Author Topic: Jets pizza  (Read 86798 times)

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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #50 on: January 13, 2011, 08:17:15 PM »
AustinSpartan,

I don't see the interpretation you attach to the Grande response. To me, "based" implies a physical presence somewhere (http://www.yourdictionary.com/based-suffix). The last time I researched Jet's, there were close to 150 stores in Michigan--open stores and stores scheduled to open. There are around 65 stores open or scheduled to open outside of Michigan. I would guess that all of the stores outside of Michigan are licensee stores. They are in FL, OH, TX, NC, MN, TN, GA, IL, KY and IN. I'm sure that over time, stores will open in additional states. Since Grande has a national distribution system, it would make sense to me to use them for the stores outside of Michigan, and retain the current supplier in Michigan, at least for the time being if there are business or marketing reasons to do so.

Peter
« Last Edit: January 13, 2011, 09:12:25 PM by Pete-zza »


Offline AustinSpartan

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #51 on: January 13, 2011, 09:25:34 PM »
AustinSpartan,

I don't see the interpretation you attach to the Grande response. To me, "based" implies a physical presence somewhere (http://www.yourdictionary.com/based-suffix). The last time I researched Jet's, there were close to 150 stores in Michigan--open stores and stores scheduled to open. There are around 65 stores open or scheduled to open outside of Michigan. I would guess that all of the stores outside of Michigan are licensee stores. They are in FL, OH, TX, NC, MN, TN, GA, IL, KY and IN. I'm sure that over time, stores will open in additional states. Since Grande has a national distribution system, it would make sense to me to use them for the stores outside of Michigan, and retain the current supplier in Michigan, at least for the time being if there are business or marketing reasons to do so.

Peter

The phrase 'based out of' is a way of describing the presence of a company located in a particular area. I'd venture to say this is a regional use of the phrase, and as a fellow midwesterner, I am lead to believe that they mean in Michigan; not outside of Michigan.

As a reference, it may be poor English, but this is how I've heard it used in MI: http://www.dailywritingtips.com/based-in-and-based-out-of/

I can always contact my source and ask directly to clarify any miscommunication in the Grande response. :)

Offline Chippewafan

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #52 on: January 14, 2011, 03:59:08 AM »
Gordon Food Service (GFS) does sell Grande. You have to ask a manager to order it for you. You have to order a whole case. My last order cost $81. It freezes very well.

I use BDoggPizza's recipe for my Detroit style pizza. It come out very close to Jett's.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #53 on: January 14, 2011, 09:30:20 AM »
I use BDoggPizza's recipe for my Detroit style pizza. It come out very close to Jett's.

Chippewafan,

I'm glad you mentioned BDoggPizza's recipe. For those unfamiliar with that recipe, it is the one given at Reply 17 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3783.msg62787.html#msg62787 and as I converted it to baker's percent format at Reply 19 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3783.msg62820.html#msg62820.

From my perspective, the relevance of the BDoggPizza dough recipe to the Jet's situation is that, as best I can tell from my Jet's research, it recites the same ingredients as I believe Jet's uses to make the dough for its square pizzas. Moreover, the baker's percents appear to be in the same pecking order as the Jet's dough recipe I found in my research. Apart from specific baker's percents values, what we don't know is if the thickness factor used by BDoggPizza is the same as used by Jet's. It will take more information about the Jet's pizzas to arrive at what we hope will the correct, or at least workable, thickness factor for the Jet's square pizzas. Until then, there is no harm if people want to use the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html to adapt BDoggPizza's recipe for a rectangular or square pan rather than a round one as was used by BDoggPizza.

Peter

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #54 on: January 14, 2011, 10:15:15 AM »
I can always contact my source and ask directly to clarify any miscommunication in the Grande response. :)

AustinSpartan,

I sent a follow-up email to Grande last night in which I specifically asked whether Grande is the supplier to only the Jet's stores outside of Michigan, i.e., none in Michigan. This morning, I received the reply reproduced below, which apparently was to clarify what was meant by the words "based out of". Here is the reply I got this morning:

Grande Cheese company is supplying all the Jetís locations in the network of pizzeriaís

Assuming that the above is true, and that what Gene Jett says in the video about the cows is also true, that must mean that Grande deals with at least one dairy farmer who provides mattresses and music for their cows.

Peter
« Last Edit: January 14, 2011, 10:33:35 AM by Pete-zza »

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #55 on: January 14, 2011, 08:30:35 PM »
Here is further evidence of the use by Jet's of Grande mozzarella cheese, in Michigan in this case: http://foodio54.com/restaurant/Monroe-MI/39566/Jets-Pizza-Of-Monroe.

