Author Topic: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2  (Read 2865 times)

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Offline PizzaHog

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RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« on: July 02, 2009, 03:18:28 PM »
There is a lengthy 8 page thread on this subject already, but I was just compelled to draw reference to it here where others may find it.
I have used the MAE process for my last 4 batches of sauce and consider this nothing short of a breakthrough.  The aroma fills the kitchen with wonderfullness, and the flavors released are intense (in the best way) and vibrant.  Plus the sauce just keeps getting better the longer it sits in the fridge.
RN's sauce #2 is very flavorful and quite excellent and designed for easy adjustments for personal tastes.
I just finished up batch #5, and smelling the herbs and spices, my stomach is already growling. 
Thanks RN!
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3735.0.html
I, for one, and grateful RedNovember chose to use his powers for good instead of evil...


Offline Tbombs34

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #1 on: July 02, 2009, 03:40:38 PM »
Hog,

Based on your posts it looks like you use a sauce of drained, canned tomatoes.  The MAE process described by Red November suggests microwaving the spices in water and then adding the spiced water to tomato paste.  How do you reconcile this process with your sauce of canned tomatoes?  Do you just add the water to the tomatoes?  Thanks!


Offline PizzaHog

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #2 on: July 02, 2009, 04:05:13 PM »
Tbombs
The amount of water I use for the herbs/spices is minimal.  The example RN used was like a wet paper towel holding as much water as it can, but not so much that any will drip off if held up by the corner.  So for me, it ends up like a paste but with no pooling of actual water.
Once I have prepped the canned or boxed tomatoes (crushed if whole, boat motored, etc), I judge the consistency.  If I want it thicker then I drain the tomatoes at this point to get the consistency I'm after.  Then add the salt, sugar, and MAE'd spices.  The amount of water the MAE'd spice paste adds seems negligible and does not seem to alter the consistency that I have noticed.
BTW, in my microwave I have found that 2 minutes at 20% is perfect with the paste ending up just under 160 degrees. 

Offline toyman

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #3 on: July 14, 2009, 11:39:57 AM »
I will second pizzahog comments on RN's recipe.  I've been using it for about a year and it's excellent.  I normally use Delallo's San Marzano's, lightly drained.  I put them in my food processor along with the microwaved seasonings and pulse until I get the consistency that works for me.  As said above, the longer it sits the better it is.

Offline BurntEdges

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #4 on: July 14, 2009, 12:49:28 PM »
The MAE process described by Red November suggests microwaving the spices in water and then adding the spiced water to tomato paste.

RN's #2 pizza sauce is my #1 sauce.  I would like to note that his original recipe calls for tomato puree, not paste.  You can take any tomato product you like and make it into a puree, and you'll have great success with this sauce.   Thanks for the sauce RN.

Offline madjack

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #5 on: July 18, 2009, 11:14:12 AM »
I gave this recipe and method a try for the first time last night after seeing all these posts. I had some ripe Roma tomatoes in the garden so I processed 6 of them and added the microwaved herbs. I then added about 3/4 of a small can of tomato paste to thicken it up a bit, since I wouldn't be cooking the sauce to reduce it. The sauce has been sitting in the refrigerator overnight, and the smell from microwaving those herbs is still lingering his morning (I am not complaining).

This afternoon, I plan on using the sauce with the "Generic Chicago Thin Crust" recipe found on this forum, originally posted by loowaters. I'll report any problems, but I think the sauce is a winner, judging by the way it tastes/smells cold. I thought I'd post my experience since I hadn't seen anyone mentioning using fresh tomatoes yet.

Offline dbsoccer

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #6 on: July 20, 2009, 04:47:17 PM »
So PizzaHog, I read RN's thread some weeks ago and tried it on a bit of oregano. I took a small pyrex bowl and pull a small about of spice and just a very small amount of water. Sort of just wet the spice.

I then microwaved it for 2 minutes on low. The water essential evaporated. I figures I was using too much power but have never gone back to try it. But it's great that you have and have had some success.

Can you share a bit more about your technique?

Thanks.

Offline PizzaHog

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #7 on: July 20, 2009, 05:12:18 PM »
So PizzaHog, I read RN's thread some weeks ago and tried it on a bit of oregano. I took a small pyrex bowl and pull a small about of spice and just a very small amount of water. Sort of just wet the spice.
I then microwaved it for 2 minutes on low. The water essential evaporated. I figures I was using too much power but have never gone back to try it. But it's great that you have and have had some success.

Can you share a bit more about your technique?

Thanks.

