Author Topic: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc  (Read 6556 times)

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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #40 on: December 07, 2010, 10:10:10 PM »
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Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #41 on: December 07, 2010, 10:12:03 PM »
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Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #42 on: December 08, 2010, 08:22:13 AM »
Steve (Ev) also made a Fairmont Bagel Dough to bring to market, to try a replicate the Fairmont Bagel Pizza we made last week.  We both really thought the Fairmont Bagel Pizza was the best, so he also tried to replicate what I did last week.  Steve made his Fairmont Bagel Pizza with IDY.  He made two doughs on Sunday.  He baked the one dough at his home on Monday and brought the other dough to market yesterday.  I just had time this morning to resize the pictures from his Bagel Pie we made at market yesterday.  What I found interesting was his dough seemed much higher in hydration and wasnít dry like my dough. Steve dough had more bubbles in the opened skin and was easy to open. His bagel dough did bake well in my deck oven and had good oven spring.  Neither my Bagel Dough yesterday or Steveís Bagel dough, were like last week.  With each experiment it does make me believe just one variable can change a pizza.  I guess it is back to the drawing board for Steve and myself.   :-D  Steve also used different flours in his bagel dough.

Steve said his Bagel Dough pizza he made at home didnít have the same crust flavor as last weeks pizza either.  Steve said he wanted to try IDY to see if he could make the same pizza.  If Steve wants to comment on his pizza yesterday, these are the pictures of the pizza of his Bagel Pizza.

Steve and I both want to replicate the same pizza I made the dough for last week.

Pictures below

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #43 on: December 08, 2010, 08:26:04 AM »
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Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #44 on: December 08, 2010, 08:28:35 AM »
end of pictures

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #45 on: December 12, 2010, 12:19:05 PM »
This is the second experiment I am doing with the milk kefir poolish starter.  I had wanted to see if the milk kefir starter could be left to ferment, then refrigerated and then taken out to ferment again, before it is incorporated into the final dough.  So far in the first experiment the milk kefir poolish does seem to hibernate, when placed into the refrigerator.  Then when it is placed in the oven with the light on it quickly comes to life. 

I am going to make another bagel dough today with the milk kefir poolish I had refrigerated.  I will bake the pizza Tuesday.  I also am going to up the hydration of the dough and will measure how much more water is needed.

The reason I am doing these experiments is to see if a milk kefir poolish could be left to ferment, then refrigerated for different varying amounts of days and still be used in the final dough to make a decent pizza.  If this works, I could then let the milk kefir poolish ferment one day and then maybe on another day, make the final dough at market.  In theory this sounds good to me, but at this time I donít know how it will work.  ::)

Pictures below of milk kefir poolish before it went back into the oven with the light on.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #46 on: December 13, 2010, 09:59:35 AM »
I made this milk kefir poolish baglel dough yesterday.  I just want to note what I did different to see what these experiments might produce. I will list what I did different. 

1.  I used 150 grams of KASL and 95 grams of durum flour mixed in sifter
2.  I wanted to see if a longer mix time at high speeds would affect this dough.  I mixed on speed                               10 of my Kitchen Aid Professional Pro mixer for 20 minutes. 
3.  Let dough autolyse for 25 minutes.
4.  Added salt and oil and mixed on speed 10 for10 more minutes. 
5.  This dough is very sticky, as can been seen in the pictures.  It almost looks like a cake dough.
6.  I measured the grams this time of 2 medium brown eggs and the weight was 105 grams
7.  Left dough bulk ferment for 3 hrs. and balled or stretch and folded dough 4 times.
8.  Balled with oil and left dough ball ferment at ambient room temperatures for 1 more hour
9.  This milk kefir poolish was made and then refrigerated and then taken out of the refrigerator         
     to warm before making this dough.
Pictures below

Norma
« Last Edit: December 13, 2010, 10:04:30 AM by norma427 »
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #47 on: December 14, 2010, 10:11:07 PM »
Some of my conclusions for this experiment are this milk keifr bagel dough can be mixed at high speeds for a very long time and still get oven spring and also bake into a decent pizza.  This bagel dough pizza was a white pizza and I used the recipe for the dressing that Bill gave me at Reply # 47 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,10213.msg89914.html#msg89914 Thanks Bill, the white BBQ sauce was really good on this pizza.  ;D I did also dressed this pie with mozzarella after putting the white BBQ sauce on the opened skin.

