Author Topic: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina  (Read 163353 times)

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Offline tsmys

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #140 on: March 13, 2009, 04:14:24 PM »
BTB,

I understand your feelings about sausage, I really do.  In fact, my next Chicago pizza will have a big ol' pattie of raw sausage on it!  I was just pointing out that there is more than one way to skin a dog, so to speak.  With all due respect I feel I must speak up and defend my friend the microwave.  Properly used it is an amazing tool.  Many people, (present company excluded, I'm sure), don't get it that the power on a microwave is adjustable.  It can be turned down to the point where it will gently heat or cook food without turning it into something inedible.  For example, when I precook sausage, I use power level 3 (your oven may differ). This results in a sausage pattie that's not hard and dry like sausage cooked in a pan but soft, moist, and delicious.  Unfortunately, BTB not all of us are as fortunate as you in having a reliable source for our sausage.  Due to location or cost, some of us just have to make do.


Offline BTB

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #141 on: March 13, 2009, 04:27:13 PM »
I understand tymys.  We each got to do our thing.  Here's a sausage pattie I did for a pizza a while ago.  It cooks thoroughly at 450 degrees for 20 to 30 minutes on the pizza.  Good luck with your next.   --BTB

Offline tsmys

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #142 on: March 13, 2009, 08:23:38 PM »
BTB,

Thanks for the kind words :D  If the whole pattie works as well as I hope it will, I promise I'll not use any other technique!  I first came to this forum to learn how to make a pie as close to Gino's as I could.  I recently lost focus and tried to make a Lehmann NY pie, but I'm ready to get back on course.  It sounds like you have the Chicago pizza mastered.  I've been studying your thread and have learned a lot.  Thank you for helping everyone else!

Offline BTB

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #143 on: March 14, 2009, 10:11:21 AM »
Sometimes I like a deep dish pizza with a sausage patty, like they generally make it at the famous Gino's East Pizzeria in Chicago.  But then at other times I like the sausage spread out a little.  Use of the patty is best for "sausage lovers" (which I often am).  It's purpose is to provide "a piece of sausage in every bite."  I hate ordering sausage on a pizza at a restaurant and then finding that there is only a little piece of sausage every 2 or 3 inches or so.  With so little sausage, you basically have a cheese pizza mostly and to me, that's generally not what I wanted. 
 
On the other hand, however, I like the style of deep dish pizza at the famous Lou Malnati's, too, and while many think they, too, put on a sausage patty whenever you order sausage as an ingredient, it is not so.  They put a lot of little pieces or chunks of sausage in the pan -- on top of the cheese -- and it often looks like a patty from some of the pictures on the TV shows, but it isn't.  Their "default" is to put a lot on, but you can request a lighter amount of sausage at the restaurant to match your tastes. 
 
I often like to leave gaps when applying the sausage in pieces or chunks on my homemade pizzas so that the cheese can bubble up to the top of the pizza and give it that special delectable effect, like I often find at Malnati's.  With a sausage patty, that generally does not occur, altho it had with some of my home made pizzas whenever I would put a few pieces of fresh mozzarella on top of the sausage patty. 

Some pictures of an earlier pizza I made below will hopefully show what I mean about the gaps and allowing room for the cheese, which is mostly below the sausage, to bubble up in places to the top of the pizza.  Best to experiment to see what you and your family and friends like the best.  In the end . . . it's all good.                            --BTB

Offline mkc

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #144 on: March 14, 2009, 11:53:13 AM »
I made a 25% semolina, 12" version once again.  Still using my 12" Lodge skillet. 

I noticed some difficulty working the oils into the dough after the initial rest, so I dumped everything into the food processor with the plastic dough blade and whizzed it just until the oil was incorporated.  The result seemed to be a much more "delicate" feeling dough.

This was also felt when patting it into the pan.  Definitely a lighter-feeling dough.

I topped the dough with 1/2 lb Kroger Private Selection mozzarella slices then 1/4 lb PS provolone slices.  On top of that went 2/3 lb of Sprouts hot chicken Italian sausage made into a 12" patty (raw), followed by slices of Ezzo pepperoni (nuked 22 seconds between paper towels to remove grease).  Then I added 10 ounces sliced mushrooms and 5 ounces frozen chopped spinach that I'd sauteed with minced garlic until almost completely dry andcooled.  Sauce was a 28 ounce can of Great Value crushed tomatoes that had been drained for 3 hours  mixed with Penzey's pizza seasoning, salt, garlic powder, white pepper, and a blop of honey, and finally a healthy sprinkle of grated parm.

