Cold Ovens

[BrettH]

Hi,

I am hoping that someone maybe able to help me. We are looking at introducing New York style pizza to Wellington New Zealand. I have managed to find the pans etc and just done a trial in our triple deck ovens only to find that they max out at between 260 – 300 Celius. Does anyone know a good recipe that will be able to be cooked in a cooler oven quickly?

Just checked and this should have been in Celius
Thanks in advance
Brett

[c0mpl3x]

nothing at that low of a temp.

[buceriasdon]

I would contact the company who supplied the oven. Something is wrong with it or with it's jetting. And your sure that's Celius not Farenheit?

[sconosciuto]

I have managed to find the pans etc and just done a trial in our triple deck ovens only to find that they max out at between 260 – 300 Celius.

That's the equivalent of 500-572 Farenheit which should be plenty hot.  You should be able to to cook a pizza in the 6-9 min range depending on your variables (ie. crust thicknes, number of topping, hydration, amount of cheese, size of pizza, etc).  Even at the low end of your temperature range your oven should be hot enough to get by.  Did your trial include actually cooking a pizza and if so how did it come out?


There are a few good recipes at the front of the website, give one of those a try.  Many people use the Tom Lehmann New York Style recipe or variation with good results.  Also try searching around this site as there are many good recipes to follow.  I'd suggest trying the Lehmann recipe with a 62% hydration and adjust up or down as needed from there.  If you're not familiar with bakers percentages I'm sure we can help you out if you know the batch size you want.  In my opinion a good pizza is 25% recipe, 25% fermentation time, 50% technique.  You can have a great recipe but if you lack technique your finished product will suffer.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/pizza_recipes.html

[buceriasdon]

Yes, Celius makes more sense 
Don

[BrettH]

Hi,

Thank you for the advise, I have made a few trial pizza's and have been told that they are taking to long to cook:

18inc - takes around 10-12 Min's
14 - takes around 8-10

etc, it has been suggested that I add more sugar to my dough to help it brown  faster, my concern is that it will become a sweet dough rather than a traditional dough. I will try your suggestions and see how I go. Thanks again

Cheers
Brett

[buceriasdon]

Try baking without the pans. Just a thought.
Don

Hi,

Thank you for the advise, I have made a few trial pizza's and have been told that they are taking to long to cook:

18inc - takes around 10-12 Min's
14 - takes around 8-10

etc, it has been suggested that I add more sugar to my dough to help it brown  faster, my concern is that it will become a sweet dough rather than a traditional dough. I will try your suggestions and see how I go. Thanks again

Cheers
Brett

[BrettH]

Thanks will try that as well, have you ever used Pizza Screens ( can not find out who supplies these in NZ). If so am I correct in assuming that they are the same as a pan just with lots of holes in the bottom ?

[buceriasdon]

In my part of the world those don't exist either. Screens? We don't need no stinkin' screens!
Saludos from Mexico, Don

Thanks will try that as well, have you ever used Pizza Screens ( can not find out who supplies these in NZ). If so am I correct in assuming that they are the same as a pan just with lots of holes in the bottom ?

[Pete-zza]

Brett,

You can see the basic commercial Lehmann NY style dough formulation at http://www.pmq.com/tt2/recipe/view/id_151/title_New-York-Style-Pizza/. However, I recently put together a collection of other NY style dough formulations at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11860.0.html.

Pizza screens are sometimes used with deck ovens, as is discussed, for example, at Reply 3 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5169.msg43926.html#msg43926 and at Reply 26 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7689.msg66284/topicseen.html#msg66284, but ordinarily they are not needed with deck ovens. With deck ovens, you have to be very careful about using sugar in the dough because it can result in premature bottom crust browning, or even burning, before the rest of the pizza is done baking. That is a case where using a pizza screen can help alleviate this problem.

Ordinarily, you shouldn't need to use sugar in a NY style dough formulation. However, if you are using cold fermentation, you might add about 1-2% sugar, based on flour weight, if you plan to go out beyond about two to three days.

Peter

EDIT (3/22/13): For the updated link to the PMQ recipe, see http://www.pmq.com/Recipe-Bank/index.php/name/New-York-Style-Pizza/record/57724/

[sconosciuto]

it has been suggested that I add more sugar to my dough to help it brown  faster, my concern is that it will become a sweet dough rather than a traditional dough. I will try your suggestions and see how I go.

Brett,

If you already have a dough you're using how about posting that recipe here including your pizza size, dough weight, ingredient measurements and procedures from start to finish.  How are you verifying the oven temp is reaching 260-300C, have you actually measured?

[sconosciuto]

Ordinarily, you shouldn't need to use sugar in a NY style dough formulation. However, if you are using cold fermentation, you might add about 1-2% sugar, based on flour weight, if you plan to go out beyond about two to three days.

This brings to mind the fact that Brett is located in NZ and not North America.  I know flour can vary from one area of the globe to another.  If the flour he's using lacks malt this might be why he is having difficulties with cook times.

Brett,

Can you tell us what type of flour and if possible what brand you are using?

[BrettH]

DOUGH INGREDIENTS
Flour Plain   3000   Grams
yeast active dried   70   Grams
Water   1850   Millilitres
Canola Oil   300   Millilitres
Sugar   50   Grams
Salt   50   Grams


Step 1: Start by combining the yeast & sugar with 1875 Millilitres of temped water, leave this for 10 mins or until it starts to “bubble” on top

Step 2: Combine the flour, yeast mix (from step 1), Oil & Salt into a dough mix and mix for a approximately 8 mins on a medium speed.

Step 3: Find a large bowl, spray the bowl with “oil” (we use a brand called sprinkle, but anything should do). Place the dough into the bowl and cover with a cling film and leave until the dough has doubled in size.

Step 4: Take dough from the bowl and divide it into the desired size, I am using the following weights:
•   18 Inch  - 650 Grams ( about 22 Ounces)
•   14 Inch – 400 Grams
•   7 inch -  130  Grams

Step 5: Roll out the dough into the pans, top and bake

Please Note: I have never made pizza on a commercial bases, this has simply been the recipe that I have been using for home pizza scaled up. I have taken the recommendation on a pervious thread and worked out the Square CM of our pans then and applied this to all dough and toppings to ensure consistence.

For example: 18 inch pan has a surface area of 254cm, 14 inch has a surface area 154cm  & 7 inch has a surface area 50cm

 I have decided that I would use 2.56 grms per cm of surface area, I have applied the same principle to my toppings. Simple decided on the amount of topping that I want to use on a CM and multiple up or divide down. To ensure that all my pizzas are uniformed I am making them on scales

[BrettH]

Hi,

I am using an all purpose bakers flour, the brand is TOOPS.

Cheers

[Pete-zza]

Brett,

One of our members, tommygun (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=6667), had made NY style pizzas in New Zealand and may still be doing so. He is also in Wellington, New Zealand. I don't know if he wants competition but you might send him a PM to explore possibilities or to get answers to specific questions. You might also read his posts. You will see that he was using an all-purpose flour supplemented with vital wheat gluten.

Peter

[BrettH]

Hi,

Thanks for this I will send him a PM

Cheers

[buceriasdon]

I also add gluten to my AP flour.
Don

Brett,

One of our members, tommygun (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?action=profile;u=6667), had made NY style pizzas in New Zealand and may still be doing so. He is also in Wellington, New Zealand. I don't know if he wants competition but you might send him a PM to explore possibilities or to get answers to specific questions. You might also read his posts. You will see that he was using an all-purpose flour supplemented with vital wheat gluten.

Peter