Author Topic: Papa Gino's Recipe  (Read 78068 times)

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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #340 on: October 10, 2012, 08:48:17 PM »
Norma,

What is your take on how Romano cheese makes a pizza taste different?  I guess also it would matter what brand of Romano that is used in the blend.

When I played around with the various three-cheese blends, both raw and cooked, I found that I could clearly detect the Romano cheese when in the raw state, even in small amounts, but I could not detect it in the baked state. I tried both a Romano cheese that I personally grated and a supermarket pre-grated Romano cheese. I tasted both of those forms side by side, raw, but could not detect much of a difference. FYI, according to the PG ingredients list, the Romano cheese they use is sheep's milk Romano cheese. As I recall when I researched Romano cheese, it can be made from either cow's milk or sheep's milk. There can also be blends of the two. My recollection is that I used a brand of sheep's milk Romano cheese when I did my calculations.

What sauce do you suggest I use for my next attempt?  I do have a large can of 6-in-1s that I can open.

According to the PG Nutrition Facts, the pizza sauce they use comprises Tomatoes, salt, black pepper, oregano, garlic powder, citric acid. Any pizza sauce that mirrors that sequence of ingredients should work. I was not able to identify any specific commercial product that contained the exact ingredients as noted above but, as I noted at Reply 194 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg189722/topicseen.html#msg189722, I suggested to Jamie that he consider using an Escalon product such as the Classico or 6-IN-1 products. Using a Classico tomato product in the 28-ounce can will spare you from opening a large can of the 6-IN-1s.

Peter


Offline norma427

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #341 on: October 10, 2012, 09:46:33 PM »
Norma,

When I played around with the various three-cheese blends, both raw and cooked, I found that I could clearly detect the Romano cheese when in the raw state, even in small amounts, but I could not detect it in the baked state. I tried both a Romano cheese that I personally grated and a supermarket pre-grated Romano cheese. I tasted both of those forms side by side, raw, but could not detect much of a difference. FYI, according to the PG ingredients list, the Romano cheese they use is sheep's milk Romano cheese. As I recall when I researched Romano cheese, it can be made from either cow's milk or sheep's milk. There can also be blends of the two. My recollection is that I used a brand of sheep's milk Romano cheese when I did my calculations.

According to the PG Nutrition Facts, the pizza sauce they use comprises Tomatoes, salt, black pepper, oregano, garlic powder, citric acid. Any pizza sauce that mirrors that sequence of ingredients should work. I was not able to identify any specific commercial product that contained the exact ingredients as noted above but, as I noted at Reply 194 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg189722/topicseen.html#msg189722, I suggested to Jamie that he consider using an Escalon product such as the Classico or 6-IN-1 products. Using a Classico tomato product in the 28-ounce can will spare you from opening a large can of the 6-IN-1s.

Peter


Peter,

Thanks for posting about your experiences with the Romano cheeses.  I used Bel Gioioso Romano grated cheese on my last attempt and am not sure if it is from sheepís milk or cowís milk.  http://www.belgioioso.com/Romano.htm  I probably could get a better Romano cheese from my supplier to try. 

Since I never tasted a PG pizza I sure wouldnít know how much salt, black pepper, oregano and garlic powder to add to the can of 6-in1s.  I might open the big can of 6-in1s and freeze the rest.  I am not sure when I am going to Walmart again and really donít recall right now what kind of Classcio products I have at market.  I think I saw a video on Youtube that showed the sauce is a little chunky, but am not sure of that.  I have to check on Friday what is at market. 

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #342 on: October 10, 2012, 09:48:45 PM »
Norma,

Will you be using the Kyrol/KAAP blend again?

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #343 on: October 10, 2012, 09:57:15 PM »
Norma,

Will you be using the Kyrol/KAAP blend again?

Peter

Peter,

I will, if that is what you want me to use.