I donít know about other doughs, but this dough was really sticky and almost looked like a cake batter.  It with-stood all the rigorous mixing.  I now wonder how many kinds of doughs can be mixed for a very long time.   ::)

Pictures below,

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #48 on: December 14, 2010, 10:13:37 PM »
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Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #49 on: December 14, 2010, 10:15:27 PM »
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Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #50 on: December 14, 2010, 10:17:26 PM »
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Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #51 on: December 14, 2010, 10:19:38 PM »
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Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #52 on: December 14, 2010, 10:21:33 PM »
end of pictures

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #53 on: December 14, 2010, 10:30:51 PM »
Norma,  that pizza looks amazingly good.  How was it?  -marc

Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #54 on: December 14, 2010, 11:38:09 PM »
Norma,  that pizza looks amazingly good.  How was it?  -marc

Marc,

Thanks for saying the pizza looked amazingly good.  :)  It was really good.  I would never thought a bagel dough could make a good pizza, but it can.  It still didn't have the same taste as my first attempt.  I don't know why, but can now see that some doughs for pizza can be mixed for a long while. 

Thanks for starting your thread about the Fairmont Bagels.  ;D  I am having fun with these experiments with the bagel dough.  Did you try a bagel dough pizza?

Norma
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Offline chickenparm

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #55 on: December 15, 2010, 11:20:30 PM »
Wow,I really loved reading this topic!

I am a bread person...I love good breads,hard rolls and bagels.

Those pizzas looks great and fantastic spring...I wish I could sample some of those.

I will be sure to try the recipe after I get my mixer...I am really impressed Norma,you have outdone yourself again and again.Looking forward to more of your experiments and pizzas!
 :chef:
-Bill

Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #56 on: December 15, 2010, 11:50:23 PM »
Wow,I really loved reading this topic!

I am a bread person...I love good breads,hard rolls and bagels.

Those pizzas looks great and fantastic spring...I wish I could sample some of those.

I will be sure to try the recipe after I get my mixer...I am really impressed Norma,you have outdone yourself again and again.Looking forward to more of your experiments and pizzas!
 :chef:

Bill,

Great to hear you are a bread person.  :) I love good breads, hard rolls and bagels, too.  Thanks for saying the Fairmont pizzas look great.  I still canít understand how this last pizza got so much oven spring, but think it was from whatever hydration there was in the dough.  The dough was something like a Tartine dough.  I learned a lot from reading the Tartine book and being able to then work with a higher hydration dough. 

Thanks for saying you will try this recipe after you get your mixer.  It was only a few months ago, that I bought a mixer for home.  Before that I either mixed the dough in my food processor, by hand, or even with my hand electric mix a few times.  I love to experiment and see what happens when making different kinds of pizzas.  I tried this really long mixing time for this last pizza and I never thought the dough would come out okay. 

You should look at Marcís thread on the Fairmont bagels if you like bagels.  His bagels did turn out well.

Keep up your experimenting.  ;D  Not to long ago, I really didnít know anything about pizzamaking.

Norma
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Offline chickenparm

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #57 on: December 16, 2010, 12:04:37 AM »
Norma,
I wanted to ask,do you know how to cook a pizza dough ball into a fine bread?

The reason I ask,I took 2 of the dough balls and shaped them so they would be in somewhat of a circle and I cooked them that way.

