Sweet Sauce Pizza (Schuylkill County, PA)

[expo7290]

Good day all!

  I have lived in NE Pennsylvania about 90% of my life, but in the last few years have become addicted to "sweet sauce" pizza.  It is primarily made in Schuylkill county (Frackville, Girardville, Ashland).  It is a plain red sauce (no herbs) and is (I think) made from either a puree or paste.  I'm not quite sure what is added to the sauce to make it so sweet and tasty.  If anyone on this site either lives in or around the area (coal region, baby!) and knows what most of the places add to their sauce or knows someone, please post something on this thread.  I would appreciate it tremendously.  Looking to do some home cloning.

Thanks for your time!

[Chet]

 There is a pizza place in Frackville that I think is run out of a house and makes pizza only a few times a week, their sauce is sweet and when I was told it was sweetened by grape jelly, I was shocked.


   Chet

[expo7290]

Which place? 

The Pizza Place on 61? 

  I have heard stories of jellies of various flavors, but nothing definitive.  Do you have evidence of this, or is this a "he said, she said" kind of a deal (no offense meant)?  I tried raspberry jelly a while back, b/c I heard that's what Centiole's uses.  I have heard brown sugar...I think that's what I'm going to try next.  I will experiment a little more in the coming week and let everyone know how it's coming.

[jeffereynelson]

I used browns sugar in some of my pizzas a while ago. I think it was a pretty good way to sweeten it up. I just came to learn it kinda covers the tomato taste.

[Tscarborough]

I use jelly in most of my BBQ sauces, and brown sugar in my pizza sauce.

[expo7290]

What flavor of jelly?

[Tscarborough]

It depends.  Sometimes blackberry, sometimes cherry, but usually plain grape. 

[buceriasdon]

yep, grape

[expo7290]

Do you have quantities of jelly you may suggest for a tomato/pizza sauce.  I'm going to try to make the sauce in small batches as not to waste much if I don't care for it.

I think I'm going to go with a combination of brown sugar and jelly on one and straight brown sugar on the second pizza.

[Tscarborough]

I have not put jelly in pizza sauce, and I cook BBQ sauce at higher heat.  Regarding sugar, for 2-28oz cans of tomatoes, I start with 1 tsb of turbinado sugar, and usually end up using between 2 and three.  As I low heat, slow cook it, I add it in small increments until the salt, acidity, and sweetness are balanced.

[buceriasdon]

I had to dig through my notes for my experiments for a sweet pizza sauce that Mexicans would like. This appears to be my final recipe. For about three cups of diced canned tomatos with 2Tbs. tomato puree, try 1tsp. no seed grape jelly. Yea, the squeezable stuff. I use SW brand tomatos because it's available. It really does not take a lot of jelly depending of course on the sweetness of the tomato sauce. I throw it all in a food processor and take the larger lumps out only. My notes say 2Tbs. olive oil and 1Tbs. dried oregano. Too sweet for me but my Mexican friends loved it. It does give a certain flavor that is hard to describe. Enough for two medium pizzas. Good luck. I don't mean for you to slavishly copy this but use as a starting point.
Don

Do you have quantities of jelly you may suggest for a tomato/pizza sauce.  I'm going to try to make the sauce in small batches as not to waste much if I don't care for it.

I think I'm going to go with a combination of brown sugar and jelly on one and straight brown sugar on the second pizza.

[Tscarborough]

It is all about the balance.  Acidity, sweetness, and saltiness.  Those all have to be in balance, but there is no way to quantify it for a recipe.  You have to adjust for your taste.

[expo7290]

Thanks for your input folks.  I looked at the sugar content of jelly and it's almost 1:1 with brown sugar, so I think I'll start with the 1/2 and 1/2 first.  I'm going to use puree with some water and add the sweeteners from there.

Keep the input coming!  I appreciate it tremendously!

[mmac06]

Thanks for your input folks.  I looked at the sugar content of jelly and it's almost 1:1 with brown sugar, so I think I'll start with the 1/2 and 1/2 first.  I'm going to use puree with some water and add the sweeteners from there.

