water and/or 1.5% IDY and a good 36-48 hr ferment. This is an area of experimentation for me, personally.

OVERALL:
Turned out awesome. Check out the pics below. Many thanks again to BTB and VCB for the great recipes and inspiration.

Garvey · « **Reply #678 on:** September 10, 2012, 09:18:34 AM »

More pics:

mrmojo1 · « **Reply #679 on:** September 11, 2012, 11:59:18 PM »

looks great! my stomach is very very jealous!