I also confirmed that Gordon Food Services (GFS) carries many of the Grande mozzarella cheeses, in various forms (block, diced and shredded). The Grande offerings appear in the Bulk Gourmet document at http://www.thebulkgourmet.com/catalogs/food_kitchen_laundry.pdf and also in the GFS Product Guide at http://www.gfs.com/files/pdf/gms/ProductGuide.pdf, both of which were referenced earlier in this thread in Reply 26 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8247.msg118161.html#msg118161. However, it is not clear whether GFS or Grande handles the distribution of the Grande cheeses. From our perspective, it is not material.

Peter

Offline StrayBullet

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #56 on: January 15, 2011, 11:04:44 AM »
I also confirmed that Gordon Food Services (GFS) carries many of the Grande mozzarella cheeses, in various forms (block, diced and shredded).

I've been buying low moisture whole milk shredded Grande at my local GFS...LOVE this cheese.  One of these days, I'll ask about them acquiring the East Coast Blend :)

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #57 on: January 26, 2011, 11:28:08 AM »
One of our members, apizza, posted a link to an article today at, http://www.freep.com/article/20110123/COL20/101230384/Shortage-of-steel-pans-has-Detroit-style-pizza-makers-scrambling, in which there is a discussion of the Detroit-style steel deep-dish pans such as used at places like Buddy's and Jet's to make their pizzas. According to the article, manufacturers of such pans have not been able to keep up with demand for the deep-dish pans. It appears that Gene Jett is one of the major users of the steel deep-dish pans who has been frustrated by the shortage of the pans, as is clear from this excerpt from the article:

But a very frustrated Eugene Jett -- cofounder of the fast-growing Jet's Pizza chain -- is through waiting.

After promised deliveries didn't come in September or December, he went into action.

"We've tried other pans and (the pizza) doesn't come out as good," he says. So he had the original pans analyzed by a lab in Lansing, found a manufacturer, and is having them made -- right here in Michigan. He says the key, by the way, is the thickness of the steel.

"They're cutting them as we speak," he said last week. And not a moment too soon: Two new Jet's are opening at the end of the month and he's totally out of pans, after giving each of his last three stores only 75% of what they needed.

"The first thing is for me to get my pans," he says; the first run is enough for nine stores. If the manufacturer thinks they'd be profitable, it could put them into full production, he says.

"It took me a long time to figure out how to get them done," Jett said. "But I decided then, I will build my own pans."


To date, I have not been able to find either the sizes of pans that Jet's uses or a probable supplier. This has led me to conclude that Jet's deep-dish pans are a non-standard proprietary product made especially for them.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #58 on: March 29, 2011, 10:23:17 PM »
I tried to make a Jetís pizza dough, but forgot to take my round steel pan to market today. The dough was made on Sunday. I had to cut the dough so it would fit in Steveís 10" blue steel pan. I then had no idea of what thickness factor I was using. I did use a lot of oil in Steveís pan, but the bottom of this pizza didnít get real crispy, like a Jetís pizza is supposed to be.  The pizza didnít really turn out like a Jetís pizza, but was good.  The rest of the dough ball was frozen.

These are the pictures and the formula I used for the attempt at a Jetís pizza.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #59 on: March 29, 2011, 10:25:01 PM »
end of pictures

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #60 on: March 29, 2011, 10:27:56 PM »
formula used for this attempt

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #61 on: March 30, 2011, 08:01:15 AM »
Norma,

As best I can tell, Jet's makes a rectangular/square pizza and a round pizza, using different flours and possibly different formulations. This thread has been devoted thus far to the rectangular/square format. Are you looking to make the rectangular/square pizza but in a round format?

Looking at your dough formulation, it appears that the ingredients are in the right pecking order for the rectangular/square Jet's format. I have not seen or found a dough ingredients list for the dough for the Jet's round pizza.

Also, is there a particular reason why you chose the particular dough preparation sequence you used rather than the one shown in the original Jet's video?

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #62 on: March 30, 2011, 09:35:46 AM »
Norma,

As best I can tell, Jet's makes a rectangular/square pizza and a round pizza, using different flours and possibly different formulations. This thread has been devoted thus far to the rectangular/square format. Are you looking to make the rectangular/square pizza but in a round format?

Looking at your dough formulation, it appears that the ingredients are in the right pecking order for the rectangular/square Jet's format. I have not seen or found a dough ingredients list for the dough for the Jet's round pizza.

