Author Topic: Wood Proofing Box  (Read 9968 times)

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Offline shuboyje

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #25 on: March 20, 2010, 04:13:36 PM »
Did you ever try the damp towel in place of the lid on your box?  I am in michigan with considerably higher humidity, but with it being heating season here my house is dry and this method was the answer for me when I began to have the same issues.  I'd hate to see you do something fancy to get humidity if something easy would do the trick.
-Jeff


Offline Bob1

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #26 on: March 20, 2010, 04:46:38 PM »
Just a side note for anyone who feels their house is to dry.  I grew up with baseboard heat and found forced hot air to be brutal.  I installed an April Aire whole house humidifier about 15 years ago and have found it very good.  I do not think I would have lasted another year without it.  Humidifiers can be a lot of maintenance and a breeding ground for bacteria, but one type is not.  It uses fresh water that flows over a honeycoombe when called for.  The water then goes out to a drain so there is no chance for stagnation.  I beleive Home Depot sells a Honeywell that is the same type.  It only takes an hour or two to install, and for about $200 it is a good investment for comfort.

http://www.aprilaire.com/index.php?znfAction=ProductDetails&category=5&item=700

http://www.homedepot.com/h_d1/N-5yc1vZ1xgy/R-100344604/h_d2/ProductDisplay?langId=-1&storeId=10051&catalogId=10053


Bob

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #27 on: March 20, 2010, 06:02:58 PM »
I haven't tried the damp towel because I couldn't find one big enough. The only ones that are big enough to go over the box would be the ones that we use for drying off after a shower and I don't think my mom would like that. I'm going to try the flour and oil on top and see how that works and go from there. I still don't get how the Neapolitan pizzerias would keep theirs from drying without oil or flour on top. Maybe I should make a new lid that is more air tight.

Offline Matthew

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #28 on: March 20, 2010, 06:41:19 PM »
I haven't tried the damp towel because I couldn't find one big enough. The only ones that are big enough to go over the box would be the ones that we use for drying off after a shower and I don't think my mom would like that. I'm going to try the flour and oil on top and see how that works and go from there. I still don't get how the Neapolitan pizzerias would keep theirs from drying without oil or flour on top. Maybe I should make a new lid that is more air tight.

I picked up undeyed & unbleached 100% cotton fabric from Ikea for $1.99/metre.

Offline Essen1

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #29 on: March 20, 2010, 06:49:44 PM »
I agree with Matt. The towel shouldn't be that hard to find and it's a good thing to have for cases like this one.  :)

Anyway, why only 3 hrs? I don't think wooden dough boxes were really designed for longer periods of proofing/fermentation. I noticed that if I have the dough in a WDB for more than 3 hrs the bottom of the dough ball becomes too dry and the end result is a bottom crust that's way to crunchy and charred, since the wood absorbs most of the moisture from the dough. You can see the wet spot on the wood when you take the dough ball out.

Mike

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Offline bakerbill

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #30 on: March 20, 2010, 08:53:51 PM »
I've also been concerned with the seal on a wooden box. (At one point I made a wooden box but was not happy with it. )
My alternative, which works well, is to place a pine board in the bottom of a plastic container with a tight seal. It provides the benefit of the wood along with a tight fit.

bakerbill

Offline GotRocks

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #31 on: March 20, 2010, 09:49:55 PM »
What do you think would happen if you went really low-tech and just got got the wood wet enough to add the needed moisture to the atmosphere inside of the box?
Can you soak the lid? or pour water into the box until a good amount is absorbed, pour out the excess and rely on that to keep the dough from drying? Maybe use a pastry cloth to seprate the dough from the box then too?
A skinny cook is not to be trusted!

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #32 on: March 20, 2010, 10:02:05 PM »
The board on the bottom will warp if I use that much water. I used water on a peel I got from BBB the other day and it warped in like an hour, it just bowed and a crack down middle. I'll figure it out, I am a real trial and error person, I never get it right the first time or the tenth...

Offline Bob1

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #33 on: March 20, 2010, 10:23:54 PM »
I have no experience using a wood box for ferments but I thought the whole idea is to use the wood to suck some moisture out of the ball for a crisp crust.  I would think that if you put a cup of water in the box and covered the whole box with a plastic trash bag, the balls would still wick out the bottom, and still have enough humidity to be moist on the top.

Bob


Offline GotRocks

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #34 on: March 21, 2010, 10:00:26 AM »
The board on the bottom will warp if I use that much water. I used water on a peel I got from BBB the other day and it warped in like an hour, it just bowed and a crack down middle. I'll figure it out, I am a real trial and error person, I never get it right the first time or the tenth...

I agree, a peel will be destroyed if it gets wet. But if you make a box out a decent wood that can handle dampness, this should work if you are having drying problems.
White cedar comes to mind, I think red cedar would be too aromatic and create some flavor problems or it may even add to the flavor in a good way.

