Author Topic: HI Altitude Recipes  (Read 2928 times)

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Offline tjacks88

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HI Altitude Recipes
« on: April 09, 2005, 10:11:50 PM »
I am New Jersey native raised on NY style pizza and have been living in Colorado for 7 years. I live at 5000' and have been working for the past 7 years to reproduce the NY style at home. I just came across this forum a few weeks ago and it's nice to know that I am not the only freak out there obsessed with great pizza.

I've gotten pretty close over the years to what I am looking for, and have now ordered the Escalon tomatoes and KASL flour (I was amazed at how different the flour looked and smelled than oher brands).

Is anyone famliar with the unique challenges of high-altitude, low-humidity pizza making? I have found a real Italian (born in Italy, had a pizza place in New Jersey) pizza place in Cheyenne, Wyoming that has the best pizza I have found out here. Unfortunately, he has been suspicious of my numerous questions on how he makes pizza as he thinks I am going to open a place with his recipe. (No way)


Online Pete-zza

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Re: HI Altitude Recipes
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2005, 10:39:48 PM »
Welcome to the forum.

I have cut and pasted below some information from the Fleischmann's yeast baking website on high altitude baking. If you do a search site on this forum, you will also find additional information. Since you already live at a high altitude I'd be really interested in your telling us what changes, if any, you have found necessary to produce a good NY style (or other) dough. I'd also love to see your recipe for the NY style dough to compare it with a "low-altitude" recipe.

Should recipes be adjusted for high altitudes?
Yes. But there are no exact rules for adjusting yeast breads at high altitudes. Altitude affects the ingredients and the entire breadmaking process. We suggest these general guidelines for baking above 3,000 feet.

· Because atmospheric pressure is lower and leavening gases expand more quickly, yeast dough rises 25 to 50 percent faster at high altitudes. Begin checking the dough halfway through the rising time listed in the recipe. Continue to check frequently.
· Flour tends to be drier and absorbs more liquid at high altitudes. Therefore, it is very important to store flour in an airtight container.
· When mixing the dough, you may need less flour than called for in the recipe. To compensate, add flour slowly and work in only enough to make the dough easy to handle. Because recipes call for varying amounts of flour, there is no standard measurement for reducing flour.
· If dough is slightly sticky during kneading, use greased instead of floured hands. This way, you won't knead in too much flour.
· Dough dries out faster at high altitudes. To prevent drying, grease or lightly oil the exposed part of dough ( whether in a bowl, on a board, or in a baking pan) and cover with greased plastic wrap instead of a towel.
· Baking temperature and time should not change at high altitudes, but check for browning at the shorter time listed and use traditional doneness tests.
· Just as dough dries out faster at high altitudes, so does the finished product. Store cooled bread in airtight plastic wrap, bags, or containers.
· If you are using a bread machine at high altitude, refer to the manufacturer's instruction book. Since flour may dry out faster at high altitudes, you may need to adjust the ratio of liquid to flour. Experiment by reducing the amount of yeast, flour or sugar (yeast feeds on sugar), and/or adding liquid or a little gluten. Or try a shorter baking cycle, such as rapid bake, if available.

Peter
« Last Edit: April 09, 2005, 11:17:32 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline tjacks88

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Re: HI Altitude Recipes
« Reply #2 on: May 28, 2005, 12:35:54 PM »
Pete,
Sorry for taking so long to get back to you. I attached a photo of a pie that I made using your ingredient measurements of

High-gluten flour, 11.80 oz. (about 2 1/2 c.)
      Water, 7.70 oz. (about 1 c.) (about 65% hydration).

      IDY, 0.20 oz. (1 1/2 t.)
      Salt, 0.20 oz. (3/4 t.)
      Olive oil (light), 0.12 oz. (3/4 t.)

Attached is a picture of the results.

