Round 2

[onemsmom]

I'm about to cook up pizza dough balls #4, 5 & 6 from my previous thread (not sure how to post that link).  They've been frozen since last week-end.  I took them out of the freezer & put in fridge Friday night (late) & they are currently warming on counter.  I'm ready (& hungry) for round 2! 

I have not had time to cook up the wonderful sounding sauce that NY Pizzastriver just posted - so I'm using a jar of "Grotto's" sauce I bought while I was in Rehoboth over the summer.  I know that it doesn't belong on a NY style pizza with mozz cheese  , but it's all I have in the house.

Here's a silly little question.....

What is the best length of time to let the pizza cool on the cooling rack before transferring to the cutting board & cutting it up?   I noticed that if I cut it too quickly it was runnier & did not slice up as well.  How long do the pro's wait?

Jenn

[Jackie Tran]

Your previous thread is found here.
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11621.0.html

Just long enough to snap up a few pictures and then cut and eat.     I like to eat pizza when it's still hot but not enough to burn the roof of your mouth.  So I would say less than 5 min.

[Pete-zza]

I'm about to cook up pizza dough balls #4, 5 & 6 from my previous thread (not sure how to post that link).

Jenn,

You can see how to post a link to another post or thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3249.msg27461.html#msg27461.

Peter

[onemsmom]

The pizzas were delicious.  BOTH kids loved them.  The sauce was awesome.  Husband said the crusts tasted even better than last week.  Wow.  I'm loving this.

I did press out the rims this time to avoid so much rising.  I even rolled pizzas #2 & #3 with a pin (lightly).  The rims still rose a lot, but not as much as last time.  I got a terrific "crunch" on the 3rd one, not sure what was different, I may have used the pin more on that one.

Peter, do you think I should change anything in the formulation for next time due to so much rising?  It sure does taste good, so I'd hate to mess with it too much!

I'd also love it if you could give me a formulation for 8 balls for next time? My mom joined us tonight & 3 13" pizzas were not enough. (We want leftovers!!!)

Again thank you to everyone for your help and advice.  This has been a wonderful experience.  My original goal was a "decent" tasting pizza that my kids would actually eat, so we could save $ that we were spending ordering pizza each week.  Thanks to you I've achieved that - and I think they have turned out much better than I ever thought possible.  Plus it is something that my family is enjoying doing together!

I'll post pics in just a minute.

[onemsmom]

A little blurry...

[Pete-zza]

Jenn,

I'm glad that the most recent pizzas also turned out well. That is good to know in case others would like to try making and freezing dough balls for later use. Sometime you might also try freezing a few dough balls up front, right after they have been formed, and compare the results with your most recent pizzas. You might also extend the duration of freezing for a few test dough balls to find out what the outer limit is for your particular refrigerator freezer compartment.

I'm not sure that I have any suggestions for changing your dough formulation, except to suggest that you try a larger size, such as 14". You seem to have a good flour, mixer, stone and oven, and having a digital scale helps establish consistency. It looks like you came well prepared to the exercise and have added your natural pizza making talents and skills to the process. Yeast is only one component of the oven spring equation and a lesser one at that. Using a bromated high-gluten flour with a hydration value of 63%, the Bosch mixer, and good dough handling skills are perhaps more important to oven spring in the final analysis than the amount of yeast. However, if you would like to test out a few dough balls with less yeast, I can give you a dough formulation for whatever number of dough balls you would like and for whatever pizza size you would like.

Before giving you a dough formulation for eight dough balls, please consider whether you would like to increase the pizza size from 13" to 14". You can even have half sizes, like 13 1/2". The expanded dough calculating tool doesn't care.

I know that you came equipped to pizza making better than most new members, with the right ingredients and equipment and apparently with a lot of reading in advance and maybe experience in related areas like bread making, but, if you don't mind, sometime I would like it if you can tell us what information or resources helped you most to getting to where you are today with your pizza making. Maybe we can bottle it for the benefit of other new members.

