dough too dry

[mooncrickett]

Hello all, when I use the prescribed measurement of flour for my dough, it seems to me that when mixing, the dough  becomes too dry, is the measurement of flour more of a guide, or is it what needs to be used when making dough. in the past i used all the flour called for by the recipe. today i kinda eyeballed it and stopped adding flour when the dough seemed to be getting too dry......   

[scott123]

Mooncricket, what flour and recipe are you using?

[mooncrickett]

Sam's club high gluten flour for two different recipe's

Total Formula:
Flour (100%):    608.92 g  |  21.48 oz | 1.34 lbs
Water (65%):    395.8 g  |  13.96 oz | 0.87 lbs
Salt (1.75%):    10.66 g | 0.38 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.22 tsp | 0.74 tbsp
Oil (1%):    6.09 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.35 tsp | 0.45 tbsp
Sugar (1%):    6.09 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.53 tsp | 0.51 tbsp
Total (168.75%):   1027.56 g | 36.25 oz | 2.27 lbs | TF = 0.090135
Single Ball:   513.78 g | 18.12 oz | 1.13 lbs

Preferment:
Flour:    41.1 g | 1.45 oz | 0.09 lbs
Water:    13.7 g | 0.48 oz | 0.03 lbs
Total:    54.8 g | 1.93 oz | 0.12 lbs

Final Dough:
Flour:    567.82 g | 20.03 oz | 1.25 lbs
Water:    382.1 g | 13.48 oz | 0.84 lbs
Salt:    10.66 g | 0.38 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.22 tsp | 0.74 tbsp
Preferment:    54.8 g | 1.93 oz | 0.12 lbs
Oil:    6.09 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.35 tsp | 0.45 tbsp
Sugar:    6.09 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.53 tsp | 0.51 tbsp
Total:    1027.56 g | 36.25 oz | 2.27 lbs  | TF = 0.090135

and

Flour (100%):    607.12 g  |  21.42 oz | 1.34 lbs
Water (65%):    394.63 g  |  13.92 oz | 0.87 lbs
IDY (0.5%):    3.04 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.01 tsp | 0.34 tbsp
Salt (1.75%):    10.62 g | 0.37 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.9 tsp | 0.63 tbsp
Oil (1%):    6.07 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.35 tsp | 0.45 tbsp
Sugar (1%):    6.07 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.52 tsp | 0.51 tbsp
Total (169.25%):   1027.56 g | 36.25 oz | 2.27 lbs | TF = 0.090135
Single Ball:   513.78 g | 18.12 oz | 1.13 lbs

[TXCraig1]

Are you measuring everything by weight? It's hard to imagine that a 65% hydration dough felt dry.

Craig

[Jackie Tran]

Dryness is rather subjective IMO.  You can get a dry crumb at any level of hydration depending on how much you knead the dough.  Not long ago I made 3 pies with the following HR's.

  AP  85%
  caputo 69%
  BF 79%
I talked about this in this thread..reply #31
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11015.20.html

The caputo pie and one made with BF had a dry and chewy crumb.  The AP was just right (as in not wet  ).  I later found out that I was kneading way too hard.  I was using Richard Bertinet's method.  Shortly after this, Scott123 introduced me to minimal kneading.  Consequently I switched over to a more gentle kneading technique and have been able to bring my HR's down and I get a moist soft crumb each time.  The new HR's I use now are as follows.

  AP ~69%
  Caputo ~ 66%
  BF ~73%

So a dry crumb/crust can be caused by a few factors.  Too low a hydration ratio, overkneading or overgluten development, and/or baking a pie too long.  You can also get a dry and chewy crumb if you bake a BF or a HG BF too quickly (under 2 min).  As S00da mentioned before, the gluten isn't sufficiently cooked through and becomes chewy after a short rest.  I have found this to be true. 

MoonCricket, I would consider one or a combination of the 3 the culprit.

Chau

[buceriasdon]

Ok, Now I'm confused. Nothing new. I thought the original post was dryness in the kneading stage, not a finished product........
Saludos, Don

Dryness is rather subjective IMO.  You can get a dry crumb at any level of hydration depending on how much you knead the dough.  Not long ago I made 3 pies with the following HR's.

  AP  85%
  caputo 69%
  BF 79%
I talked about this in this thread..reply #31
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11015.20.html

The caputo pie and one made with BF had a dry and chewy crumb.  The AP was just right (as in not wet  ).  I later found out that I was kneading way too hard.  I was using Richard Bertinet's method.  Shortly after this, Scott123 introduced me to minimal kneading.  Consequently I switched over to a more gentle kneading technique and have been able to bring my HR's down and I get a moist soft crumb each time.  The new HR's I use now are as follows.

  AP ~69%
  Caputo ~ 66%
  BF ~73%

So a dry crumb/crust can be caused by a few factors.  Too low a hydration ratio, overkneading or overgluten development, and/or baking a pie too long.  You can also get a dry and chewy crumb if you bake a BF or a HG BF too quickly (under 2 min).  As S00da mentioned before, the gluten isn't sufficiently cooked through and becomes chewy after a short rest.  I have found this to be true. 

MoonCricket, I would consider one or a combination of the 3 the culprit.

Chau

[Jackie Tran]

Don you are correct.  I'm the one confused. I ran with an idea in my head without re-reading the original post.  My bad.