hybrid Reinhart

[fazzari]

Thank you Norma...I would have to see these before going to bed......they look fantastic!!!

Thanks for trying them
John

[norma427]

Thank you Norma...I would have to see these before going to bed......they look fantastic!!!

Thanks for trying them
John

John,

I put the other pictures under the UBM thread if you are interested in looking at them at Reply 93 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13668.msg143137.html#msg143137 I really like your dough formula for the hybrid Reinhart pizza.  If I have time this Friday I am going to mix 5 doughs balls in my Hobart mixer at market, and then do the reball on Monday to see what happens.  I really like the fantastic oven spring, the moistness in the crust, and nice crisp bottom crust.  As I posted before, I think you have a winner in the hybrid Reinhart formula!   

Norma

[fazzari]

I'm just glad it works Norma....did you use your dough right out of the fridge, or did you warm it up?  If you experiment at all you will find the doughs are good from day 1, and just get marginally better.

Best wishes
John

[norma427]

I'm just glad it works Norma....did you use your dough right out of the fridge, or did you warm it up?  If you experiment at all you will find the doughs are good from day 1, and just get marginally better.

Best wishes
John

John,

I did use the dough right out of the fridge. Using it right out of the fridge surprised me that the pizza didn’t get bubbles in the middle, like some other doughs do right out of the refrigerator. Did you ever experiment with this dough and bulk cold ferment it, then divide and ball to see what would happen? 

If I ever make your hybrid Reinhart for market, I would have to make the dough on a Friday.

Thanks for the best wishes! 

Norma

[fazzari]

Sorry
I've never bulk fermented....my goal has always been simplicity..so I do all my work at mix time.
John

[spbrez]

John&Norma,
I will definitely be trying this dough this week and will post my results. You guys have my mouth watering!

[fazzari]

Hey Norma
36 hour dough...my employees fight for the edges!

John

[norma427]

Hey Norma
36 hour dough...my employees fight for the edges!

John

John,

Your hybrid Reinhart pizza looks great after 36 hrs. of fermentation.  Darn you John, this early in the morning you almost have me salivating over the keyboard.  I would have loved to try your pizza.  I can imagine how your employees were fighting for the edges.  Great job!  What were your toppings for that pizza?  They sure look good.

Norma

[fazzari]

This is a standard breakfast pizza we have every once in a while.  1 beaten egg, 4 oz mozz, a little romano, an ounce of ham, chopped green pepper and onion.  I sincerely think there is a place for a breakfast pizza....I don't know where yet...if I were a younger man and had the time I would investigate.

JOhn

[norma427]

This is a standard breakfast pizza we have every once in a while.  1 beaten egg, 4 oz mozz, a little romano, an ounce of ham, chopped green pepper and onion.  I sincerely think there is a place for a breakfast pizza....I don't know where yet...if I were a younger man and had the time I would investigate.

JOhn

John,

Thanks for your recipe for your toppings you used on your last pizza.  I will give a try soon.

Norma

[fazzari]

Norma
Here is the experiment I wanted to try with frozen doughs.  I took my standard hybrid which had fermented in the fridge for 3 days, reballed it and stuck it in a freezer bag to freeze for 2 days.   Took the dough out of the freezer and let set in fridge 1 day.  I reballed this one 4 hours prior to bake.  The dough was solid...it gave some resistance when I pushed it out....if I were really good I would have given it a couple quick tosses...but I'm not.  My point is you can lift this dough up and let it hang from your fists, thus all the surface flour falls off.  I'm showing you a photo of my peel with corn meal....there is very little....the corn meal does not stick to the dough and what little does brushes off easily.  Coarse corn meal is what we've used for all 36 years I've been in the biz....You CAN overdo it though..just know that!

I didn't have much in my fridge for a pizza...so I beat up a couple eggs, added black pepper and mozzarella.  This baked in my home oven, at about 535 degrees, just a bit more than 5 minutes.  The pictures will show that the crust and bottom could have been much browner (and were well on the way to getting there), but I had to pull the pizza before i burned the top (I definitely wanted to eat this too).  Look at the oven spring...this with just 4 hours from reball...and I'm telling you 2 hours would also do the trick....and I have to add...this was a great breakfast !!!

Best wishes
John

[norma427]

Norma
Here is the experiment I wanted to try with frozen doughs.  I took my standard hybrid which had fermented in the fridge for 3 days, reballed it and stuck it in a freezer bag to freeze for 2 days.   Took the dough out of the freezer and let set in fridge 1 day.  I reballed this one 4 hours prior to bake.  The dough was solid...it gave some resistance when I pushed it out....if I were really good I would have given it a couple quick tosses...but I'm not.  My point is you can lift this dough up and let it hang from your fists, thus all the surface flour falls off.  I'm showing you a photo of my peel with corn meal....there is very little....the corn meal does not stick to the dough and what little does brushes off easily.  Coarse corn meal is what we've used for all 36 years I've been in the biz....You CAN overdo it though..just know that!