Norma 
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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #344 on: October 11, 2012, 09:35:47 AM »
Norma,

I have set forth below the revised PG clone dough formulation. As you will note, it does not vary very much from the PG clone dough formulation that you last used and that I previously set forth at Reply 267 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg213221.html#msg213221. To greatly simplify the calculations, I assumed that you used a fermentation temperature of 40 degrees F for the reference standard you established by your last PG clone dough (a doubling in volume after 60 hours). For my calculations, I used the same temperature to come up with the revised PG clone dough formulation set forth below. The main difference is that I used 100 hours as the desired fermentation period (measured from 11:00AM on Friday to 3:00PM on the following Tuesday) instead of the 60 hours (2 1/2 days) that it took your last PG clone dough to double in volume. When the dust settled, the amount of IDY I came up with for the PG clone dough formulation set forth below is 0.21% (60/100 x 0.35%). As you might expect, because of all of the possible variations in temperature over 100 hours, even minor ones, at some point it may be necessary or desirable to tweak the amount of IDY for your particular application. But, first, we have to see how well the 0.21% IDY works out.

For the latest iteration of the PG clone dough formulation, I assumed that you might use the Kyrol/KAAP (King Arthur All-Purpose) flour blend again. The amounts of those two flours are set forth below. I used the Mixed Mass Percentage Calculator at http://foodsim.unclesalmon.com/ to calculate those quantities, based on a protein content for the blend of 13.2%, which is the same as the protein content of the Spring King flour. In that calculator, I used 14% for the protein content of the Kyrol flour and 11.7% for the protein content of the KAAP.

I also noted how much of the formula oil should go into the dough itself and how much should go on the surface of the dough ball, using the methodology set forth in Reply 61 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg40104.html#msg40104 and using the cube root calculator at http://www.calculatorpro.com/calculator/cube-root-calculator/. As before, I also note the amount of the yellow cornmeal (defatted) that should be worked into the dough ball (at 2.5% of the formula flour).

Using the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html, I came up with the following PG clone dough formulation:

Norma's 100-Hr, 40 Degrees F PG Clone Dough Formulation
Spring King Flour or Kyrol/KAAP Blend* (100%):
Water (59%):
IDY (0.21%):
Salt (2%):
Vegetable (Soybean) Oil (1.9%):
Total (163.11%):
282.27 g  |  9.96 oz | 0.62 lbs
166.54 g  |  5.87 oz | 0.37 lbs
0.59 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.2 tsp | 0.07 tbsp
5.65 g | 0.2 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.01 tsp | 0.34 tbsp
5.36 g | 0.19 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.18 tsp | 0.39 tbsp
460.4 g | 16.24 oz | 1.01 lbs | TF = N/A
*If the Kyrol/KAAP Blend is used, use 184.1 grams of the Kyrol high-gluten flour and 98.2 grams of the KAAP flour
Note: Dough is for a single 14" pizza; the soybean oil should be allocated as follows: 3.9 grams of the soybean oil in the dough and 1.4 grams of the soybean oil to coat the final dough ball; about 7.1 grams (about 2 teaspoons) of yellow cornmeal (defatted) should be used on and in the final dough ball/skin; bowl residue compensation = 1.5%

There is another point that I believe should be mentioned. That point relates to sugar. Normally, for a dough that is to cold ferment for 2-3 days there is no need to add any sugar to the dough, either for purposes of feeding the yeast or for crust coloration purposes. And, as you know, Papa Gino's does not add any sugar to its dough. That can mean that PG does not cold ferment its dough beyond 3 days but it can also be a way of achieving a finished crust that is fairly light in color, because of reduced residual sugar at the time of baking. I'd like you to use the above PG clone dough formulation as given, to see what you get in the way of results. If you like the results but need more crust coloration, then that is something that can be addressed for a future iteration of the PG clone dough.

I have tried to make this post as complete as possible, at the risk of repeating myself, so that you and other users have everything in one place. However, it should be kept in mind that the above PG clone dough formulation is intended for an application where the fermentation period is about 100 hours (a bit over 4 days).

