Author Topic: A real deep dish video  (Read 30313 times)

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Offline DKM

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A real deep dish video
« on: January 29, 2010, 11:20:27 PM »
I've been waiting for this for a long time.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTlChw3Ib9Q&amp;feature=related" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTlChw3Ib9Q&amp;feature=related</a>


A "little" more cheese than normal...
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Offline loowaters

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #1 on: January 30, 2010, 08:22:54 AM »
Good video!  A 10" pizza with 9 slices, probably at approx. 1 oz. each, of cheese total.  I wish I could get a better idea of the sizes of boxes containing the water and oil.  Maybe someone working in food services can give an idea.  I still think the tomatoes are seasoned with salt and pepper.

Loo
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Offline DKM

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #2 on: January 30, 2010, 09:14:55 AM »
Some things that I can glean off of it.

Oil and water volume are very close.

The dough mixes longer than most of us here do (this goes back to what I was told by a former employee of Due's) and is a pretty smooth and double rises.

I'm pretty sure the "extra" cheese is because it is cheese only.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 10:36:42 AM by DKM »
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Offline BTB

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #3 on: January 30, 2010, 09:57:16 AM »
That location in the video is a carry out only store in Geneva, IL (a far out western suburb of Chicago).  The website for that location is http://www.loumalnatis.com/Locations/Details.aspx?ID=11 .  That was a lot of cheese for a small 9" pizza.  I agree with Loo about the tomatoes including salt and pepper.

Geneva Lou Malnati's

Geneva Commons
1048 Commons Drive
Geneva, IL 60134
    630-208-1600

I wonder if Marc Malnati would approve of his employees doing such on YouTube.  Maybe yes, maybe no.  Usually the owner likes to control those sort of things.  But it was harmless and promoted his business.

Here's a YouTube video that Marc did himself in the last year or so at
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH_ymnmarRU" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH_ymnmarRU</a>


Note how the dough rim of the pizza is crimped or pressed up tightly against the sides of the pan.  Seeing it again is making me hungry. 
                                                      --BTB                                  ;D
« Last Edit: February 02, 2010, 07:17:40 PM by BTB »

Offline DKM

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #4 on: January 30, 2010, 10:44:36 AM »
I wonder if Mark Malnati would approve of his employees doing such on YouTube.  Maybe yes, maybe no.

I wondered the same thing but I don't think it is an employee but part of an Urban History project.


Lou's does seem to have the thinnest crust of the deep dish pizza makers.

I have 6 coming for the SuperBowl

The other thing I learned was the two different ovens.  I've seen them move a pizza in other videos but it was never explained it was part of the cooking process.  I anybody know more on that?
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 10:47:56 AM by DKM »
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Offline scott123

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #5 on: January 30, 2010, 11:41:36 AM »
That's right, have the completely clueless young woman who's obviously never been in a kitchen in her entire life put the pizza in a hot oven with a pair of pliers and no oven mitts  ::)

Sure, they got incredibly lucky and she didn't burn herself, but was it necessary to put the audience through that?

Offline vcb

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2010, 12:17:04 PM »
I don't think they use pepper in the tomatoes, but it's quite possible that there's some salt from the canned tomatoes they use.

As for the measurements on the plastic boxes, I tried to sharpen a still image from the oil pour.
That container had visible measurement markings in quarts. I'm pretty sure the second mark says 4qt, but the top measurement is hard to read.
Could that top measurement be reading 6 or 8 qt?

Also, are we assuming that they are using some proprietary flour blend in a 25 lb industry size bag?

Good video!  A 10" pizza with 9 slices, probably at approx. 1 oz. each, of cheese total.  I wish I could get a better idea of the sizes of boxes containing the water and oil.  Maybe someone working in food services can give an idea.  I still think the tomatoes are seasoned with salt and pepper.

