Author Topic: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'  (Read 20644 times)

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Offline norma427

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #50 on: December 13, 2010, 07:05:08 PM »
Norma,

I used King Arthur BF. I might give the AP flour a shot even though I'm not a big fan of it at all. Or perhaps a blend of 60/40 in favor of KABF.

It would be interesting to see how an 18" pie works in your oven.

Mike,

Thanks for telling me what kind of flour you used.  I do have access to Caputo Pizzeria Flour and Kyrol, which is something like All Trumps.  My deck oven can go above 675 degrees F.  I don't know if I can handle a 18" pie though.  :-D

Good luck to you when you try another pizza.  :)

Norma


Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #51 on: December 13, 2010, 07:16:49 PM »
If there isn't oil, the crust should be dry and crunchy all the way through.  If there is a soft center to that crust, then that should be indication of the presence of oil or a highly hydrated dough.

Chau,

When I was working on the DiFara's clone, I calculated that Dom's dough had a hydration of around 65%. Dom uses volume measurements so it is hard to be precise on matters such as hydration. It seemed to me that I read somewhere, maybe from something that scott r posted, that Dom's oven doesn't get to 750 degrees F but still runs hotter than the deck ovens that most pizza operators use. It seems that I also read that Dom's pizzas take more than seven minutes to bake.

When I conduct reverse engineering projects, I don't like to speculate. I look for hard facts. Otherwise, I am just guessing. I would rather wait for the facts to emerge before doing anything. There is a lot of misinformation on the Internet, often from people who don't really know what they are talking about, that I tend to be suspicious of reports that seem to me to be contrary to what I know or common sense tells me. If one of our members who lives and dies for pizzas were reporting, I would pay much closer attention.

Peter

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #52 on: December 13, 2010, 07:33:54 PM »
This is the post that I recalled where scott r speculated on the oven temperature that Dom uses: Reply 1 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5903.msg50611/topicseen.html#msg50611.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #53 on: December 13, 2010, 07:49:13 PM »
Peter,

Since you have actually been to Domís and know what his crust looked like, here are a few videos for you or anyone that is interested.  I donít know if these videos were posted before or not.































 





Norma
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 09:39:51 PM by norma427 »

Online thezaman

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #54 on: December 13, 2010, 07:55:12 PM »
 all i can say is i was shocked at how light the dough was. maybe a lower protein flour caused it .
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 08:07:30 PM by thezaman »

Offline norma427

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #55 on: December 13, 2010, 08:10:25 PM »
A few more videos









Norma

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #56 on: December 13, 2010, 08:13:32 PM »
Just curious, how did you and other members determine that there isn't oil in Dom's dough.  Is this from an inside source?


Okay, I guess I'll answer my own question.  I was just now reading through the reverse engineering di fara thread and found this from PFTaylor.  Reply #70

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,504.60.html

"Two parts flour to one part water with a coffee cup and a half of salt and a piece of fresh yeast. That is his recipe."

Chau

Whoa - not sure what  I just did.  I thought I was quoting myself but somehow erase my old post.  Basically said that you are right Peter about speculation.  That's why I said earlier I wouldn't try to replicate his dough without the first hand input and descriptions, along with crumb shots from mulitple members.   I then inquired about how you and other members determined that Dom doesn't use oil in his formulation but have since found the answer in you thread to which I noted above.   Okay....back to the regular program.

« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 09:17:03 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline Essen1

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #57 on: December 13, 2010, 08:16:23 PM »
all i can say is i was shocked at how light the dough was. maybe a lower protein flour caused it .

That's basically what the guy said in the video link I posted earlier. He said Dom uses AP flour which generates a very light crust, according to the man.

But it is all very speculative and since I have never been there, I can't really comment any further. But common sense tells me that perhaps a flour blend of maybe AP and some BF might work in a home oven, together with a high hydration and perhaps some oil.

Mike

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #58 on: December 13, 2010, 08:23:41 PM »
all i can say is i was shocked at how light the dough was. maybe a lower protein flour caused it .

Perhaps but the majority of the lightest breads and pizza doughs I have made have come from my Con Agra's HG bleached and bromated flour.   The lightness in the crumb can come from several sources, but from my experiments I have found it to come from.

-a relatively young dough made with commercial yeast.
-a moderate to well hydrated dough relative to the protein content.
-proper or enough gluten developed into the dough.  Good strength but not too much or you can get a toughen texture.
-well proofed but again not too much as the acids can/will start to toughen the crumb.  Oil can mitigate this.
-baked well to bake the moisture out from the higher hydration, but not too much as to dry the crumb out.  Again oil can help mitigate this. 

This is all relative of course.  Balance all these factors out and you get a light crumb regardless of the type of flour.  I have been able to also do this with different strengths of flour as well. 

Chau
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 09:05:09 PM by Jackie Tran »


Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #59 on: December 13, 2010, 09:13:11 PM »
Just curious, how did you and other members determine that there isn't oil in Dom's dough.  Is this from an inside source?

Chau,

Dom told me. Everything I reported on the dough and the pizzas came either from Dom or from my own eyes. From the videos that Norma referenced, I can see that Dom went to other sources for some of his ingredients, like the oil (Colavita) and tomatoes. Some pizzas looked like they had lighter crusts but I did not think to check the dates of the videos to see if the pizzas were recent or not.

