Author Topic: how do these guys do it??  (Read 6888 times)

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Offline thezaman

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how do these guys do it??
« on: September 11, 2010, 12:26:09 AM »
 i have a wood oven installed at my pizzeria .it is in my parking lot and decided to incorporate neapolitan pizza into my menu on sunday nights. i make the pizzas in my kitchen walk out the door bake it then serve. i would have my kitchen worker tell  me when the gas fired pizza was 5 minutes from done then i would make and bake the wood fired part of the order. easier said than done . first week it went fine sold 15 pizzas in three hours. i was able to time them and they came out on time and the quality was good. second week i got orders for four to five at a time and couldn't keep up . i was a nervous reck and the pies sucked . the dough was to wet and i had a hard time on the gi metal perforated peels, the dough would sag into the openings and stick. i finished the night with wooden peels an happily shut down after my 20 balls were gone. i was ready to give up, but by morning i was determined to correct my mistakes. i reduced my hydration to 62% and kept my dough balls a little cooler. this sunday went better, and sold my 20 balls out and felt most of the pizzas were good. i never realized how much practice it takes to get good at this and will never put a wood fired restaurant down again for minor flaws in the finished pizza. enclosed are a few pics.


Offline dmcavanagh

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #1 on: September 11, 2010, 01:09:18 AM »
Your pies look great, and no one ever said it was easy. Stay with it, practice makes perfect! ;D
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Offline utahdave

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #2 on: September 11, 2010, 01:14:02 AM »
Lower your hydration to 58-60% for neapolitan pizza.  Don't make it before your ready to cook.  Have a little flour or semolina on the GI metal peel and you should be just fine.  It definitely takes practice.

David

Offline norma427

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #3 on: September 11, 2010, 07:56:28 AM »
thezaman,

Your Neapolitan pizzas look delicious!  :)  Good to hear you figured out how to correct your mistakes and reduce the hydration.  Neapolitan pizzas are another kind of animal.  It always amazes me when I look at wood fire ovens, how long it takes to be able to learn about what kind of dough to use and then also the working with fire.  You did a great job.  :chef:

Norma
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Offline thezaman

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #4 on: September 11, 2010, 08:30:16 AM »
 i ate at a wood fired pizzeria in ft. wayne indiana the other day called 800 degrees wood fired pizza. they learned their methods from the chef that works with mugnaini ,he said it takes 2000 stretches to get proficient at the technique. here is a pic of their pizza.

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #5 on: September 11, 2010, 09:36:19 AM »
Well,  yours looks better!  keep at it.  I agree on hydration try 60  or just under.  Also,  is your sauce spoon rounded on the bottom or flat.  I have found that the flat bottom is excellent for eveness and speed,  not to mentionit doesn't push the dough down into the peel slots.  All in all,  I have swithced to wood peel loading,  and will never go back.  -marc

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #6 on: September 11, 2010, 09:41:36 AM »
I build the pie on a wooden board and then transfer it to the slotted peel.
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Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #7 on: September 11, 2010, 09:46:53 AM »
I think the last pizzas looks great. Were you making more than 1 pizza at a time in the oven?

Offline thezaman

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #8 on: September 11, 2010, 10:38:50 AM »
  the last set of pizzas were last Sundays bake and i did better. i bought the small pizza trays that are talked about in the equipment section of the board. they work well , and they store easily in my over filled walk in cooler.
  the most i cook at one time are two pies. i can get three in the oven.
  when i use the metal peel i load using a shuffle board move, a quick push pull move to load pizzas. does that work for wooden peel use or is there a different method . my wood loaded pizzas can be a little oblong.


Offline fcbuilder

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #9 on: September 11, 2010, 12:05:52 PM »
your pies look fantastic!! I have had the same problem but not under a pressure situation like you were in . there must have been a lot of
 F bombs flying that night. I use the same  gi metal peel and i did exactly what you did change over to a wooden peel and it was just fine. So the next time i was making pizza's i didn't change the hydration levels i just took the dough out of the fridge for two hours instead of 4 and it worked out much better and i was able to use my gi metal peel again. one of the members Matt described how he prepares loading pies on to a peel by staring with a smaller skin puts the toppings on and then pulls the pizza on to the peel then stretches it to the point where it hangs over the peel on either side,then puts it in. much easier this way ,also its nice to have something holding up the arm of the peel when loading the pie's on to it. you probably know all this but just wanted to say i know how you feel. fc

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #10 on: September 11, 2010, 02:30:03 PM »
The last pies look incredible, and look like the Keste pics you posted awhile back. Beautiful job.

I use a wooden peel to set pizza in the oven as well. I make the pie on marble, and then pull it on to the peel that is dusted lightly with flour. I have never had an issue with sliding it onto the oven floor. When you are outside, and it is humid, the wooden peel is essential in my view.