Loo
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 12:39:03 PM by vcb »
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Offline FLAVORMAN

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2010, 02:40:51 PM »
I was amazed at the h2o/oil ratio. It almost looked like 50/50. I would guess the weight of the bag of special flour blend was 30#. Special blend years ago was done in Indiana. I wish I remembered the name of the place. When I first started making deep dish back in the early 80's I had an employee who worked for Lou's in Wheeling part time and got me a bag. I have come a long way since then. Sure wish I had some left to see what really is in it just for fun.

Offline loowaters

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2010, 03:02:49 PM »
I think the containers were different sizes with the water box being larger than the oil box.  I also didn't get moving the pie to the top oven to finish the cook. 

I didn't understand why she didn't just grab the cold pan and toss the pie in the oven bare handed without the clamper grip.  What harm would she do? 

I don't think that was a whole lot of cheese.  If they are 1 oz. slices that makes for 9 oz. of cheese and Malnati mentioned in the Bobby Flay Throwdown something like a half pound of cheese on the pies and he was making 10" pizzas at the time.  I'm going with the 1 oz. slice theory based on a Food Network Al Roker stop at My Pi in Chicago where they mentioned 1 oz. slices of cheese.  Makes sense and easy to track portions.

Ed, I think you're right.  No pepper in the sauce.

Edit:  Upon further review it looks like the water is in a container much larger than that of the oil.  The water container has a handle to grab on the side while the oil did not.

I'm working on this caramelized crust Burt's/Pequod's type of pie again tonight but after seeing this I'm wishing I had done some Malnati's clone dough.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 03:25:41 PM by loowaters »
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Offline mrmojo1

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2010, 04:01:51 PM »
awesome video!! thank you!!  i love watching these things!!! 


Offline BTB

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2010, 04:34:33 PM »
Quote
Lou's does seem to have the thinnest crust of the deep dish pizza makers.

Not quite.  Marc's Uncle, Rudy, who owns Pizano's has the thinnest deep dish pizza that I've ever seen.  And they've got high reviews and accolades.  Their pizzas are my daughters favorite in Chicago and I've eaten at the loop and near north side locations a couple of times and they are very impressive.  And supposedly they are Oprah's favorite pizza when in Chicago.  Different from, yet similar to, Lou Malnati's.  See http://www.pizanoschicago.com/

Quote
I have 6 coming for the SuperBowl

We must have received the same email offer and I think I'm going to order 6, too.

Loo, I hadn't seen Malnati's make a 10" pizza as their small is 9" and the next size up is 12".  Pizano's small is a 10" tho.  Where did you see the 10" size?  I'll have to look at that throwdown show again.

Whenever I used to peek inside a Malnati's kitchen, I noticed that the metal pan grippers were standard use equipment.  But I don't know why they should be used for a cold pan either.
                                                                                                     --BTB                      ???

« Last Edit: February 02, 2010, 07:18:33 PM by BTB »

Offline loowaters

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #11 on: January 30, 2010, 05:06:20 PM »
BTB, I thought his small was a 10" but watching the Throwdown piece (your posted link in reply #3) it looks like they are 9".  Without doing any research I may have crossed up Gino's East and their small being 10".

Loo
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Offline vcb

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #12 on: January 30, 2010, 05:52:33 PM »
Crust thickness sometimes varies on a Lou Malnati's pie. I just had a slice yesterday at lunch time (we had some delivered to the office) and the crust was a bit puffier than usual and was about a half inch thick. About 2 weeks ago, I had Lou's at their flagship location in Lincolnwood for dinner and the crust was closer to the 1/8" or 1/4" thickness we usually see.  It probably is because the pizza dough is all pressed out into the pan by hand that we see variations, especially during a lunch rush.

I also noticed in the video they piled on a lot of cheese in the center of that pizza.
I think they use more cheese on a plain cheese pizza than on the other pizzas.

Yes, Pizano's is similar to Lou Malnati's (not surprising due to Rudy being Lou's brother), but does have a few distinct differences.
Pizano's seems to have a good amount of garlic in their italian sausage where Lou's isn't as heavily seasoned and, as far as I can tell, has no garlic in it. Pizano's crust tastes a little different (could be more olive oil?) and from what I can remember from my last visit from this past summer, has a bit lighter and crispier crust.