Hey db
I'm thinking that your test used such a small amount that indeed it was just overpowered, especially if done at full power.
I just follow RN's method as best as I am able.  First mix salt and sugar into the tomatoes.  Then all other herbs and spices are measured into the micro safe small bowl and mixed.  Then I add water while mixing until I get a loose paste, sorta like wet peat but resembling lava, or roux.  Hard to describe I guess but it does take more water than I imagined, it seems like the powders and dry herbs can really soak it up.  Like dummy I never measured but I will for sure next time.  I am just guessing but maybe as much as 2 tablespoons or so for the recipe as written.  In my micro I found that 2 min at 20% ends up at 158-159 degrees each time, which seems perfect as the temp is not to exceed 160.  Then dump into the tomatoes, stir it up and into the fridge. 
I have gone as long as 2 weeks and it seems to just keep getting better.  Maybe give it a try with your normal mix of herbs and spices next time you make sauce.  That way you would something to compare it to.  WARNING:  The aromas released will linger for quite a while and even days within the microwave, so do not do this if you are hungry!
Good Luck
Hog
 

Offline toyman

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #8 on: August 28, 2009, 11:42:32 AM »
I adjusted my RN recipe a bit last weekend.  I took some fresh roma's from my garden and a few cloves of garlic and smoked/roasted them on my big green egg.  I took the garlic off when it got soft and the tomatoes when the skin started to split.  Used the same MAE spices/ingredients aside from replacing the garlic powder with the fresh roasted.  All I can say is wow!  I can't wait to get the Friday pizza's going after work. 

Offline pacoast

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #9 on: August 28, 2009, 09:44:35 PM »
I get superior results with November's sauce using vine ripened tomatoes. By 'vine ripened', I don't mean the insipid supermarket ones that are picked green and gassed at a local produce warehouse to make them turn red. Yes, they might still be attached to half a meter of vine, but they will never have the flavour or sweetness of tomatoes that were not picked until they were really ripe. Courtesy of your local farmer's market or your own garden. Canned tomatoes, even SM's never have quite the same flavour as vine ripe & it seems worthwhile to make a puree from fresh plum tomatoes in season. In the winter, I do use canned tomatoes.

I add about 25ml of water to the spice mixture & cover with plastic cling wrap before microwaving. This works really well, as the spice mixture doesn't dry out. This doesn't make a thick sauce, but I don't find it a problem as long as don't have a heavy hand in applying the sauce. I did try reducing the sauce a few times to thicken it, but it doesn't make enough difference to be worth the effort. I used a surplus bell jar & vacuum pump ($25 from my local University surplus store) to boil the sauce @ 40C. But it was more novelty than anything to try that method.

.


Offline November

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #10 on: August 29, 2009, 10:14:55 AM »
I guess after ten posts I should add a comment.  Thanks for the positive reviews, although I never shared the sauce recipe with a care either way.  I figured if I was on this board long enough eventually I was going to be asked what sauce I used.  I think what is more important to the sauce is the MAE process, which most people have picked up on as being an important step.

Concerning the comments about dryness, yeah, add more water assuming you aren't microwaving it too long.  At a minimum, the weight of water should be about the weight of the dry seasonings.  PizzaHog described it in perfect simplicity: a paste.  Although it should be a very moist paste, because it should still be a paste after microwaving.  There's a little bit of a balancing act to achieve maximum extraction, but I'm sure you'll extract something no matter what you do.

pacoast, expanding a liquid through the use of a vacuum pump is interesting, but nothing beats good ol' electromagnetic energy to rearrange a few atomic bonds.  Part of what microwaving does is denature the pectinmethylesterase enzyme that comes standard with onion and garlic to help prevent your sauce from gelatinizing.

- red.november

Offline pacoast

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #11 on: August 29, 2009, 01:59:44 PM »
Thanks November. I should have been more clear though. I use the MAE (microwave) extraction that you explained with very good results in bringing out the full spice flavour.

The vacuum assisted reduction was just for the tomato puree, before the MAE spice mix was added. It was simply an effort to thicken the puree by removing some of the water content without subjecting the puree to high temperatures.

.

Offline November

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Re: RedNovembers M.A.E. and sauce recipe #2
« Reply #12 on: August 29, 2009, 03:00:59 PM »
pacoast,

Ah, I see.  I thought that since you described it as sauce rather than puree, you were trying to thicken it and extract the seasoning flavors all at once.  Under a strong vacuum the cell walls of the various herbs would likely burst releasing flavor in that fashion.  You would probably need a near perfect vacuum to extract the cytoplasm from spice cells though.