Author Topic: Is it my ADY or is it me?  (Read 798 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline PizzaHog

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 542
  • Location: Clinton Township, MI
  • Heat matters!
Is it my ADY or is it me?
« on: January 05, 2011, 06:03:30 PM »
Over the holidays my IDY finally gave out, so a house guest picked up one of those 3 envelope packs of Red Star ADY.  I never used ADY before but it worked out great.  All I did was throw it into about a 1/4 to 1/3 cup of 107 degree water with a pinch of sugar for a few minutes first.  The kitchen was full of guests and hubub, my 7 year old nephew was "helping" me, and I did nothing else different from normal.
One week or so later I use the ADY again, 2nd envelope, same casual process, but the dough never rises!
2 days later I try again with the 3rd envelope but paid more attention.  Dissolved a pinch of sugar into 111.5 degree 1/3 cup of water, add ADY & stir well but gently, let sit for exactly 10 minutes.  In the mixer, the balance of the formula water was at 56 degrees (tap temp as in prev attempts) with 1.5% salt already dissolved, flour was added but not yet mixed, yeast water added on top of the flour, then mixed.  The finished dough temp was 71 degrees, and it did not rise either!
Am I doing something wrong here???


Offline Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 22449
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Is it my ADY or is it me?
« Reply #1 on: January 05, 2011, 06:14:03 PM »
Hog,

How much flour and ADY did you use and how was the dough fermented and for how long?

Peter

Offline PizzaHog

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 542
  • Location: Clinton Township, MI
  • Heat matters!
Re: Is it my ADY or is it me?
« Reply #2 on: January 05, 2011, 06:38:29 PM »
Hey Peter
Frist attempt that worked, expanded 50% (from 1 to 1.5" using your seed method) after 2 hours room temp bulk rise.
Flour (100%):    767.06 g  |  27.06 oz | 1.69 lbs
Water (62%):    475.58 g  |  16.78 oz | 1.05 lbs
ADY (0.7%):    5.37 g | 0.19 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.42 tsp | 0.47 tbsp
Salt (2.5%):    19.18 g | 0.68 oz | 0.04 lbs | 3.44 tsp | 1.15 tbsp
Olive Oil (2%):    15.34 g | 0.54 oz | 0.03 lbs | 3.41 tsp | 1.14 tbsp
Total (167.2%):   1282.52 g | 45.24 oz | 2.83 lbs | TF = 0.1
Single Ball:   320.63 g | 11.31 oz | 0.71 lbs

2nd & 3rd attempts were diff pies, nuttin' after 24 hours at room temp.  3rd try I upped the ADY to 1 1/2 tsp as well.
Flour (100%):       423.93 g  |  14.95 oz | 0.93 lbs
Water (85%):       360.34 g  |  12.71 oz | 0.79 lbs
ADY (0.75%):                 3.18 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.84 tsp | 0.28 tbsp
Salt (1.5%):       6.36 g | 0.22 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.14 tsp | 0.38 tbsp
Total (187.25%):                793.8 g | 28 oz | 1.75 lbs | TF = 0.2

Thanks,

Hog

Offline Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 22449
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Is it my ADY or is it me?
« Reply #3 on: January 05, 2011, 07:19:26 PM »
Hog,

I think what might have happened is that the dough you made using the second dough formulation peaked and then fell back on itself, leading you to believe that it had not risen, especially if you were not watching the dough for the entire 24 hours of fermentation at room temperature. I mention this possibility because the second dough formulation you posted, with a hydration of 85%, represents a dough that falls between a poolish and a sponge, both of which peak at some point and then recede. Usually, for a 24 hour room temperature fermentation for either a poolish or sponge, you only need to use about 0.05% ADY or possibly a bit more because of the inclusion of the salt. That is for a room temperature of around 80-85 degrees F and using water at a temperature of around 60 degrees F. With 0.75% ADY, and even more for the third try, the dough should have peaked and then receded within a few hours, not 24 hours. It is quite possible that the dough overfermented after 24 hours of room temperature, with its demise most likely occurring long before the expiration of 24 hours. The first dough formulation you posted had a more normal hydration of 62% and, with ADY at 0.70%, the dough behaved as it should, better than doubling after 2 hours. It was really an emergency dough and behaved like one. Your second and third doughs were also emergency type doughs but with a faster fermentation because of the much higher hydration.

Peter

Offline PizzaHog

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 542
  • Location: Clinton Township, MI
  • Heat matters!
Re: Is it my ADY or is it me?
« Reply #4 on: January 06, 2011, 11:34:17 AM »
Peter
Yup, these were all emergency forumulas never intended to ferment 24 hours, that is just how long I waited before tossing them out.  I was not able to monitor the failed doughs so your idea that they rose and fell before I got back to them may be the answer.
Do you see any errors in the process I used to activate the ADY?  I just want to be sure I didn't kill the yeasties or prevent them from activating.
Thanks
Hog

Offline Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 22449
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Is it my ADY or is it me?
« Reply #5 on: January 06, 2011, 12:04:02 PM »
Hog,

The way you rehydrated the ADY was fine. Technically, one should use about 4 or 5 times the weight of the ADY in water at around 105 degrees F for about 10 minutes. However, using more water usually isn't a problem. The rest of the formula water (the water not used to rehydrate the ADY) should be at a temperature to achieve the desired finished dough temperature. I usually don't add any sugar to the water of rehydration but a pinch won't hurt. You just don't want to put all of the sugar in with the water of rehydration. The same applies to the salt.

Peter


 

pizzapan