Peter

Offline widespreadpizza

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #60 on: December 13, 2010, 09:15:54 PM »
Peter,  I would add too that in my experience,  all trumps can have a very yellow color.  The bromate I am positive adds to the lightness as well.  -marc

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #61 on: December 13, 2010, 09:19:24 PM »
Chau,

Dom told me. Everything I reported on the dough and the pizzas came either from Dom or from my own eyes. From the videos that Norma referenced, I can see that Dom went to other sources for some of his ingredients, like the oil (Colavita) and tomatoes. Some pizzas looked like they had lighter crusts but I did not think to check the dates of the videos to see if the pizzas were recent or not.

Peter

Thanks Peter, I just read that Dom told PFTaylor as well.   In the process, I somehow erased my old post by accident.   Thanks again, I'll read through the rest of reverse engineering Di Fara's pizza thread now. 

Chau
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 09:28:22 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline Essen1

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #62 on: December 13, 2010, 11:04:31 PM »
Out of curiosity...does anyone know where Dom DeMarco is from in Italy?

Naples?
Mike

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Offline Matthew

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #63 on: December 14, 2010, 06:24:37 AM »
Out of curiosity...does anyone know where Dom DeMarco is from in Italy?

Naples?

He's from Caserta, just outside of Naples.

Offline Essen1

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #64 on: December 14, 2010, 03:11:02 PM »
He's from Caserta, just outside of Naples.

Thank you, Sir.

Mike

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Essen1

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #65 on: December 14, 2010, 06:09:28 PM »
I found some more pics on Slice that might give anyone who wants to attempt to clone or reverse engineer DiFara's, which will give you and idea bout the characteristics of the crust and it's floppiness.

Also check out the two whole pies and how different they look...

http://slice.seriouseats.com/archives/2009/03/locked-in-for-the-night-at-di-fara-pizza-midwood-brooklyn-nyc.html#continued
Mike

"Anyone who has never made a mistake has never tried anything new."  - Albert Einstein

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #66 on: December 16, 2010, 05:00:36 PM »
Thanks for the pictures Mike, those look tasty! 

I made a couple of Di Fara inspired pies today.   Crust was my own but I topped these with a mixture of block mozz, fresh mozz, and bufala mozz.   OO and baked.  Finished with a combination of grated parmesan and romano, and a healthy amount of basil. 

Ate these pies hot and they were fantastic.   This is the first time I mixed fresh mozz and bufala.  will definitely be doing this again. 



Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #67 on: December 16, 2010, 06:21:27 PM »
Those are some beautiful and tasty looking pizzas.  Salute!

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #68 on: December 16, 2010, 06:31:56 PM »
Chau,

What did you put in those pies that they lasted from 01/03/2009 until today??  :-D

Great looking pies, bro!
Mike

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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #69 on: December 16, 2010, 06:41:22 PM »
Chau,

Nice job. I'm sure in due course you will come up with a DiFara clone that is even better than the real one that Dom makes.

Peter

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #70 on: December 16, 2010, 08:26:06 PM »
Thank you Tscarborough, Mike, and Peter.   

Good catch Mike.   :-D  My kids have been playing with the camera and must have reset the date and time. 

Peter that is very kind of you to say.  Someday I'll get around to trying all of the top places so I can compare them to my pies.  Until then these will have to do.   ;D  I'm sure Dom makes GREAT pizza and he deserves all the attention and press.  I really have a lot of respect for him.  He is a master of his craft and has a very kind soul as can be seen in the video and from reading PFTaylor's post about his visit with Dom.   

Respectfully,
Chau

Offline norma427

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #71 on: December 16, 2010, 10:47:44 PM »
Chau,

Your Di Fara inspired pies look delicious!  ;D  I am still smiling.   ;D  I am surprised no one asked you what formula you used to make those pies and how you baked them.

Norma

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #72 on: December 17, 2010, 05:56:56 PM »
Chau, that pie looks amazing! :o Details?

This video is an absolute classic.

Paul

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #73 on: December 17, 2010, 11:21:16 PM »
Thanks Norma & Paul.  Crust was a variation of my recent efforts.   Not exactly Di fara but similar. 

100% flour (50/50 blend of HG bromated flour and caputo pizzeria 00)
67% water
2.2% salt
0.05% IDY
2% oil (EVOO)

Minimally kneaded, bulked 10 hours at 75F, divided and balled, proofed for 6 hours.  Baked in the MBE for around 4-5m.   Next time I'll bake in the home oven. 

Chau
 

Offline Essen1

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Re: Watch the Di Fara Documentary 'The Best Thing I Ever Done'
« Reply #74 on: December 18, 2010, 12:18:11 AM »
Thanks Norma & Paul.  Crust was a variation of my recent efforts.   Not exactly Di fara but similar. 

100% flour (50/50 blend of HG bromated flour and caputo pizzeria 00)
67% water
2.2% salt
0.05% IDY
2% oil (EVOO)

Minimally kneaded, bulked 10 hours at 75F, divided and balled, proofed for 6 hours.  Baked in the MBE for around 4-5m.   Next time I'll bake in the home oven. 

Chau
 

Chau,

Can you provide us with the baking temp?

I think DiFara bakes somewhere around 650įF to 700įF from what I've read. I'm also curious to see how a pie would turn out in your MBE that has received only a two or perhaps three hour proofing. I think that that might get you closer to the real deal in terms of DiFara.

Thanks, Bro.

Mike

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