Author Topic: Confused about pizza style  (Read 394 times)

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Offline pfhlad0

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Confused about pizza style
« on: August 13, 2014, 01:19:25 PM »
Hi all,

I've been lurking around in the Neopolitain, General, and Newbie forums for a little while now. I've received a lot of very helpful information which has led me to a pretty good pizza. Being the perfectionist that I am, however, I'm still trying to iron out one last issue: The "non-crustiness" of the center of my pies. During a thread in the Neopolitain forum, someone suggested that perhaps I have a NY style pizza and that I should be asking the folks in this forum instead.

Here's my recipe and my workflow (makes 6 14" pies). I should mention that I'm using a Bosch Universal mixer for the dough and a WFO as my cooking vessel.

Ingredients:
2.2 pounds Caputo 00 flour
1.7g active dry yeast
14g kosher salt
600g water (150g warm for yeast, 450g cold)

Directions:
1.   Dissolve the yeast in 150g of warm water. Let it sit for 3-5 minutes.
2.   Pour yeast mixture in mixer bowl.
3.   Pour remaining 450g water in bowl.
4.   Add flour and salt to bowl.
5.   Mix until combined; then let sit for 20 minutes.
6.   Mix on low for 15 minutes.
7.   Take dough out of mixing bowl and put in a different lightly oiled bowl. Cover with plastic wrap and let sit for 1 hour.
8.   Lightly grease proofing vessels with olive oil.
9.   Make six 260g dough balls and put into individual proofing containers.
10. Put proofing vessels into refrigerator for 36-48 hours.
11. Take vessels out 2 hours before  the balls.
12. Stretch dough into 14" skins. Top and cook in a 750-degree (floor)/950-degree (dome) wood fired oven.

I'm really not looking for a label for my pizza. I'm guessing it's going to be a hybrid of a couple different styles. Basically, I want a pizza that's fairly thin with a puffy crust and a crunchy bottom all around. Like I said, I'm almost there...I just need to get the center a bit crunchier.

Any suggestions?

Also, although I really hate to start over from scratch, I'm wondering if I don't need the 00 Caputo flour for the type of pizza I'm looking to make. Obviously it would be much more convenient (and less expensive) if I could go to the regular grocery store for my flour instead of the specialty Italian market. But if it's going to make a better pizza, I'm all for it.

I've uploaded a few pictures in case it's helpful.


Offline jsaras

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2014, 01:43:17 PM »
Hard to tell from the pictures, but a couple of ideas that may work:

1.  Intentionally dress the pizza such that the center has less sauce, cheese, etc. 

2. Increase the thickness just a bit. 

Things have never been more like today than they are right now.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2014, 02:13:34 PM »
During a thread in the Neopolitain forum, someone suggested that perhaps I have a NY style pizza and that I should be asking the folks in this forum instead.

To be clear, I made that suggestion because of your desire for a crispy center which is definitely where NP will take you.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline pfhlad0

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2014, 02:38:24 PM »
Understood. :-)

Offline JD

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #4 on: August 13, 2014, 05:20:30 PM »
If you like everything about your pizza except for the crispy center, I would first just drop your oven floor temp to 650ish and bake a bit longer. If that doesn't help, try adding 2-3% oil to your dough and keep the lower oven temp.

NY does not necessarily mean crispy, in fact I'd say the opposite is true. But there are lots of NY joints that sell crispier pies and it is still considered NY. If your goal is specifically NY and not a hybrid pizza like you suggested, you'd have to switch from Caputo to a high protein flour at the very least, and bake at an even lower temperature for minimum 4 minutes.
Josh

Offline mitchjg

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #5 on: August 13, 2014, 05:40:38 PM »
I agree with the above comments.  I think that my typical pies are not much different than yours. 

I think you need to consider a longer back at a lower temperature, say in the 600s, no more than low 700s.  Given that, the Caputo is not right.  You may want to try a flour like King Arthur All Purpose (or Bread for more chew).  I often mix 20% Caputo in with the KAAP and cook in the 700s.  Probably should not bother and lower than that, more probably.

If you do switch flours, you can up the hydration a bit.

Your pies look nice!  It does look, however, like you are browning the toppings and cheese too much - my guess is you need to do that to get the crust to brown.  That is why Caputo is not a good choice at too low a temperature (750).  I only use 100% Caputo if I am well above 800.

« Last Edit: August 13, 2014, 05:42:44 PM by mitchjg »

Offline pfhlad0

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #6 on: August 13, 2014, 06:23:08 PM »
So if I cook at a lower temp do I "need" to switch from the Caputo flour? Could I leave the recipe and workflow the same except for the cooking time and temp?

If I do need to switch to a different flour, I'm guessing I need to change everything. I like a thin pizza so I'm guessing I don't want to use bread flour (too chewy for me). Thoughts on a diff recipe?

Offline hodgey1

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #7 on: August 15, 2014, 07:51:32 AM »
Hi pfh

First, this is just my experience and $.02. I am currently using the same basic work flow, WFO and temps. My bottoms are always done and sometimes ahead of top, so I then dome it. I replied to you on the NP page with some thoughts that maybe you floor temp is crashing as soon as you launch a pie, not sure, but worth looking into by checking floor temp as soon as you remove a pie.

The only other thing I can add "if the floor temps correct" is what I think was suggest here is to try going to a different flour. I am currently "10yrs" using high-gluten flour in the 14% protein range with very good results. I would use the same recipe and the HG flour with the following changes, up your water to 650g and add 20g olive oil. That's what I'm doing in my WFO and never have a bottom crust issue.

Online tinroofrusted

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #8 on: August 15, 2014, 09:55:56 AM »
So if I cook at a lower temp do I "need" to switch from the Caputo flour? Could I leave the recipe and workflow the same except for the cooking time and temp?  If I do need to switch to a different flour, I'm guessing I need to change everything. I like a thin pizza so I'm guessing I don't want to use bread flour (too chewy for me). Thoughts on a diff recipe?

At lower temps, Caputo won't brown properly. If you don't like a chewy crust but want more browning then you could go with AP flour (such as King Arthur's AP) which will give you quicker browning (due to the additional of malt in the flour) and still come out less chewy.  If you really want to use Caputo you could add something to promote browning, such as sugar or malt. 

Online mkevenson

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Re: Confused about pizza style
« Reply #9 on: August 15, 2014, 11:39:03 AM »
pfhlad0 , I just read all the suggestions and can not add anything of substance. I think you got a great response. Let us know if you incorporate any of these ideas and the results.

Mark
"Gettin' better all the time" Beatles


 

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