Author Topic: Oven temps..pics  (Read 7658 times)

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Offline jcamador

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Oven temps..pics
« on: March 22, 2010, 01:10:19 PM »
Did anyone have to change recipes when increasing oven temps?

I was originally cooking pies in 450f oven with cook time of 10 minutes. The crust tasted ok but it was kind of dried out. Now, I have my hands on a deck oven that cooks at 600f...now it only takes about 4 minutes. This crust tastes great, is light with slight crunch on outside and very soft and chewy on the inside.

So...if we were to increase the oven temp again to say 750f...(which I can't until I find a different oven), would I need to change the recipe at all? The dough is 64% hydration. Thanks!
jason


Offline pcampbell

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #1 on: March 22, 2010, 01:35:54 PM »
looks good.  could you share what kind of oven you are using?  this is like what sort of pizza i would like to make . 

I think that a basic no sugar or fat added flour water salt pizza with 64% hydration would work well at 750F.
« Last Edit: March 22, 2010, 01:39:12 PM by pcampbell »
Patrick

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #2 on: March 22, 2010, 01:51:59 PM »
pcampbell- it is an old..old..old three deck oven. It used to be a bakery workhorse which we thought didn't work anymore, until we messed around with it a bit and got it working.

Here is the dough I'm using:

Final Dough:
Flour:    174.55 g
Water:    93.82 g 
Salt:            4.36 g 
Preferment: 87.27 g
Total:    360 g

jason

Offline sconosciuto

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #3 on: March 22, 2010, 08:20:29 PM »
Jason,

Very nice looking pies.  Crumb looks fantastic.  I have a few questions not really related to your original question.  Other than the deck oven, have you changed any other things in your process?  Are you cooking the same day since you are using the preferment?  I think you had mentioned before that you were kneading by hand employing a stretch and fold, is that still the case?

Perhaps some others who have the pleasure of using a deck oven will chime in.  Have you checked the actual surface temperature you are cooking on with an IR thermometer?  (I assume you are cooking directly on the deck not using screens)

I'm very jealous now, if only I could sneak a brick or deck oven in my apartment....... :(

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #4 on: March 22, 2010, 09:07:31 PM »
Thanks sconosciuto! I've only changed a few things in the process..40% sourdough starter to flour weight, only three hours bulk ferment, with only one or two folds, then scaled and into the fridge for about 16 hours or so. I started using the mixer and I'm liking the results so far, although I do touch it by hand a little before ferment.

So..this is roughly a 24 hour dough, but it could probably go longer if need be. I like to do bulk ferment at room temp or warmer (75-80 degrees) to get things going, then slow it all down in the fridge for the proof. The nice thing about this is that it doesn't need to proof really before you bake...just bring it towards room temp...so maybe 45 minutes or so.


Funny you ask about the actual surface temp...I have an old oven thermometer in there that stops at 550, and it is pinned well past that when the oven heats up. So...I'm not really sure of actual temp...hasn't been used in a really long time and that might be the reason (calibration seems really off).  I've been using a stone for the baking.

I was really amazed at how it cooked at the higher temp. Before at 450-500 it took roughly 10 minutes and was good but a little dried out. Now, the crust has crunch, but is light, soft and chewy. Huge difference. Your pizza looks terrific already...kinda make you wonder what would happen at higher temps though?!?

You should definitely start building your brick oven in the living room  ;)
« Last Edit: March 22, 2010, 09:09:36 PM by jcamador »
jason

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #5 on: March 22, 2010, 09:59:02 PM »
I was really amazed at how it cooked at the higher temp. Before at 450-500 it took roughly 10 minutes and was good but a little dried out. Now, the crust has crunch, but is light, soft and chewy. Huge difference.

I completely understand and agree.  I was baking at 500F in the home oven and pies were taking a little more 6 mins?  I then moved the stone up near the burner at the top and started baking at around 750F for 3-4 min and the charcteristics of the crust changed dramatically.  Slight crisp on the outside, soft chewy on the inside.


Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #6 on: March 23, 2010, 07:54:49 PM »
A few more...
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #7 on: March 25, 2010, 12:16:14 PM »
couple more...
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #8 on: March 27, 2010, 09:38:50 AM »
trying to keep the middle from getting too thin...
« Last Edit: March 27, 2010, 09:46:23 AM by jcamador »
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #9 on: March 27, 2010, 11:45:24 AM »
no matter how careful I am when stretching...I always seem to get the dough too thin in the middle...the dough just seems to want to be really thin. The crust is puffy, but the middle is more neapolitan thin..whereas I would like a little more depth. Any ideas?
jason


Offline pcampbell

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #10 on: March 27, 2010, 01:30:35 PM »
what is your technique?
Patrick

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #11 on: March 27, 2010, 01:39:36 PM »
i gently press dough using outstretched fingers to get it started. Then place one hand in center and pull from each side without touching rim until I get all the way around until about 9", then saucing and topping, then finishing the stretch on the peel by just pulling underneath the rim.  I'm using 360g for a 11-12" pie...
jason

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #12 on: March 27, 2010, 02:33:18 PM »
The crust is puffy, but the middle is more neapolitan thin..whereas I would like a little more depth. Any ideas?

First off your pies look fabulous.  I prefer a slightly smaller rim and some leoparding on the cheese, but that's just me.   You could try to leave a small mound in the center when you first flatten the ball.  That should even out by the time your done stretching.  I use to have the same problem until I changed up my stretching technique a bit.  I use the same stretching technique as you do.  The only difference is that insteand of one hand in the "middle", that hand is a wee bit closer to the edge so that when I pull the rim out, I'm really stretching the outter  2/3's of the dough and leaving the dough in the very center alone. 
  I find that once I pick up the skin to stretch on my knuckles, again I'm just stretching the outter edge of the skin, the center will inevitably thin out as well. 

Hope that helps.   

Offline hotsawce

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #13 on: March 27, 2010, 06:47:26 PM »
It's amazing what an extra 50 degrees does to make a pie come out like that. What deck oven are you using, and how much was it?

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #14 on: March 27, 2010, 07:34:32 PM »
Thanks Tranman! I'll try the mound technique in the next few days. I think that may be the way to go...my dough is so soft that I don't event really have to touch it to get it to spread! So..I think starting out like you said with the mound, then by the time it's all dressed and pulled into shape, it should be more even with a little more depth. Good advice!

@hotsawce- yeah, I'm really amazed at how things turn out with each increase in temp. To be honest, I have no idea what kind of oven it is. It is super old,  and hasn't really been used for some time. I'll check for some serial number in the next few days, all identification that I can tell has been removed or something...It was bought used when my family started their bakery 26 years ago and some of my earliest memories are of that oven...it was usually being used around the clock baking cheesecake and bread!
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #15 on: March 31, 2010, 12:05:43 PM »
New method from Tranman...left more dough in middle and stretched outer 2/3 or so...seems to be getting better..
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #16 on: April 01, 2010, 09:53:45 AM »
@hotsawce- it's an old "Lang" electric oven...apparently about 40 years old from what I'm told. I think the thermostat is broken because it's going way past the 550 mark!
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #17 on: April 02, 2010, 11:47:35 AM »
ok...this time I left more dough in middle, stretched outer 2/3 to 9", then sauced and topped, then stretched to 11" on peel by pulling under rim...this was my most consistent attempt yet..
jason

Offline jcamador

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #18 on: April 02, 2010, 11:49:19 AM »
few more..
jason

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Oven temps..pics
« Reply #19 on: April 02, 2010, 11:57:48 AM »
Dude Jason, those pies look awesome!  How do they taste?  I had pizza last night, but your pics have me wanting to bake another one tonight! 
  I'm gonna give your recipe a try and post a pic later.  How long are you cold fermenting them for?  Just curious how you are doing your sauce?

Thanks for the pics! Also can you post a picture of your PRE-baked pie?  I'd like to see the size of the rim prebaked and the characteristics of the dough.
« Last Edit: April 02, 2010, 12:08:55 PM by Tranman »


 

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