Also, is there a particular reason why you chose the particular dough preparation sequence you used rather than the one shown in the original Jet's video?

Peter

Peter,

I did see Jetís makes a round pizza, but I wanted to try to see if I could make a Jetís rectangular/square pizza.  I donít have the right kind of steel baking pan to try, so I thought I would try out my 18" steel baking pan, but since I forgot that when I went to market, I had to find another pan to try. 

The only reason I tried the mixing the way I did was I wanted to see if a lower hydration dough could be mixed just with the paddle attachment, with bread flour. I found out that didnít work to well.  I had to use the dough hook to finish the dough.  The next time I try this formula out, I will mix the way that is shown in the video.  I am not to sure when I make my next attempt if I should use the bread flour I used or go with bromated high-gluten flour.  I donít understand either why the bottom crust didnít get more crisp, with all the olive oil I used, but it still was good.

If you have any other ideas for me to try next time or see changes I should make, let me know. 

These are a few pictures of the dough used for my attempt, that I forgot to include last evening.  The first two pictures are of the dough before it was divided and the last picture is before the proofing of the dough in the pan. 

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #63 on: April 05, 2011, 11:43:42 PM »
I used the leftover frozen dough from my last post and tried another Jetís pizza today.  Since I didnít know what TF I was using again, because it was the leftover dough, I tried my round deep-dish pan (not steel) for this attempt.  I also used more olive oil in the pan.  This attempt turned out much better and although the bottom isnít altogether brown, this pizza did have a definite crunch when eaten.  I really donít know how a Jetís pizza is suppose to taste, but the pizza was really good.  Both Steve and I agreed that this was better than last weeks attempt.  Steve and I gave some other standholders slices of this pie and they also really liked this pie.

Pictures below

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #64 on: April 05, 2011, 11:45:29 PM »
end of pictures

Norma
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Offline jets147

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #65 on: April 06, 2011, 01:43:53 AM »
when i first saw this post i laughed for a few minutes. jets pizza is extreamly easy to make and produce. you need a few things. this first step is how much do u want. typeically if u want to make a lot. u make a four water. which is 16 quarts of hot water. the water must be hot. if the water is steaming it is too hot and u will burn out the yeast. the next things u will need are simple. 1 cup of sugar, salt, and yeast. stir with wisp to make sure contents are mixed well and get and even taste. next is your flour. bromated flour is fine, but it tends to get more air bubbles. i would stick with none bromated. 50 pounds bags of flour we use are specically designed for jets pizza. no other pizza place use the same ingriedents as us. if u want more details on the flour jets email me Kendrick.vandenberg@gmail.com. when the dough is completed is should not be stiff. it should be soft and sticky. the reason for the soft and sticky is when u go to throw the dough out, it is easier to stretch and fit into the pan. now the pans are extreamly hard to come by now a days becuase they have been banned by the fda. now they are only offerd outside the country or threw other store owners. smalls are 12 oz larges are 21 and xtra larges are 31. after put into the pans, depending on the temp of store it takes 30 mins to 1 hour for the dough top rise. (make sure ur pans have corn oil on them)after that it u must "press the dough out" this processes is basically makeing the dough fit to the pan corner to corner. once pressed out it takes about 45 mins for it rise again. now, it can be more then 45 mins if u want. or less. more time u wait the fluffier the dough will be.


I am a manager at jets pizza and i have been doind this routine for about 3 years now, i know it like the back of my hand. jets has rounds too, although we don't sell nearly as many as our sqaure deep dish. we just interdouced a new type of flour, a multi-grain. so far it is not popular.
 honestly it taste like bark from a tree.
 
as for chesse it low moisture skim. shred well.

as for sauce i cant do much for u. we regular tomato sauce as the base. the spice i don't know becuase there is no way to find out unlesss u go to manufatcer. on the package it just says " Spices " there is obviously iregeno and garlics. but which ones i don't know.

do not do your rounds in pans. it is a waste of money to use the pans for rounds. use a round metal screen.

i saw this site when i was messing around. i am always looking for new places to work. so if anyone is a busness owner and wants a person with great pizza expiernece email me at kendrick.vandenberg@gmail.com. and questions email me.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #66 on: April 06, 2011, 06:12:48 PM »
jets147,

Did you forget the corn oil (and its amount) added to the dough (or to the water used to make the dough) as opposed to the corn oil (and its amount) used in the pans? Also, does your store have and use a proofer?