Peter


Offline norma427

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #345 on: October 11, 2012, 10:43:38 AM »
Norma,

I have set forth below the revised PG clone dough formulation. As you will note, it does not vary very much from the PG clone dough formulation that you last used and that I previously set forth at Reply 267 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg213221.html#msg213221. To greatly simplify the calculations, I assumed that you used a fermentation temperature of 40 degrees F for the reference standard you established by your last PG clone dough (a doubling in volume after 60 hours). For my calculations, I used the same temperature to come up with the revised PG clone dough formulation set forth below. The main difference is that I used 100 hours as the desired fermentation period (measured from 11:00AM on Friday to 3:00PM on the following Tuesday) instead of the 60 hours (2 1/2 days) that it took your last PG clone dough to double in volume. When the dust settled, the amount of IDY I came up with for the PG clone dough formulation set forth below is 0.21% (60/100 x 0.35%). As you might expect, because of all of the possible variations in temperature over 100 hours, even minor ones, at some point it may be necessary or desirable to tweak the amount of IDY for your particular application. But, first, we have to see how well the 0.21% IDY works out.

For the latest iteration of the PG clone dough formulation, I assumed that you might use the Kyrol/KAAP (King Arthur All-Purpose) flour blend again. The amounts of those two flours are set forth below. I used the Mixed Mass Percentage Calculator at http://foodsim.unclesalmon.com/ to calculate those quantities, based on a protein content for the blend of 13.2%, which is the same as the protein content of the Spring King flour. In that calculator, I used 14% for the protein content of the Kyrol flour and 11.7% for the protein content of the KAAP.

I also noted how much of the formula oil should go into the dough itself and how much should go on the surface of the dough ball, using the methodology set forth in Reply 61 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg40104.html#msg40104 and using the cube root calculator at http://www.calculatorpro.com/calculator/cube-root-calculator/. As before, I also note the amount of the yellow cornmeal (defatted) that should be worked into the dough ball (at 2.5% of the formula flour).

Using the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html, I came up with the following PG clone dough formulation:

Norma's 100-Hr, 40 Degrees F PG Clone Dough Formulation
Spring King Flour or Kyrol/KAAP Blend* (100%):
Water (59%):
IDY (0.21%):
Salt (2%):
Vegetable (Soybean) Oil (1.9%):
Total (163.11%):
282.27 g  |  9.96 oz | 0.62 lbs
166.54 g  |  5.87 oz | 0.37 lbs
0.59 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.2 tsp | 0.07 tbsp
5.65 g | 0.2 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.01 tsp | 0.34 tbsp
5.36 g | 0.19 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.18 tsp | 0.39 tbsp
460.4 g | 16.24 oz | 1.01 lbs | TF = N/A
*If the Kyrol/KAAP Blend is used, use 184.1 grams of the Kyrol high-gluten flour and 98.2 grams of the KAAP flour
Note: Dough is for a single 14" pizza; the soybean oil should be allocated as follows: 3.9 grams of the soybean oil in the dough and 1.4 grams of the soybean oil to coat the final dough ball; about 7.1 grams (about 2 teaspoons) of yellow cornmeal (defatted) should be used on and in the final dough ball/skin; bowl residue compensation = 1.5%

There is another point that I believe should be mentioned. That point relates to sugar. Normally, for a dough that is to cold ferment for 2-3 days there is no need to add any sugar to the dough, either for purposes of feeding the yeast or for crust coloration purposes. And, as you know, Papa Gino's does not add any sugar to its dough. That can mean that PG does not cold ferment its dough beyond 3 days but it can also be a way of achieving a finished crust that is fairly light in color, because of reduced residual sugar at the time of baking. I'd like you to use the above PG clone dough formulation as given, to see what you get in the way of results. If you like the results but need more crust coloration, then that is something that can be addressed for a future iteration of the PG clone dough.

I have tried to make this post as complete as possible, at the risk of repeating myself, so that you and other users have everything in one place. However, it should be kept in mind that the above PG clone dough formulation is intended for an application where the fermentation period is about 100 hours (a bit over 4 days).

