Jackie Tran's review of Pizzeria Bianco - Part Deux

[Tampa]

JT,

I love the detailed and honest review.  Thanks for all you contribute to this forum.

FWIIW, Peter Taylor at Wood Fired in Tampa said the same thing - "It's easier to make a great pie at home than it is in a commercial setting".

In a humorous way, I can see you becoming the Mike Wallace of the pizza business.  With all your experience and expertise, pizzaiolos may cringe when you walk through the door.  That reminds me.  Months ago, I invited you to join one of our Tampa pizza parties.  Now, I'm not so sure.

Dave

[Jackie Tran]

I'm sure running a pizzeria is no walk in the park.  I've always thought that having a pizzeria would take the fun out of pizza making for me.  I just couldn't imagine trying to stress the importance of such and such to people I have to trust with making the pizza.  They fact that so many pizzerias can turn out great pizza is a testament though. 

Dave it's really good to hear from you.  Am I going to have to keep doing pizza reviews so we can catch up? 

I would really love to come down sometime.  There's a lot of places I would really love to visit.  I'm not sure if you have anything to worry about though.  From what I hear, you guys are eatin' some pretty good pies in your neck of the woods lately.   

Chau

[pcampbell]

great review.  i could use some bianco right now.  it is great that you got to talk to him... i am usually afraid to.  i havent been there since he stopped making the actual pizzas.

just 1 note from the all natural police!  i don't think chris would use polly O.  I believe it has Titanium dioxide in it... which as i understand it is a white dye.  why we would need to dye milk white, i dont know.

[StrayBullet]

Awesome write-up!!!!  I need to take the time and talk about the place I ate at in Raleigh this week

In a humorous way, I can see you becoming the Mike Wallace of the pizza business.  With all your experience and expertise, pizzaiolos may cringe when you walk through the door.  That reminds me.  Months ago, I invited you to join one of our Tampa pizza parties.  Now, I'm not so sure.

Dave

Even after your visit tonight?   I think I might be able to make it less than a cake-walk 

[thezaman]

   JT, that was a great review ,thanks for posting it. you got a lot of really good information from him. i will bet his hydration is over 70 percent based on how the dough falls to gravity. you probably couldn't use the slap technique with such a wet dough. his longer baking times wouldn't work with caputo flour it would be tough not light as you described his crust. again thanks for the review!!!!

[pennygirl]

First post worthy I'd say. Your post officially brought me out of the shadows.  It takes balls to do what you did Chau...and you really do come off as someone who was thinking of others in seeking Bianco's knowledge. So thank you.

Was wondering if you noticed a gumminess in his pies at all. The layer that can appear under the sauce? Hope you understand what I'm talking about. I'm just questioning whether I'm seeing that correctly in your pictures and if that is in fact a negative after all??

your efforts here don't go unappreciated.

[gtsum2]

Hey Chau,

Great writeup and review!  Your efforts are certainly appreciated here by many I am sure (for sure me!!).  I hope things are going well for you and yours.  Again, thanks for the in depth write up!

Shaun

[thezaman]

Chau, can you comment on the sauce, did it have herbs in it, or was it just a salted plum tomato?

[Jackie Tran]

Thanks for replies and comments guys, I really appreciate it.

Thezaman, regarding caputo and lower temps.   Some of my best pies have been made with 75-80% 00 and the rest HG flour and baked between 3-4m.   I'm talking about a crust that exceeds the Bianco crust I had.   IMO, the dryness issue is one of hydration rather than the 00 flour as I've had NP pies that were baked in 70 sec range in a wfo that was still dry.   The hard thing about caputo 00 and a higher hydration is that it makes it more difficult to develop the proper amount of gluten.  If the gluten is over developed and/or the dough is overfermented (and especially if using starters), the crumb can toughen up or dry out.   So it's harder to do for sure, but I have found it to make a better crust for my taste at lower temps and a 3-4 min bake. 

Regarding the sauce.  I scraped up the little sauce I could find to taste it by itself but couldn't get enough to make a judgment.  I couldn't visually see any herbs in it.  My guess is that it's tomatoes alone but I really don't know.   At one point I did remember thinking of asking for a bowl of sauce to dip my crust in but then I didn't.

Chau

[Jackie Tran]

Was wondering if you noticed a gumminess in his pies at all. The layer that can appear under the sauce? Hope you understand what I'm talking about. I'm just questioning whether I'm seeing that correctly in your pictures and if that is in fact a negative after all??

Thank you for the kind words PG.  I really do need to invest in a better camera.  As far as a gum layer, I did not notice one on the margherita.   I think the high heat of the WFO prevents a lot of that. 

Chau

[Jackie Tran]

Finally got a chance to upload the video on the dough opening technique.   

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bLR6yDwqzaM

[thezaman]

that is really cool,thanks!!

[Jackie Tran]

He's not as fast but it looks to be the same technique as Chris'.  Here we have a slo mo version of it.

[ponzu]

JT,

Great review.  It's a shame Chris can't make his own pies anymore.  I still really want to try his pies.

If you won't consent to open your own pizza place I think the "Mike Wallace of pizza journalists" would be a worthy title for your skills as an interviewer.

AZ

[pennygirl]

Just revisited this thread JT as i do many of your posts and watched that video again. I missed that Bianco and co. do quite the opposite of creating a full rimmed cornicione. They seem to slap it flat almost. Did you notice this and have you practiced this technique? Seems it would compromise crumb structure, no?

I'm so used to seeing many carefully pat in a rim with their fingertips and would do anything to avoid damaging it. Struck me as interesting is all. Wouldn't have picked that up if it weren't for you sharing. Thanks is the norm with you.

[Jackie Tran]

Thanks PG. I did a little experiment sometime ago asking the same thing, if pressing the rim makes a difference.  
You can read it here if you'd like.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11075.0.html

I found that pressing the rim does make a difference if you are baking at lower temps.  I don't know an exact temp but this likely includes a conventional bake in the home oven.  It seem to also make a difference when I was baking in my primo ceramic oven at stone temps of 650-700F.   When I was able to visit with member Bill/SFNM, Bill suggested that we repeat the test in his WFO and witness the opposite effect.  No matter how much the rim was pressed, the extreme heat of a WFO created immense oven spring.  

After making so many pies in half baked ovens  , I have gotten into the habit of not pressing the rim.

Chau