Author Topic: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas  (Read 75033 times)

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Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #225 on: September 03, 2012, 05:31:29 PM »
Pics.
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.


Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #226 on: September 03, 2012, 05:32:51 PM »
And a few more pics.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #227 on: September 03, 2012, 10:01:41 PM »
Here's a recap of the pizza above:

I baked the pizza on the pan on the stone for 9 minutes at 500, then finished directly on the stone for another 2 minutes.

The pictures aren't bad, I suppose, but they don't do this one justice because this pizza was really good. It may not have been the best I've ever made, but it probably came the closest to replicating what my mind says is Tommy's. The crust was very crispy but not crunchy; maybe a hair too thin. Despite what I just said a couple sentences ago, this one definitely could be considered a best-yest, though there's a lot of room for improvement.

The one thing I'm happiest about with this pizza is that I think I finally got the cut pattern right.

The sauce pic a couple posts back looks like pretty heavy application of sauce, right? Yeah, well I could barely taste anything resembling sauce. So after one try with the Dei Fratelli crushed tomatoes, I'm thinking it's not the same thing as the tomato product packaging I found in the Tommy's dumpster. The jury is still out, but I'm not impressed.

Considering the crispness of today's pizza, I'm gonna go ahead and try 54% hydration for the next batch, which I'll mix tonight, letting half of it bulk ferment overnight for tomorrow's pizza. Also gonna knock the ADY back down to 0.60%, and increase the salt to 1.75%.

The way I'm starting to feel about bench flour between the laminations is that you cannot possibly use too much of it. I used a lot of bench flour on today's pizza, but there wasn't a lot of separation compared to yesterday's pizza, which was gonzo on the bench flour.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #228 on: September 03, 2012, 10:10:46 PM »
Oh yeah, and that piece of raw bacon probably ended up cooked well enough not to freak anyone out. I wouldn't advise that anyone top pizzas with raw bacon, though, because it won't end up as well done as most people like their bacon. Still, I'll probably try it again.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline pizzaneer

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #229 on: September 03, 2012, 10:36:46 PM »
Your resistance to experimentation is interesting.  I would think someone as courageous as you would have not trouble trying something new.  I really think shortening (butter, margarine, crisco, lard) between the laminations would give you more of a seperated-layer effect.

I would duplicate your recipe and try it myself (to answer your objection), but you have all the experience and controls in place for a great experiment.

Please try it.  Please?
I'd rather eat one good meal a day than 3 squares of garbage.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #230 on: September 03, 2012, 11:54:14 PM »
I really think shortening (butter, margarine, crisco, lard) between the laminations would give you more of a seperated-layer effect.

Here's something that had never occurred to me until I read your post and started envisioning what would happen if I actually did try to use solid fat between the laminates: With this relatively stiff dough, the heat generated by the friction of rolling the dough, in conjunction with the pressure required to roll a stiff dough, would melt the fat and lubricate the laminates, turning the whole thing into a big mess.

I know nothing about pastry dough, but I'm guessing that when people put solid fat between layers of pastry dough, they use a very soft dough made of low-protein flour. Can anyone verify this or tell me I'm wrong?
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #231 on: September 04, 2012, 12:15:05 AM »
Here's something that had never occurred to me until I read your post and started envisioning what would happen if I actually did try to use solid fat between the laminates: With this relatively stiff dough, the heat generated by the friction of rolling the dough, in conjunction with the pressure required to roll a stiff dough, would melt the fat and lubricate the laminates, turning the whole thing into a big mess.

I know nothing about pastry dough, but I'm guessing that when people put solid fat between layers of pastry dough, they use a very soft dough made of low-protein flour. Can anyone verify this or tell me I'm wrong?

Puff pastry is typically made with AP flour and is not particularly soft.

You only roll-trifold-roll a couple times between chilling the dough.

For this recipe, I'd use lard.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline pizzaneer

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #232 on: September 04, 2012, 12:19:56 AM »
Yes, temperature is a big factor.  Chill the dough after rolling it out, add the lard, fold it, roll it, chill it.  Then bake.
Hopefully you will see some big differences.  Thanks for considering it.
I'd rather eat one good meal a day than 3 squares of garbage.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #233 on: September 04, 2012, 09:16:28 AM »
Ryan, have you seen this...
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"


Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #234 on: September 04, 2012, 11:31:13 AM »
Thanks for the input, guys.

Well, even if I do try the fat thing, it probably ain't gonna be anytime soon. I've just carried the front 11, and I'm trying to at least hit the pocket for my first 300. (That was a metaphor.)

In reality, the first time I had one shot left for 300, I hit the pocket really light. My intention was to do the same thing I had done with the previous 11 shots, which was the right thing to do. Only problem was that my execution was off. I threw the ball a little too hard, so it took a split second longer to break. Result: I left the 2-5 for a 298.