Peter




Peter,

Thank you for setting forth the revised PG clone dough formulation for me, or anyone that wants to try it.  I do see if doesnít vary much from the last PG clone formulation you set-forth. 

It is very interesting how you came up with the amount of IDY to try for a 100 hour cold fermentation.  I would have thought the IDY would have been lower, but then I canít do the calculations like you can.  When I saw the formulation you had set-forth for Jamie at Reply 198 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg189757.html#msg189757 that IDY amount was 0.133% to have the dough double after about 72 hrs. at a higher fridge temperature.  I wouldnít have thought before this thread, that those differences in fridge temperatures would make that much difference in how much IDY to add for a certain time frame.   

What kind of final dough temperature do you think I should shoot for and do you think I should let the lid off of the plastic container to let the dough ball cool down as fast as possible? 

I was wondering what you were going to say about adding sugar for such a long cold fermentation.  I knew Papa Ginoís didnít use any sugar in their dough though.  Thanks for including your thoughts about sugar.

It might be interesting this time because wonít be able to watch how the PG clone dough ball ferments.  If the formulation you set-forth does work out, I can imagine there would be better crust flavors, but will wait and see what happens. 

Norma 
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #346 on: October 11, 2012, 11:05:34 AM »
It is very interesting how you came up with the amount of IDY to try for a 100 hour cold fermentation.  I would have thought the IDY would have been lower, but then I canít do the calculations like you can.  When I saw the formulation you had set-forth for Jamie at Reply 198 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg189757.html#msg189757 that IDY amount was 0.133% to have the dough double after about 72 hrs. at a higher fridge temperature.  I wouldnít have thought before this thread, that those differences in fridge temperatures would make that much difference in how much IDY to add for a certain time frame.    

What kind of final dough temperature do you think I should shoot for and do you think I should let the lid off of the plastic container to let the dough ball cool down as fast as possible?  

Norma,

The dough formulation I posted in my last reply is tailored specifically to your situation with a fermentation temperature of 40 degrees F and a fermentation period of 100 hours.  The version of the PG clone formulation that I proposed to Jamie (at Reply 198 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg189757.html#msg189757) was based on a standard that I came up with in a test dough, but where the fermentation temperature was higher (47 degrees F) and where the fermentation period was 72 hours, which we believe is what Papa Gino's uses in at least some of its stores. That formulation was also a bit different than yours (it has a higher hydration and more salt and oil). My refrigerator temperature can vary quite widely, usually based on how many items are in my refrigerator at any given time that have to be kept cool, and how frequently I open and close the refrigerator door. For example, yesterday the temperature of my refrigerator was around 41-42 degrees F. That was with fewer items than normal.

With respect to finished dough temperature, if you will be placing the dough fairly promptly into your deli case at market, you might shoot for a finished dough temperature of around 80 degrees F. If you are in a position to leave the storage container uncovered for a while (e.g., about an hour) in the refrigerator, that should help cool the dough ball down faster. But if you don't have time to do that, I wouldn't worry too much about it. You might even treat the dough ball as you currently do with your Lehmann style dough balls, using a food-grade storage bag that should also allow the dough ball to cool down faster.

Peter
« Last Edit: October 12, 2012, 12:06:28 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline norma427

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #347 on: October 11, 2012, 11:29:02 AM »
Norma,

The dough formulation I posted in my last reply is tailored specifically to your situation with a fermentation temperature of 40 degrees F and a fermentation period of 100 hours. The version of the PG clone formulation that I proposed to Jamie was based on a standard that I came up with in a test dough, but where the fermentation temperature was higher (47 degrees F) and where the fermentation period was 72 hours, which we believe is what Papa Gino's uses in at least some of its stores. My refrigerator temperature can vary quite widely, usually based on how many items are in my refrigerator at any given time that have to be kept cool, and how frequently I open and close the refrigerator door. For example, yesterday the temperature of my refrigerator was around 41-42 degrees F. That was with fewer items than normal.