Peter


Offline jets147

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #67 on: April 08, 2011, 11:24:52 PM »
no corn oil is needed for the dough to be made. but there does need to be oil in the pans. yes our store does have a proofer. but we just use it as a hotbox to store orders.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #68 on: April 08, 2011, 11:45:37 PM »
jets147,

Thank you. Before I posed the question to you, I went back and looked at the Jet's video again. I saw dry ingredients in the mixer bowl before the water was added, but I did not see any oil anywhere near the dough. I concluded that the only oil was for the pans. Obviously, some of the oil ends up in the pizza and that is why the ingredients list I saw lists oil. You can't always tell when a video is staged in some fashion or edited to leave certain things out, so I wasn't completely sure about the oil. But you confirmed my suspicions.

With respect to the proofer, I was told (I believe it was a person with the company that makes proofers for Jet's) that Jet's does use its proofers for holding purposes.

Peter

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #69 on: April 10, 2011, 02:13:54 PM »
After analyzing the information provided recently by jets147, I have concluded that that information conforms to the ingredients list as provided at page 35 of the document at http://www.northville.k12.mi.us/district/foodservice/pdfs/MSIngred.pdf. The ingredients list in that document shows the inclusion of oil, so presumably that is the portion of the total oil that actually ends up in the finished crust (or it may be oil that is used to coat dough balls), with the rest being the oil that is added to the pans before the dough is formed into skins in the pans. I was able to come up with a dough formulation and to assess it in relation to the methods shown in the Jet's video at . As it turns out, it appears that I originally guessed correctly on the hydration and the amount of ADY after first seeing the video. I suspected (correctly) that dough hydration would be less of an issue if the dough is pressed into pans, or even put through a commercial roller/sheeter (with any necessary bench flour). I would not have had any idea as to the amount of sugar and salt without having sampled a real Jet's pizza crust.

A few pieces of the puzzle remain. One is the type of flour. I believe that the flour is bleached but not bromated. That means that the flour can be just about anything, including all-purpose flour, bread flour or high-gluten flour. I would prefer that no insider reveal that information to the forum. Also, I have not yet had a chance to study the Jet's Nutrition information in detail to see if that will reveal anything with respect to the type of flour used.

The more significant missing piece of the puzzle is the thickness factor. The value of the thickness factor would allow one to use the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html to come up with a dough weight for any size pan. What complicates the exercise is the fact that the three pans used by Jet's to make its pizzas are sloping-sided rather than straight-sided. I did some quick research on how pan producers who manufacture square and rectangular Sicilian/Sicilian-style pans size those pans and it appears that the dimensions they use are the top dimensions. For example, I have an 8" x 12" PSTK sloping-sided pan from PizzaTools(http://www.pizzatools.com/Square_Sicilian_Pans/30879/subgrouping.htm). It is quoted as an 8" x 12" pan. However, the bottom dimensions appear to be about 11" x 7" (or maybe slightly larger). A further complication is that I was unable to find a manufacturer who makes the 13Ē x 15Ē (large), and 15Ē x 18Ē (extra large) pans used by Jet's. PizzaTools makes a 10" x 10" pan, which Jet's calls "small", and P.A. Products (http://www.paprod.com/pans.html) offers sloping-sided blue steel pans in the sizes 8" x 10", 10" x 14" and 12" x 17". Owners of the latter pans would have to have an accurate thickness factor in order to improve their chances of coming up with a viable Jet's clone dough and pizza.

I was hoping and expecting that member boboo (Bob) would have helped advance the clone project by providing information on real Jet's pizzas, including finished pizza weights and dimensions. After all, he was the member who was most motivated by the desire to replicate a Jet's dough and pizza. In fact, I saw that he also went over to the PMQ Think Tank in search of help (see http://thinktank.pmq.com/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=9214&p=66323&hilit=#p66323). But, alas, Bob has been missing in action on the forum since just before last Xmas, not long after I had developed a plan of attack for him to execute.

Peter
« Last Edit: April 10, 2011, 09:27:01 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline PizzaHog

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #70 on: April 20, 2011, 10:36:02 AM »
This took about forever but I finally found time to pick up a Jet's and take some measurements as promised long ago.
I picked up a small square with peperoni only, uncut.
Dimensions:
Crust thickness at edge varied from 1 to 1 1/4 inches.
Width at bottom 6 3/4 inches.
Width at top 6 7/8 inches
Length at bottom 8 3/4 inches.
Length at top 8 7/8 inches.
Crust thickness interior to the edge varied and was as low a 1/2 inch, showing compression of the dough under the weight of the toppings common on the Detroit style.
Weight of the pie, less the peperoni 685 grams, 715 grams with.
The Jets I visited free hands the toppings and over the years I have noted quite a variance.  This pie was heavily topped compared to the average.  There were as many peperoni slices on this small (20) as I have sometimes seen on a large.  The slices are 1 1/2 inch.  This pie was also cheese and sauce heavy.
And what did I see as I walked in?  One of the pizza assemblers opening up a case of Grande shredded low moisture part skim Mozz.

