Author Topic: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish  (Read 5511 times)

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Offline norma427

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #20 on: December 08, 2010, 07:21:58 PM »
Norma, this was in the fridge 7 days...and was baked in my hottest deck oven....when I took the temp it was between 615 and 620.

John

John,

Thanks for telling me how long your dough was fermented and also your deck oven temperature.  I will watch how your experiments go.  You really are getting good results in all of your experiments.  ;D

My deck oven can get up to high temperatures.  Maybe sometime I will try your dough in my deck oven to see what happens.  From my experiments yesterday with Paul's flour and a high hydration, I really liked the results.  I only baked at around 566 degrees F in my deck oven.

Norma
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Offline fazzari

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #21 on: December 09, 2010, 02:39:59 PM »
Here is the first dough of a new experiment this week.  The recipe remains the same this week, except I eliminated the honey (to see if and how it affected browning), I'm again using Roma oo flour, and this week I used the method on the following video to mix this dough by hand:

http://www.gourmet.com/magazine/video/2008/03/bertinet_sweetdough

I actually only mixed this dough for 5 minutes 10 seconds.  It didn't come all together like in the video (after all this is high hydration, and is undermixed), but I definitely felt the dough strengthen and stretch the longer I pounded it on the table.

This one is baked in my home oven..about 615 degrees for 5 minutes.  I let the dough ball set out 1 hour after having been refrigerated for 26 hours.  I could have let it set out longer to make it easier to stretch.  The worst part of my game is stretching them out, and even though the pizza isn't gorgeous, the coloration is pretty good, and I think the bottom shot shows how incredibly tender this crust is.   This experiment (at least this first dough) is a major success.

John


Offline fazzari

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #22 on: December 19, 2010, 02:54:37 AM »
So, I've been playin around with this method/recipe because I think the results are pretty darned good.  I had a huge aha moment after reading one of Chau's replies regarding high hydration dough.  He was basically talking about the looseness of a dough having more to do with the strength than the hydration..and that is when bell's went off in my head.

For this dough:
9 oz KA bread flour
9 oz cold water
pinch of yeast
Mix above ingredients, cover, and let sit at room temp for 12 to 16 hours

To the above poolish add
24.90 oz KA bread flour
16.45 oz cold water
.70 oz salt
.15 oz yeast

I mixed the dough this time by hand, just for the heck of it.  I mixed it a total of 5 minutes.  After 5 minutes by hand it "felt" more developed than when I mix it in my mixer for 3 minutes.  This is the AHA! moment because the dough is a lot less sticky, is easy to scale and ball.  I did use just a bit of oil in this process, but nowhere near the amount called for in the original recipe.
John










Offline fazzari

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2010, 03:02:59 AM »
The following pizza was made from a dough which was refrigerated for 4 and a half days.  Other things I've noticed since I've been developing the dough just a bit longer:  if you use your dough in the first 2 days of refrigeration, you don't have to reball it; secondly, the dough is not at all sticky, and thirdly the dough ball holds it's shape, nice and tall.  As for this dough:  it's a ruff and tuff dough..you can pull, and tug and pull and tug and stretch, and it has abolutely no effect on the rim of the dough.  The pizzas made with this dough seem to almost explode with puffiness a minute after hitting a hot oven deck.
John

Offline norma427

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2010, 08:04:26 AM »
John,

Your pizza looks great!  ;D The rim is beautiful.

Norma
Always working and looking for new information!

Offline dmaxdmax

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #25 on: January 23, 2011, 06:25:08 PM »
O! M! G!  These look amazing!

How big is the pizza in #21?  Have you determined an optimal time in the fridge?

Thanks
Dave
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Offline fazzari

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #26 on: January 23, 2011, 07:46:43 PM »
That's about an 11 inch pizza.....I'm finding most of these doughs are best after 3 days...they end up getting crispier and losing some of their chewiness.

