Thin Cracker-Crust Pizza Recipe

[TMTM]

I put everything into KitchenAid and put it on the lowest speed.. after 4 minutes.. no dough ball has really formed... just in the middle around the hook a bit but around the bowl was just unmixed flour. I took off the bowl and mixed the rest of it by hand. It is a very tough dough to work together by hand.. came out very dry and crumbly.. is this how its suppose to come out? 

I made the recipe posted on this site:
1 pound (or about 3 1/2 cups) high gluten flour
3/4 cup warm water
1 tablespoon vegetable oil
1 1/2 teaspoon active dry yeast
1 1/2 teaspoon sugar
1 teaspoon salt

In a heavy-duty stand mixer (e.g., KitchenAid) fitted with dough hook, add the water, oil, yeast, salt, and sugar. Mix thoroughly until yeast has fully dissolved. Add flour and mix on low speed until all of the flour and water have mixed and a stiff dough ball forms, about 3 to 4 minutes. Stop mixing as soon as the dough ball forms as this type of dough should not be kneaded.

[Pete-zza]

TMTM,

The recipe you followed is the one given at http://www.pizzamaking.com/thincrust.php. Did you use the volume measurement for the flour or the weight measurement? Also, did you add the flour to the mixer bowl at the same time as the rest of the ingredients?

Peter

[TMTM]

TMTM,

The recipe you followed is the one given at http://www.pizzamaking.com/thincrust.php. Did you use the volume measurement for the flour or the weight measurement? Also, did you add the flour to the mixer bowl at the same time as the rest of the ingredients?

Peter

I did flour and water by weight by measure them as well. I used 1 pound of flour and 6 oz of water. I put in everything in the mixing bowl all at once with the flour being last and then turned on the mixer.

[Randy]

I use the paddle, but you are right, to make a ball you must press it together.

Even using the paddle it never comes together and feels, moist at best.

Randy

[Pete-zza]

I did flour and water by weight by measure them as well. I used 1 pound of flour and 6 oz of water. I put in everything in the mixing bowl all at once with the flour being last and then turned on the mixer.

TMTM,

I believe that the delay in adding the flour is to allow the active dry yeast to rehydrate, which usually takes around 10 minutes. However, I don't think that that was a factor in the dryness of your dough. Most members use DKM's cracker style dough recipe at http://www.pizzamaking.com/pizzainnstyle.php, which also calls for 3 1/2 cups of flour and 3/4 cup water. However, that recipe calls for all-purpose flour rather than high-gluten flour. So, it is possible that you needed more water when using high-gluten flour because high-gluten flour has a rated absorption of 63% whereas most all-purpose flours have rated absorption values of around 60%. Also, technically, 3/4 cup water weighs 6.26 ounces. I believe that even Steve, whose recipe you used, ultimately went to DKM's recipe, as you can see from this thread: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,105.0.html. That was back in 2003. See, also, http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,779.0.html and http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4528.msg38014.html#msg38014.

When I practiced DKM's cracker-style dough recipe, which has a slightly lower hydration value than Steve's recipe, I used bread flour (which is between all-purpose flour and high-gluten flour), which I sifted, and I used the autolyse method. You can read about my techniques and results at Replies 49/50 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg49400.html#msg49400. See, also, Reply 52 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg49424.html#msg49424. Maybe there is something in those posts that will be of help to you.

You didn't indicate what you did with the dough you made so unless you threw it away I would be inclined to continue with Steve's instructions and see what you get in the way of results. I never did get around to trying Steve's recipe so I can't tell you what to expect based on personal experience.

Peter

[TMTM]

Thanks for the replies, I didn't wait 10 minutes but maybe 3-5 minutes.. It was 3/4 cup on my measuring cup but I also weight the cup before and after.. was 6 oz. I've kept the dough.. what I did was.. once I noticed it wasn't going to mix together.. I took the bowl off the mixer and hand mixed it... grabbing up all the dry bits and pressing them into the ball. The ball looked a little clumpy/curdly. Light brush a bowl with oil and put in the dough and brushed the ball with some oil. The dough is growing bigger but not fast.

Thanks for the links.. I did some reading around earlier.. should I just leave it out overnight and use it tomorrow afternoon?

[Pete-zza]

TMTM,

I would be inclined to stick with Steve's instructions. Your results might be helpful to others who might want to try Steve's recipe.

Peter

[TMTM]

TMTM,

I would be inclined to stick with Steve's instructions. Your results might be helpful to others who might want to try Steve's recipe.