450 for 1/2 hour with the pan on a preheated stone, let rest 15 minutes before cutting.

It was fabulous!!!  Thanks BTB!!!

Michelle

Offline BTB

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #145 on: March 14, 2009, 12:17:24 PM »
Michelle, that looks really, really good.  I'm totally inexperienced with using an iron skillet, but many people here use one very successfully.  And I'm blown away at the use of a food processor.  I sometimes use mine for thin cracker crusts, but never for a Chicago Style deep dish as it would seem to overwork the dough.  But . . . your's looks fantastic!  And that's what counts.  Good to know as I may try that one day.  A 28 oz. can of  crushed tomatoes would normally seem almost twice as much as needed, but the pictures don't seem to show that.  The slices look super as is (love that cheese melting over the edge of the slice!).  Ingredients sounded good, except I'd leave the spinach to Popeye (altho my wife would probably like it).

Congratulations on your success.  Many more.                 --BTB

Offline mkc

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #146 on: March 14, 2009, 12:37:05 PM »
Thanks - The dough was barely processed after I'd done the regular mixing.  I was worried it would heat up and I didn't want that (or any significant gluten development) so I'd guess 10-15 seconds plus a couple of pulses.  It was definitely a risky test, but apparently one I got lucky with.

I did get a lot of liquid from the tomatoes when I drained them with the mesh sieve, and they dripped for almost the entire 3 hours of draining.  If I had to guess (because I didn't measure), I'd say it removed close to 3/4 cup of liquid.  Last time I'd used a 15 ounce can and it wasn't quite enough sauce to go around; I'd had to add a little extra plain tomato sauce.

I used the iron skillet because it's the closest thing I have to a deep dish pan, unless I want to make a 9" pie with one of my cake pans.... 

The best part is that with just 2 people, we have leftovers!

(oh, and the spinach was just because I'm in a freezer cleanout mode and it helped "balance" the use of pepperoni.....)

Michelle

Offline JConk007

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #147 on: March 14, 2009, 07:44:14 PM »
Very Very Very Nice Michelle!
I am back from Vacation eating a grandamas pie right now. So I tune in and see this great looking deep dish!!  Maybe spinach only for me too, or just all meat, a curious combo but we all have to clean the freezer sometime! That picture with the cheese WOW ! A real Contender here BTB ;)
John
« Last Edit: March 14, 2009, 08:38:47 PM by JConk007 »
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Offline foodblogger

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #148 on: March 15, 2009, 06:14:16 PM »
I give the recipe an enthusiastic thumbs up.  This is going into my pizza stable.  I made the 20% dough.

Offline MarleyEds

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #149 on: March 16, 2009, 05:10:10 PM »
Man, every time I read this thread, I get hungry   :chef:

Has anyone other than BTB tried a semolina percentage over 25% yet?  If so, what was your thoughts?


parallei

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #150 on: March 22, 2009, 09:06:48 PM »
Thanks to all of you for the great recipe.  I did 25% Semolina and didn't use any cream of tarter.  I have absolutely no bench mark to measure against, but I thought it was pretty darn good.  I did it at 450F for 23 minutes.  Next time I might try a lower temp for a bit longer time.  And maybe a bit more cheese... 

Offline JConk007

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #151 on: March 23, 2009, 01:04:49 PM »
Great Job! Looks delish! Nice change isn't it? and a great recipe BTB
How much cheese did you use? I use close to 1 1/2 pound of cheese, 1 +lb of sausage maybe some pepperoni,  and 1 , 28 oz can of 6-1 with a few tweaks and add ins when I make the 14 incher. A few calories for sure, but hey who's counting? and it tastes sooo good!
John
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Offline Jazzman

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #152 on: March 29, 2009, 04:38:30 PM »
BTB and/or Pete-zza or others:

I have tried this recipe and it's awesome.  One question, though; when it was re-calculated for 15" (the size pan I have), somehow the salt got left out of the equation.  Being a newbie, and afraid I'll punch something wrong in the pizza calculator - can someone respond with the proper formula (including salt)?

Also, I bought a 14" square pan, but haven't tried it yet - how would one figure out the formula for a pan that size?

Thanks for helping a newbie - I am the new pizza king in my town!

Marty

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #153 on: March 30, 2009, 03:03:19 PM »
Marty,

As the "custodian" of all of the Malnati/semolina deep-dish dough formulations, BTB may be the best one to address your request. However, in the dough formulation that I posted at Reply 26 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6480.msg63992.html#msg63992, for a 15" pan, the salt was left out intentionally, at the request of one of the members.