With respect to finished dough temperature, if you will be placing the dough fairly promptly into your deli case at market, you might shoot for a finished dough temperature of around 80 degrees F. If you are in a position to leave the storage container uncovered for a while (e.g., about an hour) in the refrigerator, that should help cool the dough ball down faster. But if you don't have time to do that, I wouldn't worry too much about it. You might even treat the dough ball as you currently do with your Lehmann style dough balls, using a food-grade storage bag that should also allow the dough ball to cool down faster.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for explaining about the formulation you came up for Jamie and also about your fridge. 

I will be mixing the PG dough ball at home, because taking my slightly heavy Kitchen Aid mixer to market is too many problems for me right now.  I still have a one bad foot and the less I lift anything heavy the better it is for my foot.  Right now I donít have any of the food grade storage bags at home.  Maybe I can try one of the food grade storage bags another week.  I would have thought 80 degrees F would have been a little too high for a final dough temperature, but will try to get my PG clone dough to that temperature.  I have my little leftover Styrofoam cheese box that I will use ice packs inside to take the dough ball to market.

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #348 on: October 11, 2012, 01:43:33 PM »
I would have thought 80 degrees F would have been a little too high for a final dough temperature, but will try to get my PG clone dough to that temperature.  I have my little leftover Styrofoam cheese box that I will use ice packs inside to take the dough ball to market.

Norma,

Upon rethinking the matter, why don't you just make the dough the same way as the last one? That was the dough I used as a standard to make the changes in the amount of IDY to use.

Peter

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #349 on: October 11, 2012, 04:35:28 PM »
Norma,

Upon rethinking the matter, why don't you just make the dough the same way as the last one? That was the dough I used as a standard to make the changes in the amount of IDY to use.

Peter

Peter,

Do you mean I should try to get a lower dough temperature with your new formulation using less IDY?

BTW, I did order a pizza mold today, but it wonít ship out until tomorrow.

Norma
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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #350 on: October 11, 2012, 04:51:06 PM »
Do you mean I should try to get a lower dough temperature with your new formulation using less IDY?

Norma,

In Reply 30 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg215284.html#msg215284, you mentioned that you got a finished dough temperature of 75.4 degrees F for the last PG clone dough. Since that was the dough that established the reference, something around 75 degrees F should be acceptable as a finished dough temperature for your next PG clone dough.

Peter
« Last Edit: October 11, 2012, 05:39:22 PM by Pete-zza »

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #351 on: October 11, 2012, 05:38:24 PM »
Norma,

In Reply 30 at
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8167.msg215284.html#msg215284, you mentioned that you got a finished dough temperature of 75.4 degrees F for the last PG clone dough. Since that was the dough that established the reference, something around 75 degrees F should be acceptable as a finished dough temperature for your next PG clone dough.

Peter

Thanks Peter.  I thought that is what you meant, but wanted to make sure.

Norma
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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #352 on: October 12, 2012, 12:52:37 PM »
I mixed the PG clone dough ball so it would be finished at 11:00 am this morning.  I sure didnít get the final dough temperature I had wanted to.  The final dough temperature was 70.3 degrees F.  It is cool in my kitchen now and I used a combination of water right out of the fridge and tap water out of the faucet.  I should have used just tap water.  The ambient temperature of my kitchen was 68 degrees F this morning. 

If anyone is interested in how I mixed the PG clone dough I first added the soybean/vegetable oil to the water, then dumped that mixture into my Kitchen Aid mixer.  I had placed the salt and IDY on both sides of the flour and just dumped them into the Kitchen Aid mixer.  I used the flat beater for about a minute to incorporate all the ingredients and then switched to the dough hook and mixed for another 7 minutes on speed one.  The dough seemed mixed enough in that amount of time.  I usually use the dough that has been mixed with the flat beater to take any extra oil out of the measuring cup and also out of the container that had the water and oil mixture in it.  I donít know if that is what other members do, but I want to try and get any extra water or oil out of those containers.  The poppy seeds were placed on the PG clone dough ball again.  I didnít leave the lid off of the dough ball in the plastic Glad container because I thought the dough ball was cool enough. 