I'll bet when they're heavy in a lunch or dinner rush, they're tossing the cold pans into the oven without the grippers.

Not quite.  Mark's Uncle, Rudy, who owns Pizano's has the thinnest deep dish pizza that I've ever seen.  And they've got high reviews and accolades.  Their pizzas are my daughters favorite in Chicago and I've eaten at the loop and near north side locations a couple of times and they are very impressive.  And supposedly they are Oprah's favorite pizza when in Chicago.  Different from, yet similar to, Lou Malnati's.  See http://www.pizanoschicago.com/
We must have received the same email offer and I think I'm going to order 6, too.

Loo, I hadn't seen Malnati's make a 10" pizza as their small is 9" and the next size up is 12".  Pizano's small is a 10" tho.  Where did you see the 10" size?  I'll have to look at that throwdown show again.

Whenever I used to peek inside a Malnati's kitchen, I noticed that the metal pan grippers were standard use equipment.  But I don't know why they should be used for a cold pan either.
 --BTB 
-- Ed Heller -aka- VCBurger -- Real Deep Dish - Deep Dish 101
http://www.realdeepdish.com/
http://facebook.com/realdeepdish/
http://virtualcheeseblogger.com/

Offline FLAVORMAN

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #13 on: January 30, 2010, 05:53:55 PM »
Hey Loo
I think those are 3 gallon buckets...over that size I don't think they could throw them around like in the video...this could be fun...I really think the h20/oil is really close...should I try one with much more oil...oh what the heck I will try if my wife lets me..I agree no pepper in the sauce..what do you think Pete and BTB

Online Pete-zza

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #14 on: January 30, 2010, 07:53:16 PM »
According to the Malnati's menu at http://www.loumalnatis.com/Menu/restaurant-bar.aspx, there are four sizes for their deep-dish pizzas: 6", 9", 12" and 14". We also know from http://www.tastesofchicago.com/category/Lou_Malnatis_Pizza that it is the 9" pizza that is shipped frozen. As noted in that link, the "Lou Malnati's pizzas are made according to the family's original five-decade-old deep dish pizza recipe. All pizzas are hand-made from scratch, baked and quickly frozen to preserve their hot out of the oven freshness." I mention this last statement because the only ingredients list and nutrition information I have been able to find is for the 9" frozen deep-dish pizza. For example, the ingredients for the crust, mozzarella cheese, sauce and grated cheese topping are as follows:

Crust: flour, water, corn oil, olive oil, yeast;
Mozzarella cheese (pasteurized part-skim milk, culture, salt, enzyme);
Sauce: tomatoes, tomato puree, salt, citric acid;
Romano cheese (part skim sheep’s milk, part-skim cow’s milk, cheese cultures, salt, enzymes, sodium aluminocilicate (anti-caking agent), oregano
.
(see Reply 2 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7467.msg64252.html#msg64252)

As noted above, the only dry ingredient other than the flour used to make the dough is yeast. That suggests that what is shown in the video in the mixer bowl before the water and oils are added is the yeast. No salt and no sugar. I would guess that the yeast is IDY. If it were ADY, that would normally require using water at around 105 degrees F and allowing the yeast to hydrate for several minutes. As shown in video, the gal simply stirred the yeast/water mixture for only a few seconds. I also agree with Loo that the two containers for the water and oils (the corn oil/olive oil blend) are of different sizes, and I do not believe that the oils and water are used in equal quantities. I say this because it would make more sense to use just one type of container if the oils and water are to be used in equal volumes, to minimize employee error, and also because I cannot recall ever seeing a deep-dish dough formulation where the oil and water, which do not differ materially in weight, are about the same, either by volume or by weight. 

As has been noted, there is no black pepper in the sauce. With respect to the mozzarella cheese, it is possible that Malnati's does its own slicing from bricks, but according to nutritiondata.com, at http://www.nutritiondata.com/facts/dairy-and-egg-products/28/2, one slice of part-skim low-moisture mozzarella cheese weighs one ounce. So, Loo's assumption of one ounce per slice seems plausible. On this basis, the nine slices of cheese shown in the video (five slices on the bottom and four slices on the top) would suggest a total of nine ounces.