Since there are several recipes in this thread, can you tell us which specific recipe you want to modify to include salt if, upon reconsideration, that is what you would still like to do (the original recipe calls for 0.5% salt)? And also what amount of semolina if not otherwise stated?

With respect to your 14" square pan, you should be able to use the "Rectangular" feature of the deep-dish dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/dd_calculator.html. All the other entries would be the same as with a round pan.

Peter

Offline Jazzman

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #154 on: March 30, 2009, 03:42:02 PM »
Pete,

Thanks for the quick reply.  Using your formula (the one you did for someone on page 2), and adding in .5% salt, as in the original, I used the dough calculator, and this is what I got for a 14" square pan:

Flour (100%):    601.02 g  |  21.2 oz | 1.32 lbs
Water (47%):    282.48 g  |  9.96 oz | 0.62 lbs
ADY (.7%):    4.21 g | 0.15 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.11 tsp | 0.37 tbsp
Salt (.5%):    3.01 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.63 tsp | 0.21 tbsp
Olive Oil (6%):    36.06 g | 1.27 oz | 0.08 lbs | 8.01 tsp | 2.67 tbsp
Corn Oil (18.5%):    111.19 g | 3.92 oz | 0.25 lbs | 8.24 tbsp | 0.51 cups
Butter/Margarine (1%):    6.01 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.27 tsp | 0.42 tbsp
Sugar (1.5%):    9.02 g | 0.32 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.26 tsp | 0.75 tbsp
Cream of Tartar (.75%):    4.51 g | 0.16 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.5 tsp | 0.5 tbsp
Total (175.95%):   1057.49 g | 37.3 oz | 2.33 lbs | TF = 0.126875

Seems about right, doesn't it?  Thanks for your help.

Marty

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #155 on: March 30, 2009, 04:04:38 PM »
Marty,

For the 15" round pan, the modified dough formulation with 0.50% salt is:

All-purpose/Semolina Flour Blend (100%):
Water (47%):
ADY (0.70%):
Salt (0.50%):
Olive Oil (6%):
Corn Oil (18.5%):
Butter/Margarine (1%):
Sugar (1.5%):
Cream of Tartar (0.75%):
Total (175.95%):
481.67 g  |  16.99 oz | 1.06 lbs
226.39 g  |  7.99 oz | 0.5 lbs
3.37 g | 0.12 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.89 tsp | 0.3 tbsp
2.41 g | 0.08 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.43 tsp | 0.14 tbsp
28.9 g | 1.02 oz | 0.06 lbs | 6.42 tsp | 2.14 tbsp
89.11 g | 3.14 oz | 0.2 lbs | 6.6 tbsp | 0.41 cups
4.82 g | 0.17 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.02 tsp | 0.34 tbsp
7.23 g | 0.25 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.81 tsp | 0.6 tbsp
3.61 g | 0.13 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.2 tsp | 0.4 tbsp
847.5 g | 29.89 oz | 1.87 lbs | TF = 0.126875

Of course, you will have to recalculate the apportionment of the flour blend between all-purpose flour and semolina flour.

Your calculations are correct for the 14" square pan if it is 2" deep and you push the dough up the sides of the pan for the full 2" depth. That is one-half inch more than for the 15" pan. If you use 1 1/2" for your 14" square pan also, the dough formulation looks like this:

All-purpose/Semolina Flour Blend(100%):
Water (47%):
ADY (0.70%):
Salt (0.50%):
Olive Oil (6%):
Corn Oil (18.5%):
Butter/Margarine (1%):
Sugar (1.5%):
Cream of Tartar (0.75%):
Total (175.95%):
543.78 g  |  19.18 oz | 1.2 lbs
255.58 g  |  9.02 oz | 0.56 lbs
3.81 g | 0.13 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.01 tsp | 0.34 tbsp
2.72 g | 0.1 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.49 tsp | 0.16 tbsp
32.63 g | 1.15 oz | 0.07 lbs | 7.25 tsp | 2.42 tbsp
100.6 g | 3.55 oz | 0.22 lbs | 7.45 tbsp | 0.47 cups
5.44 g | 0.19 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.15 tsp | 0.38 tbsp
8.16 g | 0.29 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.05 tsp | 0.68 tbsp
4.08 g | 0.14 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.36 tsp | 0.45 tbsp
956.78 g | 33.75 oz | 2.11 lbs | TF = 0.126875

In both examples, I used a thickness factor of 0.125 and a bowl residue compensation of 1.5%.