They blew up into a nice crusted covered ball of bread.But the insides were still a bit gooey when I cut it open when I thought they were done...so I cooked them cut in half a little longer until the inside was done.

It was one of the best tasting bread I have had in a long time...I did not even need sauce or anything to add to it...it tasted that good!

See,where I live,no one sells hard rolls,French or Italian breads that have a thicker,crispier crust,like the one I made or grew up on in NY.

Sure,the stores around here sell their version of it,but its too soft,no real crust and lacking flavor.Does not CRUNCH on the outside the way I want it to.

Im trying to find the right temps and time to cook a dough ball into a roll and reap the benefits.I was wondering if you knew a little about that?

Do I need to add a pan of water and steam the elec oven as well?I cooked it on a pizza stone around 475 for about 15-20 minutes.Best crust I ever had but not quite done on the inside...I want to make bread from these dough balls I have but not sure how...do I need to poke holes or cut them across the top or something to aid the internals to cook right?Lower my temps and increase cook times?

Thanks for any ideas.
 :)








-Bill

Offline norma427

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #58 on: December 16, 2010, 12:37:21 AM »
Norma,
I wanted to ask,do you know how to cook a pizza dough ball into a fine bread?

The reason I ask,I took 2 of the dough balls and shaped them so they would be in somewhat of a circle and I cooked them that way.

They blew up into a nice crusted covered ball of bread.But the insides were still a bit gooey when I cut it open when I thought they were done...so I cooked them cut in half a little longer until the inside was done.

It was one of the best tasting bread I have had in a long time...I did not even need sauce or anything to add to it...it tasted that good!

See,where I live,no one sells hard rolls,French or Italian breads that have a thicker,crispier crust,like the one I made or grew up on in NY.

Sure,the stores around here sell their version of it,but its too soft,no real crust and lacking flavor.Does not CRUNCH on the outside the way I want it to.

Im trying to find the right temps and time to cook a dough ball into a roll and reap the benefits.I was wondering if you knew a little about that?

Do I need to add a pan of water and steam the elec oven as well?I cooked it on a pizza stone around 475 for about 15-20 minutes.Best crust I ever had but not quite done on the inside...I want to make bread from these dough balls I have but not sure how...do I need to poke holes or cut them across the top or something to aid the internals to cook right?Lower my temps and increase cook times?

Thanks for any ideas.
 :)











Bill,

A few times I did use pizza dough to make bread.  You can see what I did at these threads.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11763.msg108975.html#msg108975

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11792.0.html

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9908.msg109397.html#msg109397

I also made pizza muffins from pizza dough.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,10626.0.html

I have tried many other things with pizza dough and they all seem to turn out okay.

I think you need to tap on the dough to see if it sounds hollow to make a bigger loaf of bread with pizza dough.  It is hard to judge how well the inside is done, unless you use a thermometer.

I am not an expert on bread making and am just learning myself.  As far as bake times and temperatures, if you look at other members breads or on the internet you can see what temperatures to use to bake bread.  I did make the Tartine Bread a few times, but I also have to get more equipment before I try that bread again.

I believe that pizza dough can be made into bread as you have found out.  Keep experimenting.  ;D

Norma
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Offline chickenparm

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Re: Fairmont Bagel Pizza, Thanks to Marc
« Reply #59 on: December 16, 2010, 01:09:46 AM »
Norma,
Thanks so much! I enjoyed looking at those links and really appreciate the info.You are truly an asset to this forum and your willing to share anything info wise is a blessing for us all.
 :)

I have just started out myself about the bread Idea so anything I learn along the way,I will pass it here too.

I am going to use a lower temp to 375 tonight and cook a bit longer to see if that will help...I had noticed the first times I did it,the outside crust was perfect,but the inside was not done.I will also try and shape the dough a bit differently and try to make it to where it will possibly cook more evenly,than taking a chance on a tighter ball that can't do much except rise up,leaving the insides not done.
 :D
-Bill


 

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