“Real New York Frozen Dough Balls”..from Brooklyn, NY

[norma427]

I was at the grocery store a little while ago and am always looking for something pizza related.  I found these “Real New York Dough” balls, from Brooklyn, NY.  There are two in a pack.  From what I understand they don’t have any preservatives in them and are supposed to be all natural, unlike most frozen dough balls.  I bought them and might try at market on Tuesday to make one of them into a pizza.  I wonder if there is anyone else that has tried these “Real New York Dough” balls from Brooklyn, NY.  

From what the ingredients read, they look almost like some doughs make on this forum.  Does anyone else think the same thing?

Pictures below

Norma

[chickenparm]

It was hard to read but is the package saying the NY water is the key to its flavor?

Either way look forward to seeing the pies you make from it.Theres is nothing you cannot do with it Norma,you got all the skills to turn even something mediocre or unknown,into something great.
 

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

Some time ago, a member from North Carolina mentioned the "Real New York Dough" balls to me via PM. Not long after that, while I was attending a wedding outside of Raleigh, I found that product in a Harris Teeter supermarket. After reading the material on the package and seeing that the dough balls were for 14" pizzas baked on a pan for about 20 minutes (if I recall correctly), and also that they cost almost $5, I decided to pass on them. Also, I wasn't sure that I would be able to keep the dough balls frozen on the flight home, and refreezing them upon my return didn't strike me as the best thing to do.

Another member recently commented on the "Real New York Dough" product. You might be able to find the posts if you do a forum search (they really didn't say all that much as I recall).

FYI, the thickness factor for 16 ounces of dough used to make a 14" pizza is 0.10394. That is a
value that is greater than what is typically used for most authentic NY street style pizzas.

Peter

[norma427]

It was hard to read but is the package saying the NY water is the key to its flavor?

Either way look forward to seeing the pies you make from it.Theres is nothing you cannot do with it Norma,you got all the skills to turn even something mediocre or unknown,into something great.
 

Bill,

I had to laugh when I read the back of the package and it says:   “It is apparent that the use of New York City water results in producing the most delectable pizza.”   I don’t know, but guess they did use New York water in the dough balls.  Most frozen dough balls I have seen have different “dough conditioners” in them.  That is why I found these dough balls interesting.  They don’t seem to have all the “dough conditioners” other frozen dough balls have.

Thanks for your vote of confidence on me using these dough balls, but I am not sure how they will turn out.  

Norma

[norma427]

Norma,

Some time ago, a member from North Carolina mentioned the "Real New York Dough" balls to me via PM. Not long after that, while I was attending a wedding outside of Raleigh, I found that product in a Harris Teeter supermarket. After reading the material on the package and seeing that the dough balls were for 14" pizzas baked on a pan for about 20 minutes (if I recall correctly), and also that they cost almost $5, I decided to pass on them. Also, I wasn't sure that I would be able to keep the dough balls frozen on the flight home, and refreezing them upon my return didn't strike me as the best thing to do.

Another member recently commented on the "Real New York Dough" product. You might be able to find the posts if you do a forum search (they really didn't say all that much as I recall).

FYI, the thickness factor for 16 ounces of dough used to make a 14" pizza is 0.10394. That is a
value that is greater than what is typically used for most authentic NY street style pizzas.

Peter

Peter,

The package of the “Real New York Frozen Dough Balls” I bought were 3.99 for the package.  I thought that wasn’t too bad to try out this product, since there wasn’t any “dough conditioners” in the dough balls.  You remembered right.  The dough balls are for 14" pizzas.  Since you posted what the TF is for these dough balls by the weight for a 14" pizza, I might try to stretch the dough a little more.  It even says on the back of the package bread can be made with this dough.

It will be interesting to see how the taste of the crust compares with homemade pizza dough.  I can’t  imagine the expiration date is 11/10/2011.  I wonder how these dough balls could last that long and still be usable.  I will do a forum search on “Real New York Dough” product.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

Dough balls made using very expensive commercial equipment and flash frozen at very low temperatures can last six months or more if kept in the right kind of freezer. It's hard to imagine that the dough balls you have would be made any other way. The freezing process might be less critical for dough balls that are frozen for places like supermarkets where the dough balls are defrosted and used in a matter of a few days.

Peter

[chickenparm]

Norma,isn't vitamin c used as a dough relaxer?

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

See http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13349.msg132126/topicseen.html#msg132126. I think the member posted twice on this topic. You may be able to find the second post through a search.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,isn't vitamin c used as a dough relaxer?

Bill,

I am trying Vitamin C in my “blend”, but with other ingredients for my experiment to see if a homemade dough conditioner will work.  I never tried Vitamin C in other doughs I made.