Peter

[onemsmom]

You have made me feel very good!  I didn't know they had turned out that well!  I think the following things have helped me the most:

1) You!    You were always there - almost immediately - to answer my questions so I could do everything as "right" as possible and have provided a lot of support, kind words & encouragement.  Others have as well, and that has really helped me.  I have long known that if you want to do something really well, you need to ask people who do it really well to show you how!

2)  I am an avid reader & I love to learn.  I can read very quickly & absorb vast amounts of material quickly - especially if I get it in my stubborn little head I'm going to do it.  "How-to" books, websites, etc. are my favorite genre & I go through them quickly.  This forum contains tons and tons of excellent information.  It should keep me busy for a while.

3)  I am a perfectionist.  So, if you tell me to add 4.73478239 grams of something, I am going to nearly kill myself to get exactly  4.73478239 grams.  If you post a link for me to watch how to stretch dough, I'm going to watch it at least 10 times & I'm sure going to try to replicate it exactly.  This serves me well for pizza making, but trust me, causes many problems in the rest of my life!   

4)  I do make whole wheat bread, 6 loaves at a time and they turn out great! - again, because I was taught how & now do it exactly as I was taught, not because I have any inherent talent.  I'm usually terrified if I have deviated from the instructions in some manner!

I'm not really that great of a cook, truth be known, and I can't actually say that I LIKE cooking.  I tend more towards baking, and I LIKE saving money and knowing how to pronounce my ingredients. 

But, simply -  I got it into my head that I was going to learn to make NY style pizza and that's just what I did.

P.S.  Several months ago, I was very inspired by Glutentboy's January 23rd "Tonight's Pie" post.   After I saw that, I was determined that someday I would learn to do that.  I still have a long way to go!  Thanks, Glutenboy!  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7761.msg66628.html#msg66628

[Pete-zza]

Jenn,

Thank you for sharing your modus operandi with us. Sometimes it is easy to forget that who practices a recipe, and with what degree of care, commitment, perseverence and passion, can make a big difference in the final results.

Once you have decided what number of dough balls you would like to make the next time, and the desired pizza size, and any other changes, please let me know and I should be able to give you the dough formulation(s).

Peter

[onemsmom]

Unfortunately, my peel is only 13 1/2" wide, & really only 13" if you don't count the tapered edges, plus I saw what you meant about it being challenging to get the pizza onto a 15" stone when you're new at this.

If you think I can count the tapered edge of the peel, give me 13.5", if not, do 13".  I'll do 8 balls if that wouldn't go over 10 pounds - the max for my mixer.

The next time, I will run some of the experiments you described above & post results.

Oh, and if what you had more meant by my resources/equimpent is the "stuff" & "protocol" I used.......my stone came from Pampered Chef, if that info is helpful to others & it has been used for 10+ years - so has a wonderful, shiny, brown surface.  My electric oven goes to 550 - no convection, I bought the IDY & high gluten/bromated flour from Sam's club, and used the Bosch Universal mixer.  I put my stone on the bottom shelf & preheated for 1 hour.  My kitchen is also quite warm, so that may have added to the rising, both pre and post refrigeration.  I pressed & stretched exactly like the

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjYqw1CLZsA" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjYqw1CLZsA</a>

video & watched every other video clip of his that I could find, I used the "widespreadpizza" instructions for mixing in the bosch: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11621.msg106851.html#msg106851

Jenn

[Pete-zza]

Jenn,

Until and if you decide to get a larger peel, I think I will stick with the 13" size for the dough formulation you requested. I know that there are members who use the tapered part of the peel, as I myself have done on occasion, but until you have tried that method yourself, I think it is best to stay with the 13" size. However, that said, if you'd like, you can take one of the dough balls and open and stretch it out to around 13.5" inches on your peel and see if you can load the dressed pizza onto your stone without incident. Using the 13.5" size effectively reduces the nominal thickness factor from 0.10 to 0.09273. That is actually a bit closer to a NY style thickness and you might even like that thickness better. I personally like using around 0.10 thickness factor for my NY style pizzas, and that is the value I often recommend to newbies, but that doesn't mean you have to stick with that value. So, if you change your mind, you should be able to use the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html to tweak the dough formulation given below. If you'd like, you can also reduce the amount of yeast.