If we now look at the nutrition data for a 9" cheese deep-dish pizza (baked and frozen), as given at http://www.tastesofchicago.com/downloads/Nutritional%20info.pdf, one can calculate the weight of such a pizza as 6 x 113 grams = 678 grams, or 23.92 ounces. In my experience, a deep-dish loses less weight, by percent, during baking than other types of pizzas. I would say maybe 4%. That would translate into an unbaked pizza of about 25 ounces. I will leave to others to estimate how much sauce is used for the pizza in the video, but with that figure and assuming nine ounces of sliced mozzarella cheese, it should be possible to come up with an estimate of the dough ball weight for that pizza. The Romano cheese (which the gal in the video thought was Parmesan cheese) and the oregano (which it looks like was omitted) should weigh very little. Does 9-10 ounces of dough for a 9" pizza sound plausible?

Peter


Offline loowaters

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #15 on: January 30, 2010, 08:32:09 PM »
Peter, in regards to dough ball weight, 9-10 seems a little light.  While I'm no authority on this, or at least no more in the know than others, I've been using a .12 thickness factor for my Malnati's clone and that comes to 11.9 oz. for a 9" pie.  I realize their crust isn't real thick but .12 isn't too thick, either.  That's 21 oz. of, I'm assuming cooked, weight for dough and cheese leaving x for sauce.  Hey, you found errors in Home Run Inn's nutritional info...

Loo
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Offline loowaters

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #16 on: January 30, 2010, 08:44:39 PM »
I just had a slice yesterday at lunch time (we had some delivered to the office) and the crust was a bit puffier than usual and was about a half inch thick.

Ed, I just want to say thanks for being in the trenches and doing some of the grunt work for us, you know, getting your hands dirty, from the epicenter of Chicago Style pizza.  ;D  Too many of us must do it from afar.

Loo
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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #17 on: January 30, 2010, 08:46:04 PM »
Loo,

Maybe it is possible that the pizza shown in the video was not a "regulation" cheese deep-dish pizza from the standpoint of the amount of cheese. Or possibly the Malnati slices are thinner than we speculate. Can you, or anyone else, venture a guess on the amount of sauce used for the pizza in the video?

Peter

Offline loowaters

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #18 on: January 30, 2010, 09:04:11 PM »
Venturing a guess...6-8 ounces.  I haven't weighed any sauce in so long and I'm constantly changing what I'm doing with it (draining, not draining, adding more puree) and what kind of coverage I get based on how I've remove/retained water, my own personal experiences wouldn't help much.  If they use a 12 oz. dough for a 9" with, we'll call it 8 oz. of cheese, and say a light hand on the sauce for 6 oz.  That makes for a 26 oz. pie.  Can you lose 2.08 oz. in the bake?

Loo
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Offline vcb

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Re: A real deep dish video
« Reply #19 on: January 30, 2010, 09:20:52 PM »
Ed, I just want to say thanks for being in the trenches and doing some of the grunt work for us, you know, getting your hands dirty, from the epicenter of Chicago Style pizza.  ;D  Too many of us must do it from afar.

Loo


Happy to make the 'sacrifice' for food science. :-)

Speaking of...
I located the clear plastic container they're using for the oil.
They are Cambro CamSquares: http://www.reliablepaper.com/CamSquares_Camwear_Clear_Food_Container_6_qt_p/cmc6sfscw.htm

   UPDATE:
..     After further review, I think the container might actually be a Carlisle brand. I noticed the handles on replay.
..     http://www.webstaurantstore.com/carlisle-10722-6-qt-clear-square-carlisle-storplus-container/27110722.html

So the one that they used for oil is definitely a 6qt.

Not sure if the water container was the same size or not because we don't see a label when they pour that one and it seems to be slightly different from the Cambro, not having an extended top lip, like we see between the 4 and 6 qt mark.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2010, 09:30:23 PM by vcb »
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