This is one place Peter posted about Vitamin C in dough and what it does at Reply 1 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1029.msg9181.html#msg9181 and this is one post by November at Reply 5 about Vitamin C in dough at Reply 5 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,4977.msg44674.html#msg44674 Another post by Peter at Reply 33 reading about halfway down about adding Vitamin C in flour at Reply 33 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11962.msg111737.html#msg111737

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Bill,

Usually when the ascorbic acid is added to the four, it is listed with the rest of the flour ingredients, such as the barley malt, B-Vitamins, iron, etc. Since the ascorbic acid is listed at the end of the ingredients list right after the yeast, there is a pretty good chance that the ascorbic acid is for the yeast. It's hard to know for sure. When a company can't spell "ascorbic" correctly, who knows where else they may have erred?

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

Dough balls made using very expensive commercial equipment and flash frozen at very low temperatures can last six months or more if kept in the right kind of freezer. It's hard to imagine that the dough balls you have would be made any other way. The freezing process might be less critical for dough balls that are frozen for places like supermarkets where the dough balls are defrosted and used in a matter of a few days.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for posting how long frozen dough balls can last if they are made with expensive equipment and flash frozen.

Norma,

See http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13349.msg132126/topicseen.html#msg132126. I think the member posted twice on this topic. You may be able to find the second post through a search.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for finding the link to the dough kjlued used, like I am going to try.  I see Chau posted the link to the smoked pie kjlued made at Reply 8 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13349.msg132278.html#msg132278

http://www.smokingmeatforums.com/forum/thread/104700/smoking-the-dough#post_610180

kjlued smoked pie using the same dough I have really looked good. 

I must have missed that thread, because smoking a pie sounds interesting.  I have a smoker and might try to use the smoker to make one of the doughs I bought today.  I now see where  kjlued posted about the same dough I have at Reply 1  http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13458.msg133621.html#msg133621

Norma
 

[chickenparm]

Bill,

Usually when the ascorbic acid is added to the four, it is listed with the rest of the flour ingredients, such as the barley malt, B-Vitamins, iron, etc. Since the ascorbic acid is listed at the end of the ingredients list right after the yeast, there is a pretty good chance that the ascorbic acid is for the yeast. It's hard to know for sure. When a company can't spell "ascorbic" correctly, who knows where else they may have erred?

Peter

Peter,

Just joking around here...Since it's listed last,and they did not spell it right,maybe the person in charge of printing on the box was talking out loud to themselves,and almost forgot an ingredient?

Then they remembered a little bit,and said,"Oh yeah,Geritol!...uhh no,Orbit Gum!,uhh no,Asorbitol something!Asorbo,uhh,Kevin Sorbo on acid,Asorbia...oh wait,its Asorbic Acid!"
 

Maybe It's a good thing they didn't spell Flour like Flower then,eh?
 

[norma427]

Bill,

LOL, I am not Peter, but your last post was really funny!   

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Bill,

LOL. You are hilarious.

Peter

[Pete-zza]

The dough balls are for 14" pizzas.  Since you posted what the TF is for these dough balls by the weight for a 14" pizza, I might try to stretch the dough a little more.

Norma,

If you got out to a bit over 15", you should get closer to a NY street style.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

If you got out to a bit over 15", you should get closer to a NY street style.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks for posting how much I should stretch out the skin for a typical NY street style pizza.

I am interested in how this dough will perform.  I looked at their pdf. http://rnypd.com/downloads/RNYPD.pdf  and had to laugh about their company saying that their product bakes to a crispy crunch and “you can bet it is the best dough there is”.  It also says made with made with NYC water that comes from upstate reservoirs and gives a beautiful consistency that handles well and bakes to golden crispy crunch.  I guess I will see how true all those statements are.  I like how companies make claims. Almost just like the real Ultra-thin crusts I tried.  After I try these two dough balls out, I might write them an email to let them know how I like their product.  Since I have been to NY many times and tried different NY style street pizzas, I will see how these compare.  At least I do have a deck oven to try the dough in, so if these dough balls are any good, I would think at least I have the best way to see if they are.  At the end of the pdf, it says “No matter how you bake it, It’s the dough that makes it!”  Made in Brooklyn with NYC water. 

Norma

[norma427]

I removed the two dough ball out of the package, because I was curious to see how they were packaged.  They were only in a flimsy plastic bag with no seal and no twist tie. Almost as badly packaged as the real frozen Ultra Thin Crust were.  I did put a twist tie on the end of the plastic bag. 