I also wanted to post that I wasnít sure if regular salt was supposed to be used in any of the attempts with a PG dough, but that is what I used.  I should have asked that question before now.

I will be taking the dough ball to market this afternoon in the Styrofoam container and since it doesnít take that long to get to market, I donít think it will make much, or any difference.   

Norma 
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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #353 on: October 12, 2012, 01:15:21 PM »
I also wanted to post that I wasnít sure if regular salt was supposed to be used in any of the attempts with a PG dough, but that is what I used.  I should have asked that question before now.

Norma,

Yes, I intended that regular salt be used. When I specify Kosher salt, I note it in the dough formulation itself. I can't imagine that Papa Gino's would use anything other than regular salt.

Peter

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #354 on: October 12, 2012, 01:36:28 PM »
Norma,

Yes, I intended that regular salt be used. When I specify Kosher salt, I note it in the dough formulation itself. I can't imagine that Papa Gino's would use anything other than regular salt.

Peter

Peter,

At least I did use the right salt in the PG clone formulation you set-forth.  I wonder why many pizzerias don't use Kosher salt, when so many members here on the forum do use Kosher salt in their formulations.  I really haven't noticed any differences in any of the pizzas I have tried with regular salt though.  That goes for the Mack's pizzas too.  I don't even know why I use Kosher salt for market, but never tried regular salt in those doughs.

Norma 
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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #355 on: October 12, 2012, 02:18:40 PM »
Norma,

I think that there are perhaps many reasons why pizza operators use ordinary table salt over Kosher salt. I think part of it is just tradition and custom. Also, Kosher salt may be more expensive. And, because it is coarser than ordinary table salt, it dissolves more slowly than table salt. Table salt seems to do equally well whether it is added to the water or to the flour. Some people believe that Kosher salt is "purer" than ordinary table salt but, as far as I can tell, both are highly processed. It isn't until you go to sea salts that you start to get increased purity. Also, sea salt has minerals and other nutrients that yeast likes and that you don't find in ordinary table salt or Kosher salt. Many chefs like to use Kosher salt, especially post-cooking or at the table, because it is easier to handle than ordinary table salt and it adheres to foods better than ordinary table salt. If Kosher salt is to be used for pizza dough, I recommend that it be dissolved in the water.

As far as the dough calculating tools are concerned, they allow one to select among regular salt and Kosher salt (either Morton's or Diamond Crystal). The conversion factors built into the tools ensure that the correct amounts of the various salts appear by volume in the printouts of the tools. There is no specific option for sea salt in the tools because there are just too many types and forms of sea salt. Sea salt is lumped in with regular table salt.

If you would like to read more about the different salts, you might take a look at the thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4863.msg41202.html#msg41202 and also the threads linked in the first paragraph of that thread.

Peter

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #356 on: October 12, 2012, 05:59:47 PM »
Norma,

I think that there are perhaps many reasons why pizza operators use ordinary table salt over Kosher salt. I think part of it is just tradition and custom. Also, Kosher salt may be more expensive. And, because it is coarser than ordinary table salt, it dissolves more slowly than table salt. Table salt seems to do equally well whether it is added to the water or to the flour. Some people believe that Kosher salt is "purer" than ordinary table salt but, as far as I can tell, both are highly processed. It isn't until you go to sea salts that you start to get increased purity. Also, sea salt has minerals and other nutrients that yeast likes and that you don't find in ordinary table salt or Kosher salt. Many chefs like to use Kosher salt, especially post-cooking or at the table, because it is easier to handle than ordinary table salt and it adheres to foods better than ordinary table salt. If Kosher salt is to be used for pizza dough, I recommend that it be dissolved in the water.

As far as the dough calculating tools are concerned, they allow one to select among regular salt and Kosher salt (either Morton's or Diamond Crystal). The conversion factors built into the tools ensure that the correct amounts of the various salts appear by volume in the printouts of the tools. There is no specific option for sea salt in the tools because there are just too many types and forms of sea salt. Sea salt is lumped in with regular table salt.