John

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #11 on: September 11, 2010, 06:36:46 PM »
What do you think this peel is made of? Walnut? Or is it metal?

One other interesting tidbit - how the pizza is really stretched over the ends of the peel to form the final size. And Larry, your pies look just like these!



John

« Last Edit: September 11, 2010, 06:38:37 PM by dellavecchia »

Offline fcbuilder

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #12 on: September 11, 2010, 06:52:14 PM »
What do you think this peel is made of? Walnut? Or is it metal?

One other interesting tidbit - how the pizza is really stretched over the ends of the peel to form the final size. And Larry, your pies look just like these!



John


great video find !!understanding the little things are so important , i think its wood that's been used for 20 years! 

Offline thezaman

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #13 on: September 11, 2010, 08:19:48 PM »
that is a really good video. off subject, a customer visiting from Italy was in last night inquiring about my oven. he said that no new wood ovens were allowed because there was because of big scale use of illegal wood . don't know if that is true ,the current restaurants are grandfathered in so they are ok.

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #14 on: September 11, 2010, 08:44:42 PM »
I remember Marco saying they make them out of Mahogany and another type of wood. I had two Mahogany peels made and just had one plained down to 1/2" because they were way to thick. I agree with Marc that wood peels are very easy getting pizza off of.

What is illegal wood?

Offline Matthew

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #15 on: September 11, 2010, 08:52:30 PM »
Quote from: BrickStoneOven link=topic=11821.msg109846#msg109846 date=

What is illegal wood?
[/quote

Coffin wood.

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #16 on: September 11, 2010, 09:04:00 PM »
Oh yea I forgot about that, people who are using that wood are going to be seeing this guy  >:D.


Offline fcbuilder

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #17 on: September 11, 2010, 09:11:52 PM »
Oh yea I forgot about that, people who are using that wood are going to be seeing this guy  >:D.
those are beautiful peels ,I want one!!!!!

Offline ponzu

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #18 on: September 11, 2010, 09:25:37 PM »
I really like the look of your first pie.  I can't imagine how hard it is to mix conventional and neopolitan pies in the same establishment.

What kind oven are you using and how do you like it?

Offline thezaman

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #19 on: September 11, 2010, 10:16:15 PM »
 we have a very different customer mix .we are in a liberal arts college town. our student population consists of a  high percentage of east coast kids, they are very familiar with wood fired pizza. also the professors are very well traveled. so it is very new york to the students . most of the successful in town eateries are influenced by Brooklyn and new york styles of bars and restaurants. my business is 80% town and 20 % students .the wood oven pizza is something they get at home and i market that i was NY trained so they are showing a lot of interest. i am trying to get comfortable with my methods before i advertise heavily with the college.
  another issue is my pizza style is not east cost it is Cleveland style, which is pan style cooked at about 500 degrees.
   i feel the wood oven expands my customer base and gives me options for wood fired appetizers .last week with pizza we did wood fired wings that sold very well.[i partially cook wings top them with sliced red onions garlic butter Parmesan cheese and breadcrumbs. bake about 5 minutes] tomorrow i am going to do corn on the cob a-16 style.
 

Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #20 on: September 12, 2010, 10:35:29 AM »
When you were at Keste did you work during business hours? If you were did you experience the same nervousness that you felt at your store.

Offline ponzu

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #21 on: September 12, 2010, 01:06:56 PM »
Is that a Forno Bravo Toscana oven?

Offline thezaman

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #22 on: September 12, 2010, 02:16:36 PM »
 bso, i did keste at 6 am to noon. roberto doesn't like to train at keste he normaly trains out of amano.because of my schedule we did early morning i was done before lunch started. we did all of our cooking starting at about 9 am he would make i would back then we would switch.the oven management was very difficult he runs a very hot oven and speed is important. the way that they spin and move the pizza on the turning peel is all technique. i am half way through the training the second half will be at amanos. if anything made me nervous is was roberto he is passionate about his pizza.
 ponzu, that is a toscana oven. 

Offline ponzu

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #23 on: September 12, 2010, 02:45:48 PM »
It looks like a really nice oven.
What size is it and what are your impressions of it's performance?  I'm particularly interested since you have had the unique experience of being able to compare it to a proffessional neapilitan oven at keste.

-ponzu
 

Offline thezaman

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Re: how do these guys do it??
« Reply #24 on: September 12, 2010, 04:31:03 PM »
 i can tell you it is not in the same league as a true neapolitan oven but it serves it purpose for me. i have a little privevera 70 at home and i modified it by putting in a layer of 1.5 inch bricks on the original floor and i with that the dome is is now 13 inches from the floor and i love the way it cooks pizza . the toscana is still new under 20 firings so i think it will get better.     


 

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