Sam's High-Gluten Flour (100%): Water (63%): IDY (0.35%): Salt (1.75%): Olive Oil (1%): Total (166.1%): Single Ball:

1839.57 g  |  64.89 oz | 4.06 lbs 1158.93 g  |  40.88 oz | 2.55 lbs 6.44 g | 0.23 oz | 0.01 lbs | 2.14 tsp | 0.71 tbsp 32.19 g | 1.14 oz | 0.07 lbs | 5.77 tsp | 1.92 tbsp 18.4 g | 0.65 oz | 0.04 lbs | 4.09 tsp | 1.36 tbsp 3055.52 g | 107.78 oz | 6.74 lbs | TF = 0.1015 381.94 g | 13.47 oz | 0.84 lbs

Note: The dough is for eight 13" pizzas; the salt is table salt or sea salt; nominal thickness factor = 0.10; bowl residue compensation = 1.5%; desired individual dough ball weight = 3.14159 x 6.5 x 6.5 x 0.10 = 13.27 ounces, or 13.27 x 28.35 = 376.2 grams

As you can see from the above, you are well within the capacity of your Bosch mixer.

Peter

[onemsmom]

Dear Peter (or anyone else up who loves math),

I have another convert.  My friend would like me to sell her two dough balls whenever I make dough.  Therefore, I was wondering if you could possibly give me the formulation for 10 balls, instead of the 8 you gave me.  I did click on the aforementioned expanded dough calculation tool, but frankly.....it scared me & I just thought I'd take the lazy way out and ask you.  Maybe someday, when I did not have the very long day I've just had, I will attempt the mathematics myself.


Also, any rough estimate of how much each ball costs to make?  Just a guess?


Jenn

[Pete-zza]

Jenn,

You caught me just in the nick of time. I am going to be out of town for several days. That is as good a reason as any for you to learn how to use the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html.

Here is the dough formulation for 10 dough balls:

Sam's High-Gluten Flour (100%): Water (63%): IDY (0.35%): Salt (1.75%): Olive Oil (1%): Total (166.1%): Single Ball:

2299.46 g  |  81.11 oz | 5.07 lbs 1448.66 g  |  51.1 oz | 3.19 lbs 8.05 g | 0.28 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.67 tsp | 0.89 tbsp 40.24 g | 1.42 oz | 0.09 lbs | 7.21 tsp | 2.4 tbsp 22.99 g | 0.81 oz | 0.05 lbs | 5.11 tsp | 1.7 tbsp 3819.4 g | 134.72 oz | 8.42 lbs | TF = 0.1015 381.94 g | 13.47 oz | 0.84 lbs

Note: The dough is for ten 13" pizzas; the salt is table salt or sea salt; nominal thickness factor = 0.10; bowl residue compensation = 1.5%; desired individual dough ball weight = 3.14159 x 6.5 x 6.5 x 0.10 = 13.27 ounces, or 13.27 x 28.35 = 376.2 grams

I don't have the pricing on the Sam's flour. If you post it, someone else may be able to calculate an approximate cost of making the dough.

Peter

[onemsmom]

Thanks!   Wow - what will everyone around here do without you??? 

Have a great trip!

I think the flour was just under $7 for the 50lb bag unless I looked at the wrong tag.  I can't beleive that's all it cost!

[Ev]

Actually, 50 lb bags of flour like that typically go for about $15, give or take a buck. If you're getting it for 7 that's great, but chances are, you looked at the wrong tag.

[jeff v]

Jenn,

Nice job on your pizzas! I'm glad you and the family have found something you can enjoy together. The time and info Peter shares is amazing-there is even a Pete-zza appreciation thread! http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8612.0.html


Jeff

[onemsmom]

Thanks!  And I am going to go compose something to add to that thread right now!!!