Peter




Offline BTB

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #156 on: March 31, 2009, 08:36:50 AM »
Marty, welcome to the site.  You'll have a lot of fun dreaming up pizza recipes to make your friends and family happy and anxious for more good pizzas.  You'll find that you can vary a lot of things to reflect your tastes and likes.  Sometimes I put salt in the recipe and many times I don't.  As of late, I've deleted the cream of tartar from this recipe, which has always just been optional and not essential, and add instead a half to whole teaspoon of baker's non-fat dry milk, which should also be considered optional.  As for the proportion of semolina flour, I'd suggest first trying 15 to 20% of the total amount of flour.                  --BTB

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #157 on: April 03, 2009, 09:13:03 PM »
I made a 10" using my own Malnati's clone recipe swapping out 20% of the flour for semolina.

Flour                  203g
Semolina              51
Water (47%)       119
Corn Oil (19%)      48
Olive Oil (4%)       10
ADY (1%)              3

This was a same day dough with the first rise in the oven for 1 1/2 hours with the light on and some hot water for humidity.  The second rise was a counter rise for two hours.  Made it half sausage/half pepperoni.  Greased bottom of pan with Crisco and baked at 475* for 20 minutes turning 180* half way through.

Earlier in this thread, loowaters posted a modification of one of his Malnati deep-dish clone dough formulations (originally presented at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4070.msg33948.html#msg33948) to adopt BTB's idea of including semolina flour as part of the overall flour blend. What interested me is the fact that Loo made and used the dough within only a few hours--specifically, in less than four hours--which appears not to be all that common with Chicago deep-dish doughs. For those who wish to replicate Loo's "emergency" deep-dish dough with the semolina flour, I used the information that Loo provided at Reply 62 (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6480.msg64528.html#msg64528) and the following Reply 63 to come up with the following dough formulation using the deep-dish dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/dd_calculator.html:

All-purpose/Semolina Flour Blend* (100%):
Water (47%):
ADY (1%):
Olive Oil (4%):
Corn Oil (19%):
Total (171%):
254 g  |  8.96 oz | 0.56 lbs
119.38 g  |  4.21 oz | 0.26 lbs
2.54 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.67 tsp | 0.22 tbsp
10.16 g | 0.36 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.26 tsp | 0.75 tbsp
48.26 g | 1.7 oz | 0.11 lbs | 10.72 tsp | 3.57 tbsp
434.35 g | 15.32 oz | 0.96 lbs | TF = 0.130048
* The flour blend comprises 203 grams of all-purpose flour and 51 grams of semolina flour
Note: The formulation is based on using a 10" straight-sided pan with the dough being pushed up to 1 1/2" of the total pan depth; there is no bowl residue compensation

Using the baker's percents given above along with the thickness factor of 0.130048, one should be able to use the deep-dish dough calculating tool to come up with dough formulations for any size pans, whether straight-sided or sloping-sided. For example, for a 12" straight-sided pan with the dough pushed up 1 1/2" of the pan's depth, the dough formulation would look like this:

All-purpose/Semolina Flour Blend* (100%):
Water (47%):
ADY (1%):
Olive Oil (4%):
Corn Oil (19%):
Total (171%):
345.45 g  |  12.19 oz | 0.76 lbs
162.36 g  |  5.73 oz | 0.36 lbs
3.45 g | 0.12 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.91 tsp | 0.3 tbsp
13.82 g | 0.49 oz | 0.03 lbs | 3.07 tsp | 1.02 tbsp
65.63 g | 2.32 oz | 0.14 lbs | 4.86 tbsp | 0.3 cups
590.71 g | 20.84 oz | 1.3 lbs | TF = 0.130048
* The flour blend comprises 276.36 grams of all-purpose flour and 69.09 grams of semolina flour
Note: The formulation is based on using a 12" straight-sided pan with the dough being pushed up to 1 1/2" of the total pan depth; there is no bowl residue compensation

Peter

Offline jimmy33

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #158 on: April 08, 2009, 08:56:12 PM »
I need the correct calculations for a 15 inch . There are different ones on this board for a 15 inch.
Please help!!

Offline loowaters

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #159 on: April 09, 2009, 06:10:13 AM »
I need the correct calculations for a 15 inch . There are different ones on this board for a 15 inch.
Please help!!

Try the tool.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/dd_calculator.html
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