issues with my crust browning

[c0mpl3x]

okay, so i've made a bunch of pizzas in my oven lately, and the only ones that i can't get to brown are the higher temp ny style.  ive preheated my stone to 550 for an hour, and because my stone cracked and i continue to use it, i use a screen. 

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/c0mpl3x/0722101627.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/c0mpl3x/0722101628.jpg

this is what happens.  cheese burns, crust comes out bland and almost soggy. 

the other day, i did a crust/sauce only until golden spots, added cheese and baked until well done, and it came out BEAUTIFUL.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/c0mpl3x/0806102209.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v303/c0mpl3x/0806102209a.jpg


so what is going on here?  do i need to put a half sheet pan under the top element to stop heat transfer or what?

[Jet_deck]

Here is a visual of the pizzas.  Dam, I'd sure hit that last one.

[Pete-zza]

bbp c0mpl3x,

Can you tell us what dough formulation you are using (including the type and brand of flour) and how you prepared and managed the dough up to and including the way the pizzas were baked?

Peter

[scott123]

bbp c0mpl3x,

I'm also interested in the bake time.

Scott

[c0mpl3x]

bbp c0mpl3x,

Can you tell us what dough formulation you are using (including the type and brand of flour) and how you prepared and managed the dough up to and including the way the pizzas were baked?

Peter

sams club gogulian bakeries cafe 80005 dough.  used to run a pizza shop that thrived off of this dough going through dozens of cases a week.   never had that problem with the dough there in a worn out hobart hec1840, baked at 460ºf with a tunnel time of 5.5 mins  i baked my dough around 10-12 mins the first time, the second i think it was around 15.  dough was proofed the same way, two day thaw in my mini fridge set at 42 (and holds 42-43 constantly) but the dough was the same to the touch/feel and was slightly under doubled.   overproofing the dough does nothing but turn it into a sticky wet runny mess.

[Jet_deck]

This post suggest par baking the sam's frozen dough for 4 minutes: http://forums.egullet.org/index.php?/topic/77282-pizza-dough-at-home/page__pid__1087260

That post was referenced by user Jackitup here: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=7198.0

[Pete-zza]

bbp c0mpl3x,

I remember those dough balls. For those who are not familiar with them, they are frozen. Jet_deck correctly cited the thread where Jon (Jackitup) brought the Goglanian dough balls to the forum's attention.   

Since you have had experience with them professionally, I am not sure that I can offer much to explain why you haven't gotten better results. As you know, commercially made frozen dough balls are flash frozen at very low temperatures right after they are made. As a result, while frozen, the dough balls do not get any fermentation. Essentially the only fermentation occurs during the slack out (defrost) time, which is usually one day, maybe two, in the refrigerator compartment or cooler, and during the time that the dough balls temper just before using. As a result, there are not a lot of fermentation byproducts to contribute to crust coloration, flavor and texture. If the dough balls are not used within a day or two of defrosting, they will become slack and hard to open up and stretch. Instead of throwing the dough balls away, pizza operators who use commercial frozen dough balls will often use them to make breadsticks or something else that doesn't require a lot of handling. Sometimes the negative effects of defrosting can be alleviated by kneading the defrosted dough balls and then letting them temper for about 90 minutes at room temperature. This is a method that Tom Lehmann has recommended at the PMQ Think Tank at http://thinktank.pmq.com/viewtopic.php?p=20525#p20525.

If you followed the recommended procedures for using the Goglanian dough balls, then I would think that you should have gotten good results in your oven. I have made my own versions of frozen dough balls and defrosted and tempered them, and then dressed and baked the pizzas in my standard electric home oven, with pretty good results. The last time I did this is described at Reply 721 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,576.msg62457/topicseen.html#msg62457. You will even note that my dough formulation was similar to the Goglanian dough except for some of the conditioners and my use of honey instead of sugar. As you can see, I got good crust coloration.

Peter

[Pete-zza]

For Jon's reports on the use of the Goglanian dough balls, see http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7263.msg62654.html#msg62654 and http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7216.msg62269.html#msg62269.

Peter

[c0mpl3x]

i think that the dough is just dead in fermentation terms, it doesn't have the poof or spring or crumb that it should anymore.   1" high crusts were common when i worked in the shop.  here is a picture of a (poorly made, but) example of crust rise and cheese coloration.  i even used the same cheese that we used in the shop, GFS primo gusto 50/50 low moisture part skim.   is about 1.91/lb last i checked through GFS rep.