Papa Johns Thin?

[joed]

Hey Pizza Makers!

I've been frequenting this site the past month or so and am very impressed. I hope some day to be able to add to the conversation, but at this point I just have a question! I've tried DKM's cracker style crust recipe and have had great success, but I am now looking for a recipe more like Papa John's thin crust (or Dominoes thin crust, which is similar). I've tried searching the site and haven't come up with anything. Is there a post somewhere regarding this, or does somebody have input on that? Also, would that be considered a cracker crust or just an American thin crust?? Thanks for the help!

Joe

[Pete-zza]

Joe,

Papa John's does not publicly disclose the ingredients used to make its doughs and pizzas. However, when I was researching the Papa John's original pizzas, I found the ingredients list for PJ's thin crust pizza at a website of a company called Joy Foods Inc. That website is no longer around, at least under that name (the domain is for sale), but I was able to find the ingredients list through the Google cache feature. Here is the relevant information in relation to a pepperoni thin crust pizza:

INGREDIENTS:

PAPA JOHN'S BLEND OF MOZZARELLA CHEESE, MODIFIED FOOD STARCH, WHEY PROTEIN CONCENTRATE AND SODIUM CITRATE: Part-skim mozzarella cheese (pasteurized milk, cultures, salt, enzymes), modified food starch, powdered cellulose (added to prevent caking), whey protein concentrate, sodium citrate, sodium propionate (added as a preservative)
PAPA JOHN'S THIN CRUST: Unbleached flour (wheat flour, malted barley flour), water, soybean oil, yeast, salt, natural and artificial flavors (milk), dextrose, calcium propionate (preservative), soy lecithin PAPA JOHN'S FULLY SEASONED PIZZA SAUCE: Vine-ripened fresh tomatoes, sunflower seed oil, sugar, salt, dehydrated garlic, extra virgin olive oil, spices, citric acid
PAPA JOHN'S PEPPERONI: Pork and beef, salt, natural flavors, dextrose, lactic acid starter culture, oleoresin on paprika, natural hickory smoke flavor, sodium nitrite, BHA, BHT, citric acid CONTAINS: WHEAT, MILK, SOY

To the best of my knowledge, Papa John's does not make the thin crust pizzas but they are delivered to PJ stores from the PJ commissaries. I believe that that particular pizza style was outsourced to another company. You can see the nutrition information, including weight information, for a 14" pepperoni thin crust pizza at http://www.papajohns.com/menu/popup_pepperoni.shtm#thin.

I have not tried to reverse engineer or clone the PJ thin crust pizza, and have no plans to do so, but if you compare the ingredients list with the DKM cracker style dough ingredients, you will see a similarity, with the main differences apparently being that the PJ dough does not include any sugar and it looks like it contains milk in some form.

I think I would start with a modification of DKM's cracker style dough but leave out the sugar and add either add some dry milk powder (which is what PJ's supplier most likely uses) or replace part of the formula water with fresh milk in some form.

Peter

[Pete-zza]

Joe,

I forgot to give you the cooking instructions for the product:

Cooking Instructions:

Thaw in refrigerator overnight before baking
Conveyor Oven - Bake at 450° F (230° C) for 6 to 8 minutes*
Convection Oven - Bake at 450° F (230° C) for 8 to 10 minutes*
(pizza may be placed on a baking sheet, pizza screen or directly on the oven rack)

* Cooking times and temperatures may vary, please adjust as necessary for your specific oven. Pizza is properly cooked when the crust is golden brown and the cheese is lightly browned and bubbly.

Pizza may be cooked from frozen if necessary. Decrease temperature slightly and add 2 to 4 minutes when cooking from frozen.

Peter

[joed]

Pete,

Thanks for the information, much appreciated. I will give it a try this weekend and see what happens! My last attempt at DKM's cracker I did a 24 hour kitchen counter rise - no fridge. Would you suggest the same for the Papa Johns? I am still such a novice, I'm not sure what the difference would be between giving it a fridge rise versus a counter rise. I may make two dough balls and simply put one in the fridge and one on the counter...Also - the ingredients call for unbleached flour - would you go with AP for KABF?

Thanks again!

Joe

[Pete-zza]

Joe,

It's hard to tell from the ingredients list how the PJ thin crust shells are made. The yeast is high up in the list of ingredients but that could be to make the dough within a short window at room temperature or for flavor purposes or both. I think I would follow DKM's instructions. Making two dough balls and treating them differently as you suggested would also be a very good idea. The main difference between a short-term dough and one that is cold fermented longer in the refrigerator is that the cold fermented dough is likely to produce more flavor in the finished crust. But, if the yeast quantity is high, that might mask some of the natural flavors.

I think you are likely to get more crust color using the KABF rather than all-purpose flour. But, if you like a light colored crust, the all-purpose flour will help achieve that result.

Peter

[joed]

Excellent, Thanks again. I will most likely make them this weekend, and will post the results.