If you would like to read more about the different salts, you might take a look at the thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4863.msg41202.html#msg41202 and also the threads linked in the first paragraph of that thread.

Peter

Peter,

Wow, I didnít read all of the posts referenced within the links in your first thread before.  I never knew salt in pizza could be so complicated, but it was interesting.  Thanks for finding your thread to explain more about salts.  Novemberís posts are also very interesting even though I donít understand all of them. 

I appreciate you explaining what reasons there are for pizza operators to use ordinary table salt.  I didnít know before that you recommend when using Kosher salt to dissolve it in the water first.  I never do that at market, but will try it. 

I knew the dough calculating tools allow someone to select amount regular salt and either Mortonís or Diamond Crystal Kosher salt.  I didnít think about why there wasnít any specific option for sea salt in the tools, but too many types make sense.  I saw sea salt is lumped in with regular table salt.

Norma   
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Offline norma427

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #357 on: October 12, 2012, 06:03:12 PM »
This is how the journey of the PG clone dough ball went today.  The PG clone dough ball was taken over to market in the Styrofoam container that is in a cardboard box.  I decided to take the temperature of the deli case to make sure it was right around 40 degrees F.  What I found out was it was at 41.5 degrees F, even though the doors had been closed since Tuesday.  My repairman wonít be able to get to market until this coming week.  I then turned on the pizza prep fridge and tried to get it to about 40 degrees F.  I had problems getting the temperature to exactly 40 degrees F, but it was close at 40.4 degrees F, but I am not sure if it will go lower or not.  I placed the PG clone dough ball in the pizza prep fridge.  I might try to go over to market to try and check on the PG clone dough ball tomorrow.  I had forgotten that there is a flea and antique show at the market tomorrow (until I saw the sign today), but that is only outside. http://www.rootsmarket.com/events.asp  Maybe, the flea market manager would let me go in market and check on the PG clone dough ball and the temperature of the pizza prep fridge.  I know it is important to make sure the temperature of where the dough ball is cold fermenting should be about 40 degrees F.

I found a small can of 6-in-1ís in a cupboard at market today and there is also a can of Classico Peeled Ground Tomatoes at market.  Now I guess I would have to decide which one to use and also how much of other ingredients to add.

Norma
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Offline Kostakis1985

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #358 on: October 12, 2012, 06:30:04 PM »
I went to Papa Ginos last night, when the pizza came out it was a bit smaller then usual. I decided to take a picture of a slice of pizza to give you a picture of how thin the pizza is. This is actually a bit thicker because they didn't stretch it out as big as usual.

 Norma when I was doing the PG cloning efforts I bought some of their cheese and that cheese made my sauce and dough shine. I can't find the cheese they use or any true info on it like brand name anything like that all I know its diced cheese with some oregano in it and the sauce tastes "clean" is the only way I can describe it like not heavy tasting at all.
Jamie

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Re: Papa Gino's Recipe
« Reply #359 on: October 12, 2012, 07:01:15 PM »
I went to Papa Ginos last night, when the pizza came out it was a bit smaller then usual. I decided to take a picture of a slice of pizza to give you a picture of how thin the pizza is. This is actually a bit thicker because they didn't stretch it out as big as usual.

 Norma when I was doing the PG cloning efforts I bought some of their cheese and that cheese made my sauce and dough shine. I can't find the cheese they use or any true info on it like brand name anything like that all I know its diced cheese with some oregano in it and the sauce tastes "clean" is the only way I can describe it like not heavy tasting at all.

Jamie,

Thank you so much for taking a picture of the slice you ate at Papa Ginoís last night.  ;D That slice sure looks a lot thinner than my attempts.  Which one of the sauces I posted above in my last post do you advise me to try?  Do you have any idea of how much other ingredients to add to the sauce?  I think I can see a little oregano in the baked cheese (or is that my aging eyes playing tricks on me?).  Could you see any oregano on the baked cheese?  The cheese on the slice you posted looks great.

Thanks so much for your help!  Did you ever clone a PG pie that you thought was really good?  If you did, what post was that in?

Norma
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