Author Topic: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?  (Read 1129 times)

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Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #25 on: August 11, 2015, 01:26:17 PM »
Thanks Tom....I think my temperature variation explains a lot. I've often been using RT first and following it with mutli-day fridge rests...I'm thinking I can get the same or better flavors (and more control)  if I reverse the process and start cold, adding RT later in the process.  Good info on the yeast...certainly not what I would have thought.


Offline Pizza Shark

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #26 on: August 26, 2015, 06:23:52 PM »
Same recipe again with another 96 hour cold ferment.. bulk rise for 72 hours, balled and allowed to rest/rise in the fridge again for another 24 hours before pulling and giving a bench rest at room temp for an hour.  This time I wasn't so gentle with the dough when forming into skins and pressed more gas out of the dough before final stretching (especially around the rim). Same bake same everything else and same pan pizza with the same pan process...  Still lots of spring but pressing more gas out of the crust before baking seems to have made a bit of a difference in that previously crazy oven sprin around the rim.





 

Offline Pizza Shark

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #27 on: August 26, 2015, 06:31:48 PM »
Think next time I am going to try less dough for these 15" NY styles as one recommended.  Also, not overly peased with the amount of dry flour bench flour on the crust but that seems to be a sacrifice that needs made when working with a higher hydration dough.  I may stretch the pizza and then brush the rim with some olive oil just before baking... maybe that will brown up some of that residual rim flour.

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #28 on: August 26, 2015, 09:20:39 PM »
PShark..I think they're looking good..you're definitely taming those rims ( I'm working on that myself) Oiling the rim is a good idea. I tried olive oil but for me, the flavor was a little too commanding . And I like strong flavors..but it almost made the rim taste fried..a little crouton-ish. I've started using coconut oil and really like it..quite neutral but does the good things that any oil would to the rim, a little crispy and a good color.

Keep 'em coming!

Offline Essen1

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #29 on: August 26, 2015, 11:14:28 PM »
Jesus Christ, PS.  ;D

Lower the hydration (62% perhaps?) and yeast but up the salt (2-2.5%) amount and you'll be fine. Keep the retarding/fermentation to a max of 48hrs.

You worked in a pro environment,...draw on your memories and experience.
Mike

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new."  - Albert Einstein

Offline MarkC

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #30 on: August 26, 2015, 11:56:59 PM »
If it was me, I would maybe use smaller weight dough ball and/or shape the pizza without a crust at the perimeter (that is, the entire diameter of the pie is the same thickness). That way the edges (crust) will still puff out a bit, but not as dramatically.

It's what I would try if I liked the recipe and didn't want to modify it. Just my 2 cents.  ;D

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #31 on: August 27, 2015, 12:42:40 AM »
Quote
Keep the retarding/fermentation to a max of 48hrs.

Why?

Not following your logic here, Mike.

Of course taste is totally subjective, but if PS likes the flavors of a long fermentation..I know I totally prefer it, to the point of finding shorter fermented pies seriously  lacking in flavor..mind you, it's my taste and opinion, therefore not really subject to debate... I like them=true... then why push him to revert  to a workflow that while efficient, which is what a pizzeria needs as a business, will not give him the pie he's after ?   It seems backwards to me. . Solve his problem  areas by changing the part he likes. I don't know PS..sounds like you do..but if it were me, I'd want to keep the techniques that get me what I want, and make the tweaks that are needed..

Offline Essen1

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #32 on: August 27, 2015, 04:07:03 PM »
Why?

Not following your logic here, Mike.



Jersey,

My comment wasn't about discouraging PS to do longer fermentations nor was it about the final crust flavor. I get your point but when you look at his numbers in his OP you'll see that he uses 67% hydration, 0.65% yeast and only 1.3% salt. I'm not surprised he has a puffy crust. It can also push the dough to the brink of overfermentation given those numbers and his 96 hrs of retardation. Keep also in mind that when the skin is formed, a lot of that gas gets pushed out into the rim.

My suggestion of a shorter fermentation might curb those factors and the dough will only have to be knocked back or degassed once. On the other side, we don't know how many times, or if at all, PS has to punch his dough down. Maybe he posted it but I haven't seen it.

I hope that clarifies my point about a shorter fermentation a bit.
Mike

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

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Re: Explosive dough at 48 hrs and tame at 72 hrs. Any Ideas?
« Reply #33 on: August 27, 2015, 04:27:50 PM »
It does make good sense, Mike. Your points are well-taken. Thanks for the follow-up.


 

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