Two pictures with different camera settings of how the dough balls look.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

Just for fun, I used the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html to come up with a dough formulation that would satisfy the ingredients pecking order given on the packaging materials for the two frozen dough balls that you purchased. I did this mainly to get an estimate as to what it would cost someone to make two 16-ounce dough balls that could then be frozen. This is what I got:

Flour (100%): Water (62%): IDY (0.80%): Salt (1.75%): Olive Oil (1.5%): Vegetable (Soybean) Oil (1.4%): Sugar (2%): Total (169.45%): Single Ball:

535.38 g  |  18.88 oz | 1.18 lbs 331.94 g  |  11.71 oz | 0.73 lbs 4.28 g | 0.15 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.42 tsp | 0.47 tbsp 9.37 g | 0.33 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.68 tsp | 0.56 tbsp 8.03 g | 0.28 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.78 tsp | 0.59 tbsp 7.5 g | 0.26 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.65 tsp | 0.55 tbsp 10.71 g | 0.38 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.69 tsp | 0.9 tbsp 907.2 g | 32 oz | 2 lbs | TF = N/A 453.6 g | 16 oz | 1 lbs

Note: To the above, one should add a pinch of Asorbic (sic) acid.

In your case, you might be able to use your pricing for flour, such as high-gluten flour or bread flour, as well as the other ingredients to calculate what it would cost you to make two dough balls like the ones you purchased.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

Just for fun, I used the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html to come up with a dough formulation that would satisfy the ingredients pecking order given on the packaging materials for the two frozen dough balls that you purchased. I did this mainly to get an estimate as to what it would cost someone to make two 16-ounce dough balls that could then be frozen. This is what I got:

Flour (100%): Water (62%): IDY (0.80%): Salt (1.75%): Olive Oil (1.5%): Vegetable (Soybean) Oil (1.4%): Sugar (2%): Total (169.45%): Single Ball:

535.38 g  |  18.88 oz | 1.18 lbs 331.94 g  |  11.71 oz | 0.73 lbs 4.28 g | 0.15 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.42 tsp | 0.47 tbsp 9.37 g | 0.33 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.68 tsp | 0.56 tbsp 8.03 g | 0.28 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.78 tsp | 0.59 tbsp 7.5 g | 0.26 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.65 tsp | 0.55 tbsp 10.71 g | 0.38 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.69 tsp | 0.9 tbsp 907.2 g | 32 oz | 2 lbs | TF = N/A 453.6 g | 16 oz | 1 lbs

Note: To the above, one should add a pinch of Asorbic (sic) acid.

In your case, you might be able to use your pricing for flour, such as high-gluten flour or bread flour, as well as the other ingredients to calculate what it would cost you to make two dough balls like the ones you purchased.

Peter

Peter,

Lol, setting forth a dough formula for the “Real New York” frozen pizza dough I bought.  I still don’t know how you figure all that out, by just looking at the pecking order of ingredients. Wish I could have fun with math like you do.  Hopefully if this frozen dough makes a good pizza, I will then try the formula you set-forth.  Maybe I could figure out how much 2 dough balls would cost me, since you have figured out the formula.  I know it wouldn’t be as much as the 3.99 I paid.  Maybe I also could try an experiment out in the next few weeks to see if I could make the same kind of dough the “Real New York” pizza company sells and also see if I can freeze it, to get a product somewhat like theirs.  

I know I have used the ascorbic acid in my blend and even in Tammy’s recipe blend she advocates using ascorbic acid (aka Vitamin C).  I don’t know if you are anyone is interested, but this is a chart from AIB, that tells what different dough conditioners, additives, and Improvers do to dough , including ascorbic acid and how much of a ingredient to try in dough. I don’t know if you have seen this chart before or not. http://www.aibonline.org/schoolofbaking/DoughCondIngFunclist.pdf    

BTW, I did email the Real New York Pizza Dough, Inc. and told them I have a small pizza business at market and asked them what temperature they would recommend for me to bake the pizza in my Baker’s Pride deck oven.  I also told them I wanted to see how their dough compared with mine, since they used "real" NYC water.

I just hope this thread doesn’t become as intensive as the Ultra-thin thread when we tried to clone their frozen crusts.  At the end of that thread, I found out I really didn’t like that crust, because it was so bland and tasteless.  

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

There are countless possibilities of dough formulations that would satisfy the pecking order of ingredients in your NY dough. The formulation I posted seems to fit what I learned about frozen dough when I researched the matter some time ago.

I did some rough calculations on what it would cost me to make two dough balls using the formulation I posted, using local supermarket prices, and I would say that it would cost me about $1.25. Of course, in a commercial environment, there are many other costs that are reflected in the final price to the consumer. I'm sure that with your ingredients costs, you can make mincemeat out of my costs.

I have not seen the AIB list of dough conditioners. Over time, I think we can expect to see many of those
ingredients replaced by other, "cleaner" ingredients that consumers are demanding of food producers. Scientists are already at work developing enzyme products to replace several of the ingredients in the AIB list. I am confident that ascorbic acid is safe and will not be replaced. Many of the big pizza chains already depend on ascorbic acid as a substitute for bromates.

Peter