   

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #71 on: April 20, 2011, 01:02:34 PM »
Hog,

Thank you for helping out on this project. However, it does deal us a setback--at least for now. Some time ago, I was told (by a Jet's employee over the phone) that the "small" Jet's pan was 10" x 10". The dimensions of the small pizza that you gave do not jive with a 10" x 10" pan. The Jet's pan that was used to make your pizza must have been a rectangular pan, not a square pan, and with a smaller overall footprint. It's possible that the Jet's you went to is using an 8" x 10" pan (top dimensions) for its small square pizzas. You might recall from media reports a while back that there was a shortage of the steel pans and member jet147 mentioned recently that there was some kind of problem with the Jet's pans and the FDA. The 8" x 10" size pan, if correct, is available from P.A. Products (http://www.paprod.com/pans.html) and also from Northern Pizza Equipment (http://yhst-14911471596624.stores.yahoo.net/8x10blstpan.html), both of which are located in Michigan. If the actual size pan is 8" x 10", I don't know what that does to the Jet's nutrition data, especially if different Jet's locations are using different pan sizes. It is now also unclear as to whether the pans now being used to make the large and extra large Jet's square pizzas have been replaced by other pan sizes.

Nonetheless, the information you provided is helpful. I plan to study the dimensional data you posted to see if I can divine anything useful from it. I will also be looking at the Jet's nutrition data to see if that fits with the information you provided.

To avoid confusing our members on the pan size issue, I deleted my last post that was devoted to that subject.

Peter

« Last Edit: April 24, 2011, 11:08:09 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #72 on: April 20, 2011, 01:09:08 PM »
And what did I see as I walked in?  One of the pizza assemblers opening up a case of Grande shredded low moisture part skim Mozz.

Hog,

I forgot to ask in my last post. Are you sure that the Grande mozzarella cheese was already shredded? I had read reports that the mozzarella cheese in some Jet's locations is shredded in-store from blocks. I believe that the specs are the same for the Grande block and shredded low-moisture part-skim mozzarella cheeses, and that the shredded form does not contain any ingredients to prevent clumping.

Peter
« Last Edit: April 20, 2011, 08:39:10 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline PizzaHog

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #73 on: April 20, 2011, 08:02:47 PM »
Hey Peter
My recollection is that Jets smalls have always been rectangular.  This last one did appear small to me when I opened the box though!  I just called the same Jets and asked how big their small was.  6 slices (I'm positive they used to be eight).  How many inches?  Approx 10x7.  Now I am wondering if I mismeasured the length or if they are making them smaller.  I was so engrossed with the cheese I paid no attention to their pans to notice anything different.  But unless they recently changed as you mention, at least at the location I am most familiar with, the pans are not the PA Products style steelbaker and I have.  No exposed wire corners and they appear to be heavier and thicker.  Could be another pan in their line though for sure.  I could hardly believe it when I noticed the box of Grande being carried out, opened, and bags of shredded pulled out, no doubt about it.
Still have a quarter of this pie so rechecked and width measurment is correct.  I will pick up another one in the near future and recheck everything just to be sure, and see if the pans look to be newish or diff.  The pan and size thing really has me thinking...

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #74 on: April 20, 2011, 09:19:34 PM »
Hog,

Here is a photo of the small Jet's square pepperoni pizza: http://jetspizza.com/menu/item/23. I believe that you are right that the pizza is actually rectangular. Your photos make that clear.

I also took the weight data that you provided and checked it against the Jet's nutrition data at http://jetspizza.com/nutrition/category/13. According to that data, a small square cheese pizza, baked, weighs 6 x 114 grams = 684 grams. Your weight, less the pepperoni, was 685 grams. So, you were right on the money. A small square pepperoni and cheese pizza, baked, weighs 6 x 116 grams = 696 grams. Your weight was 715 grams. However, you noted that you got more pepperoni slices than normal. Like you, I counted 20 slices whereas the photo referenced above shows about 15 slices. You also noted that they were heavy on the sauce. So, both of those factors could have accounted for your slightly overweight pizza.

With respect to the cheese and sauce for your small Jet's square pizza, can you venture an estimate of their respective weights?

Peter
« Last Edit: November 25, 2011, 11:46:18 AM by Pete-zza »