Not a perfect analogy (because my pizzas a few frames ago were the equivalent of gutterballs), but it's the best I can come up with right now.

Right now I gotta keep doing what got me here. If I try the pastry thing, it'll be like trying to throw that 12th shot left-handed (which is against the rules for right-handers and is to be scored as 0 even if you throw a strike). I can experiment some other week, when I'm in the middle of a 150 game.

Formula for the dough I made last night:

100% KAAP
54% Water
0.60% ADY
1.75% Salt

10.5-hour bulk ferment at room temperature (15 oz of dough). Divided into two and rolled the dough at about 10:00 this morning, using almost no bench flour for the initial roll, then applying a ton of bench flour between the laminates. Dough skin weighed 10.13 oz (TF=0.107 oz of dough per square inch). I put the skin in the fridge (on the lightly-sprayed pan, with plastic wrap covering the top to keep it from drying) at about 10:20 this morning.

In the second pic you can see that I rolled the skin slightly larger than the pan after trimming. The skin was still kinda sticking to the counter at this point, though, so it shrunk a little once I removed it from the counter. With this skin and future skins, I will be making an effort to end up with skins that are exactly the same size as the pan, not 1/4" to 1/2" larger than the pan.

Question: Is pastry dough fermented, or is the fat used to simulate leavening?

Another question: What's the most unlikely, most difficult pin total (final score) for one person to score in one game of bowling?
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 03:32:25 PM by AimlessRyan »
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Jackitup

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #235 on: September 04, 2012, 03:25:05 PM »
Me thinks you got a typo on your ADY.

Jon
“The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why.”            -Mark Twain

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #236 on: September 04, 2012, 03:34:46 PM »
Good catch. Thanks. I fixed it.

I'm a little disappointed that no one has answered my question about the bowling score yet. (Hint: It's not 300 and it's not a trick question.)
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline weemis

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #237 on: September 04, 2012, 03:40:44 PM »
I'm a little disappointed that no one has answered my question about the bowling score yet. (Hint: It's not 300 and it's not a trick question.)

http://bit.ly/Okj7xz
 :P
Nick Gore - just a dough eyed wanderer

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #238 on: September 04, 2012, 03:41:59 PM »
...without cheating.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #239 on: September 04, 2012, 04:56:55 PM »
Pic 1: Since I couldn't taste the 3.5 oz of sauce on yesterday's pizza, I put 5 oz of sauce on today's.

Pic 2: 6.5 oz of cheese, with pepperoni, bacon, and about twice as many fresh jalapeno slices as yesterday's pizza (because I heard I'm not getting enough vegetables in my diet). Can you even see the pizza there?

I'm getting ready to bake within the next 15 minutes or so.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #240 on: September 04, 2012, 06:56:51 PM »
Sometimes what you thought you knew ends up being wrong. Like how I was so sure this dough needs a 49% hydration level. As it turns out, 54% hydration seems just about right. So forget what I was saying just the other day, at least for now, because I'm probably gonna stick with 54% for a while.

Last night's overnight bulk ferment was a little too much for this dough, though. I suspected that much when I first saw the dough this morning because it took up a lot more space than it did when I left it last night. Then I confirmed it when I ate tonight's pizza, as the crust had just a little bit of that overfermented toughness and density.

So that leaves me with a few options: 1) Decrease the yeast; 2) Bulk ferment in the fridge, probably with more yeast; or 3) Sleep less.

I'll use the first half of option #2 for tomorrow's pizza. Can't do #2 entirely because I made the dough yesterday, but I probably will stick with option #2 when I make the next batch of dough tomorrow night.

I gotta simplify my topping selection, too. No more jalapenos. I like to taste my pizza, and that was hard to do today.

9+2 minute bake time seemed a little too short with this one, perhaps because I used so much more sauce today than I used yesterday. Or maybe it's because I let the stone heat up on the bottom rack instead of up near the broiler.

I may have sounded very critical throughout this post, but today's pizza was awesome. I'm definitely closer to replicating Tommy's than I was yesterday.
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 07:03:39 PM by AimlessRyan »
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Jackitup

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #241 on: September 04, 2012, 07:41:03 PM »
Sometimes what you thought you knew ends up being wrong. Like how I was so sure this dough needs a 49% hydration level. As it turns out, 54% hydration seems just about right. So forget what I was saying just the other day, at least for now, because I'm probably gonna stick with 54% for a while.

Last night's overnight bulk ferment was a little too much for this dough, though. I suspected that much when I first saw the dough this morning because it took up a lot more space than it did when I left it last night. Then I confirmed it when I ate tonight's pizza, as the crust had just a little bit of that overfermented toughness and density.