Keep the input coming!  I appreciate it tremendously!

Did you ever try this?? It sounds really interesting. I know it's been a few months since anyone has posted here. I was thinking of substituting the grape jelly for sugar in my variation of Red November's sauce. His original recipe calls for:

 14g sugar (~3.5 tsp) to  28 oz can of tomato puree.

Any thoughts on how much jelly I should try or if it's even worth it?

[Bob1]

I finally got around to checking out Centriole's in Girardsville, PA.  It has been in operation since 1930 and is very unique.  Girardville is just off the junction of 61 and 81 on the way to Knoebel's amusement park.  To sum it up quick here is an article.

http://www.winetastetv.com/blogs/365-days/2493/whatwinegoeswithcultpizzaoeareportfromcentiolesingirardvillepennsylvania

This article is no exaggeration.  I have tried calling them for some time but never got through until yesterday.  I called Saturday at 10am for a 6pm pie but 8pm was the earliest they could fit me in.  Apparently they only serve from Thursday to Saturday and they sell out every day.  I arrived 1/2 hour early and got to watch the operation.  There was a women and a younger man prepping the pies and another women that cooked and boxed.  Everyone was very nice.  The side room (kitchen) of the house is so small that the standard pizza oven took up 30% of the space.  I would say that only six people could fit.  The pizza was interesting. It is cooked in seasoned steel pans about 1/2 high.  Probably 10 x 16 since the box measures 13x13.  I have never had Detroit style but I assume is similar.  The interesting thing is the prep.  They pre-pan all the skins and dimple them.  These raised skins are then prepared.  They fold the dough in 1/2 on top of itself and use a paint brush to oil the pan.  They then do the other side and re-dimple the dough again.  This second dimple is done with both hands for at least 4 passes.  The interesting thing is that it is not raised  after that.  They just sauce, cheese, and bake.  This is opposite of what I have ever done.  It works for the overall product because the dimples hold the sauce so the cheese does not float.  This is important because the cheese is a very tough Provalone that needs the dough backing to bite it correctly.  Please note the pictures below on how dense the crumb is.  You can also see the dimples.   The cheese they use is ground very fine and ball like. 

Now for Expo7290's question about the sauce.   It is very sweet and works well with the whole product.  When they used the boat ladle to apply the sauce it was actually a good 1/2 inch higher than the sides of the ladle.  This gives you an idea of how thick it is.  It did not seem too complex as some places can be.  I would guess that it is cut with honey or dissolved brown sugar with clove added.  If I were going to clone this I would purchase Bonta extra thick pizza sauce or the Stanislaus counter part.  These products are basically sweet tomato paste, and do not need much help, so take the addition slow until you reach the desired taste.  For the cheese I would get a hard mild provalone but definitely not a product like Grande.  You do not want creamy.  Note on the picture how the cheese pulls of like a scab on a child's knee (Eeew).  It was very tough to the bite.  I would also follow the Victory Pig thread for the dough but not let it rise after the last dimpling.  I would also cut back on the yeast a bit.  The thickness factory may have to go up a tad too because of the shear density of the dough.  I would also guess you would want a hot oven at about 525 to 550 to get the same burnt cheese affect.  The bottom was lightly browned but the tinfoiled box combined with the heat of the final product softened it,  In fact I had trouble carrying it because it was so hot.

It was great to see an institution like this still around.  I liked the taste and can see why they have a die hard following.  For me though it was a bit too much.  I would only eat it occasionally because of the digestability factor and sweetness.  When consuming that much cheese fat with sugar the pounds just add right up.   

One other note would be that they give you a tomato based hot dipping sauce to go with the pie.   

[Bob1]

Opps,  I always forget something.  If I were to you use the Victory Pig dough I would also cut back on the water 8 to 10% when trying to clone this.

[Pete-zza]

Bob1,

Nice post. You might also want to repost what you wrote in the Pizzeria & Restaurant Reviews board of the forum.

Peter

[Bob1]

Thank you Peter,
I will also post it there