One problem I had was I believe I got more flour by weight due to the low humidity here. I was able to stretch the pie much larger than 16" based on the ingredient levels above. I actually had to cut the pie down to size after I stretched it out in order to fit it into the oven. I was very happy with the results and would just like to figure out how to proportionally decrease the size down to a 14" an 12" pie. I was able to stretch the pie out pretty thin and get it to what I consider was a good NJ/Ny pizza

Any thoughts?

Online Pete-zza

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Re: HI Altitude Recipes
« Reply #3 on: May 28, 2005, 10:15:07 PM »
tjacks,

You might want to cut back on the amount of yeast used to compensate in part for the fact that you are working at high altitudes and doughs rise faster as a result. Because of the dryness of the flour at your elevation, you may also want to add flour to the water at a very slow rate and only until the water can't take on more flour without the dough getting dry. You still want the dough to be tacky, yet smooth, soft and elastic.

I will take a look for a version of the Lehmann dough recipe that starts out with less yeast (IDY) to begin with and scale it to a 12-14 inch size. You might also want to experiment with the 16-inch size, as you did, but with less yeast than you recently used.

Once I have a chance to play around with the recipes, I should be able to post some versions for you to consider.

Peter

Online Pete-zza

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Re: HI Altitude Recipes
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2005, 11:31:42 AM »
tjacks,

I have posted below three Lehmann NY style dough recipes--for the 12-inch, 14-inch and 16-inch sizes. For purposes of the recipes, I chose a combination of low-yeast (0.25% IDY), high hydration (63%), and a thickness factor of 0.105, which is a bit higher than the standard 0.10 thickness factor for the NY style but one I frequently use myself. If you'd prefer to use the 0.10 thickness factor, I suggest that you go to Reply #107 of the Lehmann thread, at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,576.100.html, where fellow member Crusty created a matrix that can be used for the 0.10 thickness with different possible hydration percents.

You might want to test out one of the recipes posted below at your altitude and see what results you get and take notes of your observations, should it become necessary to make adjustments to the recipe for future use. From what I have read at this forum from other members who live at high altitudes (notably Canadave), not all of them experience problems with the recipes posted at this forum, so it is possible that the recipes you choose to try may work out fine without modification to adjust for altitude.

Lehmann recipe for one 12-inch pizza
Flour (100%), KASL high-gluten, 7.15 oz. (1 1/2 c. plus 2 T.)
Water (63%), 4.50 oz. (between 1/2 c. and 5/8 c.)
Salt (1.75%), 0.13 oz. (a bit over 5/8 t.)
Oil (1%), 0.07 oz. (a bit less than 1/2 t.)
IDY (0.25%), 0.02 oz. (1/6 t., or about 7 pinches between the thumb and forefinger)
Total dough ball weight = 11.87 oz.
Thickness factor (TF) = 0.105

Lehmann recipe for one 14-inch pizza
Flour (100%), KASL high-gluten, 9.73 oz. (a bit less than 2 1/4 c.)
Water (63%), 6.13 oz. (3/4 c.)
Salt (1.75%), 0.17 oz. (7/8 t.)
Oil (1%), 0.10 oz. (a bit less than 5/8 t.)
IDY (0.25%), 0.02 oz. (a bit less than 1/4 t.)
Total dough ball weight = 16.16 oz.
Thickness factor (TF) = 0.105

Lehmann recipe for one 16-inch pizza
Flour (100%), King Arthur high-gluten, 12.65 oz. (2 3/4 plus 3 T.)
Water (63%), 7.95 oz., (1 c.)
Salt (1.75%), 0.20 oz., (a bit over 1 t.)
Oil (1%), 0.13 oz., (a bit over 3/4 t.)
IDY (0.25%), 0.03 oz., (about 1/3 t.)
Total dough ball weight: 21.10 oz.
Thickness factor (TF) = 0.105

Good luck and please keep us posted.

Peter






« Last Edit: November 18, 2005, 10:35:22 PM by Pete-zza »