Author Topic: New Formula advice  (Read 5607 times)

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Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #20 on: March 23, 2011, 08:46:27 PM »
Mike to keep it simple, just ball them before going into the fridge.  You can always reball a few of them after 4 hours or so to see the difference that makes. 

I forgot to mention that after I ball the dough up and before placing them into each glad container,  I will very lightly oil the bottoms of the container.  I'll also rub oil over my hands and pat the balls gently coating the topside surface of the doughball.  I find this helps prevent the balls from skinning over.   

Good luck and do post some pictures.

Chau


Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #21 on: March 23, 2011, 10:13:22 PM »
Well I made my dough I will ball 3 and bulk 3 and ball those in the am around 6 hours after being made i know I'm obsessed but Im not gonna wake up St 3 am to ball ny dough lol

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #22 on: March 24, 2011, 01:49:31 AM »
So....did you mix it in the mixer or by hand?  How did the dough feel?  Any different than normal?  Did you take a picture of the balled dough before cold fermenting so we have something to compare to?

Chau

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #23 on: March 24, 2011, 08:27:57 AM »
yes I mixed by hand def was different but wasnt bad at all. I will post pics below.
1 is my start up
2 is rough ball after the hand mix sticky but not as sticky as Varasano's
3 Side view of first ball which I balled 3 after 1 hour
4 the 3 balls and the bulk ferment right before going in fridge
5 Top view of the ball
6 Top of  ball after 7 hours in fridge
7 After 8 hours in fridge the bulk ferment
8 and 9 bottom and side view of ball after 7 hours in fridge

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #24 on: March 24, 2011, 08:28:35 AM »
Last pic balled after the bulk ferment

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #25 on: March 24, 2011, 09:55:00 AM »
Mike, the balled dough after cold fermentation looks very nice.  :chef:

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #26 on: March 24, 2011, 09:59:12 AM »
Jackie I was scared that after i balled them due to cold ferment the balls wouldnt form nicely but they did better than the ones I balled right away
. They are way smoother!! Anyway I will take pics of the dough when I get home to show you the process further along. Looks ok so far right?

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #27 on: March 24, 2011, 10:03:24 AM »
Looks awesome so far.  Let's see how they do over the next couple of days.  I had you do both methods because it's hard to know exactly without feeling the dough myself.  Go ahead and reball any balls that haven't been already.

Chau

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #28 on: March 24, 2011, 10:14:01 AM »
Well the other 3 I balled right away after the hour bulf ferment before the cold ferment. You think I need to reball those?

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #29 on: March 24, 2011, 10:17:19 AM »
Well the other 3 I balled right away after the hour bulf ferment before the cold ferment. You think I need to reball those?

Well depending on what they look like now.  Can you post a pic of each side by side?  One reballed early and one reballed later.  The smooth reballed ones will relax and soften up after the next 24-48 hours.

How many balls total did you make and how many balled early vs later?
« Last Edit: March 24, 2011, 10:22:59 AM by Jackie Tran »


Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #30 on: March 24, 2011, 10:24:54 AM »
I did 3 and 3. I balled 3 right away befor cold ferment and I posted all the pics. I balled the 3 after the bulk cold ferment (smooth ones) this morning.

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #31 on: March 24, 2011, 10:33:12 AM »
I did 3 and 3. I balled 3 right away befor cold ferment and I posted all the pics. I balled the 3 after the bulk cold ferment (smooth ones) this morning.

Ok just leave them be for now.  We'll take a look tonight at the 24hr mark.  I have a feeling that the early balled ones may need more strength.
« Last Edit: March 24, 2011, 10:36:50 AM by Jackie Tran »

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #32 on: March 24, 2011, 10:34:35 AM »
Ok I will take pics tonight and post. I think the smooth ones will be fine.

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #33 on: March 24, 2011, 10:43:25 AM »
Ok I will take pics tonight and post. I think the smooth ones will be fine.

Yes I agree, we don't want to mess with the smooth ones.  If they don't overfermemt by Saturday night, they should make good pies.  Did you remember to put a very thin layer of oil over the smooth ones?

Tonight I may have you wrestle one of the early balled ones out of the container to reball with a maximum of 2-3 small folds and then pinch seal the bottom.   Definitely don't want to overdo it at this point.  You can do the other 2 depending on how soft they feel.  But that's later.

Ttyl,
Chau
« Last Edit: March 24, 2011, 10:45:19 AM by Jackie Tran »

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #34 on: March 24, 2011, 10:48:41 AM »
yes I did oil those. I will be baking pies around 6pm sat night. So by reballing I am strengthening the gluten?

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #35 on: March 24, 2011, 10:55:04 AM »
Yes, time along with balling and stretch and folds help build gluten and strengthen the gluten matrix.

Did you use starter and yeast or just starter?  Also how did you determine the starter was active enough to use?

Chau

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #36 on: March 24, 2011, 10:56:47 AM »
I used 10 percent starter of total weight and a pinch of IDY. I had this starter for 2 weeks feeding and using some. It was def active bubbly and foamy. I can take a pic of my starter jar when i get home and I fed it this morning so Im sure its bubbling again.

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #37 on: March 24, 2011, 01:07:38 PM »
Jackie would that be correct foamy and bubbly?

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #38 on: March 24, 2011, 02:07:12 PM »
Jackie would that be correct foamy and bubbly?

Yes foamy and bubbly indicates an active starter.  You can also use the float test as discussed in the Tartine book.  Take a bit of starter and drop it into a bowl of water.  If it floats or as soon as it floats, it's ready to use.  If it sinks then give it more time.   At the point that the starter starts to float, it's a young starter.   If you allow the starter to sit and get even more active it will continue to float for a good while developing more acids.  As the starter rises after being fed, it will continue to rise and then top off or dome.  At the point that the starter starts to recede in the middle, it is at full maturity.   A young starter vs a mature starter will give different results in texture and taste.  Once the starter starts receding, then it is overmaturing.   I try to look at starters as though it is another piece of dough.   As it ferments, it will get bigger, reach it's peak and then become deflated.  

As a fun exercise next time you go to feed your starter, instead of dumping the excess starter down the drain, leave it in a small bowl to watch it ferment.  I also will taste a small bit of it with the tip of my tongue when the starter is young versus mature.  You can definitely taste the difference in the acid load.  These acids will contribute to the textural and taste differences so you can decide at what point you want to use the starter to get the desired end texture and taste.  

Chau

Offline forzaroma

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Re: New Formula advice
« Reply #39 on: March 24, 2011, 02:13:47 PM »
I never dump it in drain I use it in my dough. I feed my starter by weight 1 ounce of water and one ounce of flour. Should I be adding more? I have a mason jar that I use. Also When I use my starter to add to my dough I give it a stir is this OK to do or should I just pour it in as is? My starter is a bit wet a touch stiffer than a batter.