Peter

Thanks! I'll put it in the fridge then. I can sometimes jump out of the plane and go hmm.. the instructions didn't anything about a parachute!

[Randy]

Yes just leave it on the counter.

Randy

[Pete-zza]

Randy,

I know that some people leave the dough at room temperature but Steve's instructions are to put the dough in the refrigerator for 24 hours, to wit:

Place the dough ball into a large bowl and cover tightly with plastic wrap. Let the dough rise for 24 hours in the refrigerator before using. Please note that I cannot over-emphasize the importance of a 24-hour rising time since it is absolutely essential for the dough to develop its signature texture and, more importantly, its unique flavor! Do not skip this step!

Peter

[TMTM]

I just made my pizza. The dough was stiff but was able to roll it and could only get it to 1/8". Lightly rubbed some flour on both sides and pricked it with a fork (dockers in the mail) on both sides. Put it in the oven at 500 for 5 minutes. Pulled it out and topped it and put it back in for 10 minutes. One side of the pizza was more brown then the other and I preferred the taste of the browner side.. could have cooked it 1-2 minutes more... otherwise it was great.. just like a cracker.. shaking some salt on my slice was really good... crackers and salt go together I guess

[Randy]

Peter, actually Steve ran a thread where he lowered the water below 6 oz after switching to DKM's recipe.  It was an interesting thread.  It is why I use 5.2 oz of water.

TMTM, leaving it on the counter will give a different flavor than the fridger rise.  When you roll it out it will give you the smell of beer.

Randy

[TMTM]

Peter, actually Steve ran a thread where he lowered the water below 6 oz after switching to DKM's recipe.  It was an interesting thread.  It is why I use 5.2 oz of water.

TMTM, leaving it on the counter will give a different flavor than the fridger rise.  When you roll it out it will give you the smell of beer.

Randy

5.2 oz will be really hard to roll out.. does a heavier roller really help?

Beer smell... sounds good... will it have a beer smell after baked? I've been trying to figure out how a pizza has a beer smell after baking... anyone know how and why a pizza would smell like beer after baking? I've even tried replacing the water with beer for recipes.

[Pete-zza]

TMTM,

What I found that worked well for rolling out cracker-style dough is the application of heat to the dough. In my case, I used a home-made proofing box, as I described at Reply 16 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5762.msg49138/topicseen.html#msg49138, but other ways of applying heat to the dough should also work. I found that the use of heat made the precise value of the hydration of the dough less critical, that is, there was more slack in the value of the hydration. 

Peter

[Randy]

We had discussed several years ago the idea that a pizza restaurant's kitchen would be very warm and what effect that would have on the dough but I don't think we ever tied together how it effected the roll out. 

Peter's thread on warming dough before rolling really solved the problem of rolling out a low hydration dough.  I had missed this thread when it originated due to an illness but discovered Peter's thread just recently.  i tried warming the dough a couple of weeks ago and it did make a big, big difference.

Randy

[JConk007]

You cracker looks just fine! You can see here in my first attempt how the dough will not form a ball rather a loose scrappy looking dough with some flour left on the inside of the bowl. http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7592.0.html  Its very strange look and feel after working with NY style and seems like you should add water but this is the way it should look, like a brain after pressing together very little rise in fridge until it gets to room temp for several or more hours press togther by hand, as peter says warm it slighty before rolling out. I have learned to trust the tried and true recipes on this forum and then post and go from there everybody will help you out here is another example of the same recipe http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7872.0.html
enjoy your pies!!
John

[Randy]

I warmed my dough last time to 85 deg.  I think I found that number in Peter's thread.

I had some cracker from the freezer for lunch today.  Yum.

Randy

[mrmojo1]

5.2 oz will be really hard to roll out.. does a heavier roller really help?

Beer smell... sounds good... will it have a beer smell after baked? I've been trying to figure out how a pizza has a beer smell after baking... anyone know how and why a pizza would smell like beer after baking? I've even tried replacing the water with beer for recipes.

i find when i make 6 dough balls at a time i will then keep one or 2 in the fridge and i freeze the rest, after about 4 days the dough thats been in a ziplock in the fridge has a nice beer smell, and sometimes that taste comes through after cooking...i think its the yeast fermenting....the longer i would think the stronger. ive gone as far as a week as long as it smells good i use it, and it indeed smells like beer with the aging.  the later doughs had more of a beer flavor than the ones i used sooner, and i must say the taste after baking isnt strong by any means but i do get a beer flavor and smell.  anyone else?