John

Offline CoalsArt

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #27 on: March 04, 2011, 04:42:54 PM »
Earlier this summer, I took a pizza trip to Seattle and had the pleasure of eating at Serious Pie.  One of the pizzas I ate there was simply the best I have every had.  It sure opened my eyes to the possibilities available.  Since then, I have played around with different recipes, trying to replicate what I ate.  It wasn't until I re read Peter Reinhart's "Artisan Breads Every Day", and started playing with his neo-neopolitan recipe, that I came up with maybe a breakthrough.  I also read information on this site relative to Serious Pie which I incorportated into my startegies.  The following picture is a pizza from Serious Pie and is simply the best pizza I've ever eaten......this is the crust I'd love to replicate.
John


I come from Seattle and have eaten quite a few Serious Pie pizzas.  Have you tried Delancey?  That is my favorite pizza coming out of Seattle, although there are so many new pizza places popping up in that city. 

I wanted to ask what you thought of the Roma 00 flour as oppose to the KA bread flour?  Also, with the long fermentation and the poolish were you getting quite a tang in the flavor of the dough?

Offline fazzari

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #28 on: March 04, 2011, 06:53:12 PM »
You know, I made a special trip to Seattle to eat at Tutta Bella and Via Tribunali....as I was planning my 2 days, Serious Pie kept coming up as did Delancey... I only had time for Tutta Bella , Via Tribunali and Serious Pie in this short trip.  I'm going to try over again, and If I do I'll give Delancey a try.  As for Roma oo, this is Romas version of a Caputo type of flour...it works really good in my hottest oven, where I can use KA bread flour in almost any oven.  The doughs I make with poolish start to get the smell after 4,5, or 6 days, but I don't find it really affecting taste....the doughs I make without poolish smell great all the way to 8 or 9 days.

John

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #29 on: March 10, 2011, 08:57:53 AM »
fazzari, does your dough is 100% 00 flour? or do you mix is with kabf flour? after i did my first bread with polish i cant stop thinking of making pizza with polish. you thread came in perfect timing and give me a lot of material to think about.

another thing - have you ever tried 24 hour rise in room temperature or just cold rise?

pizzas look fantastic i would like the get my hand on a slice but i am half way across the world.

wonderfull job done.


Offline mattharris75

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #30 on: June 23, 2011, 10:51:35 PM »
Since Serious Pie is probably the best pizza I've ever had, I absolutely had to give this recipe a try. Now I need to get back to Seattle so I can compare it to my version! :)

I kept the poolish at room temp for 7 hours before making the dough. This dough ball was cold fermented for 41 hours. Cooked at 584 stone temp for about 5.5 minutes, with the broiler on for the last 3 minutes. Then I domed it close to the broiler for about 15-20 seconds.

Sauce was canned Cento whole SanMarzano's, pureed with a little garlic, a tablespoon of 'backyard herbs' (basil, oregano, rosemary), a dash of red wine vinegar, and a little salt and sugar. Best sauce I've done so far, thanks solely to the quality of the Cento tomatoes.

Topped with fresh mozz, andouille sausage, diced pancetta, and a little parmigiano reggiano.

I really enjoyed the flavor of this crust. It had a sweetness to it. It was quite light, with a bit of crunch and some chew, but not too much. My wife said this was the best crust I've done in my 3 or 4 years of pizza making. She appreciated the fact that it wasn't too chewy.

The one downside to this dough was that, even though it was extensible, once I placed it on the peel it seemed to shrink back a bit. Not a big deal all things considered though.

I have one more dough ball that I'll be cooking up Sunday evening, so I'll be curious to see how the handling characteristics change after a few more days in the fridge.

I don't know if it was quite up to Serious Pie level, but it was awful good!


Offline fazzari

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #31 on: June 24, 2011, 01:19:53 AM »
Very, very nice looking pizza Matt!!!

John

Offline mattharris75

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Re: Neo-Neopolitan with poolish
« Reply #32 on: June 24, 2011, 01:55:02 PM »
Thanks John!

I appreciate your work on this recipe. I'll be sure to post how the 5 day fermented dough works out compared to the 2 day.