So that leaves me with a few options: 1) Decrease the yeast; 2) Bulk ferment in the fridge, probably with more yeast; or 3) Sleep less.


If the heat factor was too much and covered up the flavor of your pie go with pickled japs. Those look fresh and can run literally from NO heat to too much for some. I do the pickled ones and actually the pickling adds to the pie imo. Also, my favorite way to handle a jar of pickled japs is this. Drain out some of the juice and add sugar to sweeten to taste. E=When you get there add back any juice if needed and shake it up once or twice a day for a week or so "if you can make it that long" and have at them. Simple and SIMPLY AWESOME!!!


Jon
« Last Edit: September 04, 2012, 07:43:00 PM by Jackitup »
“The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why.”            -Mark Twain


Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #242 on: September 04, 2012, 08:51:23 PM »
I threw a little bit of feta on a small section of this pizza, too; some of which is visible in the 4th pic. I can't say the feta added any kind of spectacular flavor profile, but it certainly didn't take away from the pizza, either.

Jon, I used to be a fan of pickled jalapenos and banana peppers, but nowadays I only use fresh jalapenos at home. They're awesome on burgers.
Ryan
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Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #243 on: September 05, 2012, 08:40:50 AM »
Ryan, have you seen this...

Well, I couldn't really have missed it, now, could I? Are you gonna explain it?
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #244 on: September 05, 2012, 09:04:23 AM »
Oh, yeah sorry...guess this would help.    Dans revelation...
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1911.msg35521.html#msg35521
Also, on that same thread member fazzari an Dan talking...http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1911.msg50375.html#msg50375
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #245 on: September 05, 2012, 11:01:36 AM »
Considering yesterday's minor overfermentation issues, which resulted from allowing the dough to bulk ferment at room temperature overnight, I kept today's dough (same batch) in the fridge all night, after already having it in the fridge for the previous 24 hours since mixing. (So that's about a 33-hour cold bulk ferment.) I took the dough out of the fridge a little before 9:00 this morning and immediately rolled it because I figured rolling cold dough could make a pretty big difference, both in how it feels while rolling and in how it bakes.

The dough definitely felt different today, due to this procedural change. It felt much stiffer than yesterday's dough, of course, but not stiff. Still, it felt stiff enough that I will most likely try 56% hydration for an upcoming batch of this dough (not for tonight's batch, though). My immediate thoughts are that I like this method better than the overnight room-temperature bulk ferment. But I'll hold off making a final judgment until after I make the pizza tonight.

With the lamination/rolling procedures I use for this dough, it's almost impossible to use too much bench flour between the laminates of these pizzas. If you do use too much, the excess flour ends up spurting out the edges of the dough as you roll it into a skin.

Today, instead of spraying the skin with nonstick spray and covering it with plastic wrap before putting the skin in the fridge, I just applied sauce to the skin to keep it from drying up. That was at 9:20, and I used 5 oz of sauce.

Today's 11" dough skin weight is 10.5 oz (TF=0.110 oz of dough per square inch), as shown in pic 1. I'm taking a little chance with this. I've gotten into a pattern of preferring my skins to be about 10 oz, so this might end up a little too thick for my tastes, even though it's probably not quite as thick as an actual Tommy's pizza.

(I forgot to mention this in the post that listed the formula for this batch of dough, but this batch of dough was made of 23 oz of fresh dough and 7 oz of scraps from the previous batch.)

My kitchen lighting problem (for pics) has been fixed, at least in my prep area. If you didn't already notice, check out how much of a difference it made between the pictures of Monday's pizza (pic 2) and yesterday's pizza (pic 3).

Here's one thought that goes through my mind every day while eating and analyzing these pizzas: "Is this characteristic representative of present-day Tommy's, or is it representative of Tommy's from 25 years ago?" And it confuses me every day, because there's such a big difference between the pizzas of now and then. Consequently, my clone attempts tend to have characteristics of both Tommy's of today and Tommy's of the past.

Today's Tommy's pizza is kinda pale and has blisters on the bottom, while Tommy's of the past has a smooth bottom that browns more (due to the bubbles in the laminates, as in pic 4) and breaks up, leaving a hundred small flat crust crumbs in your box or on your tray. I think Tommy's of the past was also a little thinner than Tommy's of today, which is probably one of the main reasons why I like to make them a little thinner than you'd get if you went to Tommy's today.

And in case anyone is wondering: Tommy's of the past is much better than the Tommy's I've had in my two visits since this thread began two years ago.

I'm thinking about taking a trip to the OSU Tommy's sometime, rather than the one in Upper Arlington, to see if they serve me a noticeably different pizza than the UA Tommy's. It kinda makes sense that they might, because no small chain with only four units is gonna have the same kind of quality control that a large chain has. Consequently, the pizza at the different stores has probably evolved independently of each other for long enough that they might be making considerably different products.