Or a guy could use any decent wood for the box,  seal it with a food-grade oil and do the lid out of cedar. hard maple should hold up to being damp too.
A skinny cook is not to be trusted!

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #35 on: March 21, 2010, 10:25:59 AM »
The lid is made from birch and the box is poplar.

Offline andreguidon

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #36 on: March 21, 2010, 10:29:13 AM »
the boxes get better with time, cause the flour starts to fill the tiny spaces in the wood, blocking all the contact with external air... but the top has to be very well sealed...
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #37 on: March 21, 2010, 10:33:50 AM »
Yea I am figuring that out now with the lid, the lids that come with the plastic boxes are they "snap on" type lids? I'll go to Restaurant Depot and see if the plastic lid will fit on my box, maybe that will work.

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #38 on: March 21, 2010, 10:36:40 AM »
David is aspiring to become a pizza operator, and as part of his "apprenticeship" on this forum he has been trying out all sorts of things, including the use of wooden dough boxes. I believe that he would like to come up with a solution to the dry dough balls problem that will be practical in a commercial setting should he see sufficient merit to using wooden dough boxes. I assume that would mean stacking dough boxes directly on top of each other. If my assumption on this is correct, I would imagine that crafting a lid for his dough box that simulates a second dough box on top of the one he is now using is perhaps what he should be shooting for.

Peter

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #39 on: March 21, 2010, 10:57:05 AM »
Couldn't have said it any better. I wouldn't mind using the plastic storage boxes but if I can get an advantage out of a wooden one than I will use them instead. The thing is in that picture Andre put up of the wooden boxes all stacked on top of eachother, they don't look like they have that good of a seal on them. If anything my lid looks to have a better seal. I saw that video at Franco Manca's of Rafa opening the ball, you can see the box in the back round with the lid on it. It doesn't look any different than mine. Here is the video if no one has seen it. .

Offline andreguidon

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #40 on: March 21, 2010, 11:05:47 AM »
wen doing the VPN training, one of the pizzerias we worked at had wood drawers under the working bench, all closed by a very good door... the dough stayed perfect...
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline Bob1

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #41 on: March 21, 2010, 11:08:46 AM »
It sounds like andreguidon has a good point about the cracks sealing with flour.  Maybe you could unscrew it and use a flour and water paste on all the joints before you put it back together.  You could also make a paste to paint the inside seams also, or maybe use a karyo syrup type mixture to seal.  Just a thought.

Bob


Offline andreguidon

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #42 on: March 21, 2010, 11:10:53 AM »
the wood boxes are never cleaned, just scrape and dust the old flour off, thats why the older ones are better...
"Simplicity is the ultimate sophistication." Leonardo da Vinci

Offline GotRocks

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #43 on: March 21, 2010, 11:25:23 AM »
So this is an experiment for commercial use?

I am curious what your County Health Department would say about unsealed wood being used for direct food product in a commercial situation?
Yes I know it is a raw bakery product, and wood is a preferred material, but some of these inspectors go way over the edge when it comes to many things! and I suspect this may be one of them.

If you run into problems with using unsealed wood, there are a few university studies available that tout the antibacterial qualities of wood and it is suspected there is a compound in wood that does not allow bacterias to grow. The university of WI Madison did a study a few years back and they have proven unsealed hardwood to be more sanitary than plastic or most any other material commonly used in a kitchen. They couldn't even get harmful bacteria to survive on wood and found it would flourish on other materials.

here you go >  http://www.gi.alaska.edu/ScienceForum/ASF11/1121B.html  I'll see if I can also find the actual PDF file so you can download it and keep it handy
« Last Edit: March 21, 2010, 11:30:10 AM by GotRocks »
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Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #44 on: March 21, 2010, 11:33:28 AM »
I can't unscrew the box its glued together and then screwed. When I'm done with the box I use my scraper and take whatever flour is in there out, I don't wash it. I am looking forward to reading the article, if it comes down to the DoH not letting wooden dough boxes to be used then I will show them the article and be like "suck on that bitches" :-D.

Offline GotRocks

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #45 on: March 21, 2010, 11:42:48 AM »
I can't unscrew the box its glued together and then screwed. When I'm done with the box I use my scraper and take whatever flour is in there out, I don't wash it. I am looking forward to reading the article, if it comes down to the DoH not letting wooden dough boxes to be used then I will show them the article and be like "suck on that bitches" :-D.

Here is the study in PDF form to download and print http://www.mapleblock.com/uploads/Univ_of_Wisc_Study.pdf enjoy, I am just glad I could help
A skinny cook is not to be trusted!

Offline Bob1

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Re: Wood Proofing Box
« Reply #46 on: March 21, 2010, 12:06:29 PM »
I if it comes down to the DoH not letting wooden dough boxes to be used then I will show them the article and be like "suck on that bitches" :-D.

Brickstone,
Be carefull with inspectors.  I know in construction it is the Authority having Jurisdiction and if you upset them they can get really picky.  Ive seen them move sinks in the deli department 1" to meet code.

Bob


 

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