So if anyone would like to meet me at the OSU Tommy's sometime, let me know.

One more thing: Man, this pizza is complicated. The formula, the ingredients, the dough management, the prep procedures, and the baking methods; all of it. There are so many different variables to consider when making this kind of pizza, each of which can change everything.

Most people probably wouldn't consider this kind of pizza remotely as good as a New York pizza or a Chicago deep dish, but it's infinitely easier to figure out how to make great NY pizza and great deep dish. Not just one or the other, but both. Possibly in the same week.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline weemis

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #246 on: September 05, 2012, 11:07:26 AM »
So if anyone would like to meet me at the OSU Tommy's sometime, let me know.

i'm in, sir! lemme know!
Nick Gore - just a dough eyed wanderer

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #247 on: September 05, 2012, 05:41:00 PM »
Nick, if I get the urge to go to Tommy's, I'll let you know. Or if you get the urge, you can let me know. How's that sound? I'm probably gonna head up to Carfagna's (or Pittsburgh) sometime next week, to get cheese and other supplies. Regardless of where I get my supplies, that would likely be a good time for me to go to Tommy's, since I don't get around much.

Here are some pics of today's pizza.
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline Aimless Ryan

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #248 on: September 06, 2012, 10:39:11 AM »
Some notes about yesterday's pizza (pictured above):

  • After rolling the skin, I refrigerated it for 7 hours. Since I've been refrigerating most of the skins for about this long, I'm surprised the crusts haven't blistered more. I think it may be a sign that I should consider using more yeast.
  • I began baking the pizza only five minutes after I took it out of the fridge. Probably not the best idea.
  • Baked for 10 minutes on pan, then 3 directly on the stone. This long bake time was unusual, as I've been baking other pizzas for about 9+2 with the current oven setup. The extra bake time probably resulted from: 1) Putting such a cold pizza in the oven; and 2) Perhaps the stone not being as hot as it was the other day, since I didn't preheat it under the broiler. (I could really use an IR thermometer.)
  • Crust was dense and tough. I don't know if y'all can tell this from the first pic in the previous post, but that spot on the right side of the pizza where the crust splits is a sign of a dense, tough crust. So if you see that, and I tell you the pizza was awesome, you should be able to figure out that I'm lying. Fortunately for you, that won't happen.
  • This one wasn’t nearly as good as I'd hoped, mostly because of the tough crust, but I am still on the right track.
  • Even with a thicker crust than usual, this one didn’t turn out bready, which always seems to have happened when I’ve gone this thick before. So that's good.
  • Even though I rolled the skin thicker than normal, it was still thinner than present-day Tommy’s pizza, and it also turned out thinner than most of the other pizzas I've made lately. (Like I said, this one was dense.)
  • The outer bottom of the crust still doesn't take the shape of the pan. This might indicate that I should increase the hydration even further. (Note: I consider this a characteristic of modern Tommy's pizza, not classic Tommy's pizza.)

I'm getting into a bad habit of making too many big changes from one pizza to the next. For example, I bulk fermented this one cold, rolled it without giving it a two-hour warm-up period, and started baking when it was still cold, which is all quite a bit different than what I had been doing.

I won't be making one of these either today or tomorrow. (NY style pizza today; outta town tomorrow.) In fact, I'm thinking about taking a break from making pizza after I run out of cheese in several days. Once the cheese is gone, I will have gone through 14 or 15 lbs of cheese since August 7.

Can anyone try to help me think of reasons why a crust like this may end up dense and tough? The first things that come to mind are: 1) Gluten overdevelopment; 2) Overfermented dough; 3) Underfermented dough; 4) Excessive rolling. Any other ideas?
Ryan
http://www.ryanspizzablog.blogspot.com

Disclaimer: Don't necessarily believe anything I say here. My brain ain't quite right anymore (unless it is). If I come off as rude or argumentative, that's probably not my intention. Rather, that's just me being honest, to myself and everyone else; partly because I don't have enough time left to BS either you or myself. If you are offended by anything I say, it's probably because you think lying to people (to be "polite") is a good idea. I don't.

Offline chrisgraff

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Re: Tommy's Pizza (Columbus OH) - Any recipe ideas
« Reply #249 on: September 06, 2012, 01:54:05 PM »

Can anyone try to help me think of reasons why a crust like this may end up dense and tough? The first things that come to mind are: 1) Gluten overdevelopment; 2) Overfermented dough; 3) Underfermented dough; 4) Excessive rolling. Any other ideas?

52% hydration is your limit with heavy bench flour?  At some point, those two variables are going to come into play.