I didn't have much in my fridge for a pizza...so I beat up a couple eggs, added black pepper and mozzarella.  This baked in my home oven, at about 535 degrees, just a bit more than 5 minutes.  The pictures will show that the crust and bottom could have been much browner (and were well on the way to getting there), but I had to pull the pizza before i burned the top (I definitely wanted to eat this too).  Look at the oven spring...this with just 4 hours from reball...and I'm telling you 2 hours would also do the trick....and I have to add...this was a great breakfast !!!

Best wishes
John

John,

Thanks for doing the experiment on the hybrid Reinhart frozen dough ball.  I can understand how important it is for all the flour to fall off.  I appreciate you showed me a picture of your peel with the coarse corn meal.  I will look for some coarse corn meal in my area this coming week. 

You did get great oven spring even with a reball just 4 hrs. before.  I just ate lots of pizza yesterday, but I sure would have like to tasted your breakfast pizza today!  Great job and thanks for helping me and anyone else that might want to try your formula.

Norma

[c0mpl3x]

John,

Thanks for doing the experiment on the hybrid Reinhart frozen dough ball.  I can understand how important it is for all the flour to fall off.  I appreciate you showed me a picture of your peel with the coarse corn meal.  I will look for some coarse corn meal in my area this coming week. 

You did get great oven spring even with a reball just 4 hrs. before.  I just ate lots of pizza yesterday, but I sure would have like to tasted your breakfast pizza today!  Great job and thanks for helping me and anyone else that might want to try your formula.

Norma

norma, most yellow or white corn meals you buy in the baking ingredient section are coarse corn meals (quaker, betty crocker, hodgson mill, etc)

[norma427]

norma, most yellow or white corn meals you buy in the baking ingredient section are coarse corn meals (quaker, betty crocker, hodgson mill, etc)

c0mpl3x,

Thanks for telling me that most yellow or white corn meals that can be bought in the baking ingreidents section are coarse corn meals. 

Norma

[Zeppi]

Brand new batch, and a new technique (at least for me)

So, here is a dough which was in the fridge 23 hours.  It was reballed 12 hours prior to baking.  It was opened up right out of the fridge (no warm up period).  What a difference, so easy to open and stretch because it wasn't TOOOOO stretchy.  This is a 12 ounce dough, stretched to 12 inches...easily could have been 13 inches but my peel wasn't big enough.  This is baked in my home oven, which I only had up to 530 degrees...and I think it was perfect...every inch was golden brown.  The pizza is crisp, but oh so tender!
John

John !!

When you say it was baked in your home oven ,were do you put it ,lower-middle or upper rack ?

Thank's !............Louis

[Zeppi]

Again experimenting with Reinhart's techniques and varying his recipes a bit.....in search of the KISS pizza I know is out there.  This week I'm lowering the hydration a bit, just to make the dough easier to open up...to give it a bit more body so to speak.  Here is the recipe to make 6 twelve ounce dough balls, using KABF, olive oil, cool tap water, salt and instant yeast.

Flour (100%): Water (72.5%): IDY (.5%): Salt (2%): Olive Oil (2%): Honey (2%): Total (179%): Single Ball:

1185.95 g  |  41.83 oz | 2.61 lbs 859.81 g  |  30.33 oz | 1.9 lbs 5.93 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.97 tsp | 0.66 tbsp 23.72 g | 0.84 oz | 0.05 lbs | 4.25 tsp | 1.42 tbsp 23.72 g | 0.84 oz | 0.05 lbs | 5.27 tsp | 1.76 tbsp 23.72 g | 0.84 oz | 0.05 lbs | 3.39 tsp | 1.13 tbsp 2122.85 g | 74.88 oz | 4.68 lbs | TF = N/A 353.81 g | 12.48 oz | 0.78 lbs

Again dumped everything in Kitchen Aid bowl....mixed 4 minutes on stir, rest 5 minutes, mixed 3 minutes on stir plus one half.  Poured dough onto a baking sheet smeared with 1 tablespoon of oil.  Did a quick stretch and fold to lightly oil the dough ball.  Scaled, balled and refrigerated.

The following pizza dough was in the fridge for only 9 hours, it was reballed 4 hours prior to baking, and brought out of refrigeration 90 minutes prior to baking.  I wasn't expecting much from this young dough, but was pleasantly surprised at it's amazing texture and good flavor.  It was baked in 550 degree deck oven.
John

Am I missing something here ?

I've just made the recipe using 40 onces of floor and 30 onces of water and it was a muddy mess and had to put another 30 onces of flour .

Is it because I'm using AP flour and not professionnal flour that it made a mess like that ?

Louis

[Tman1]

Zeppi,

At over 70% hydration, this dough is meant to be quite wet and loose (not holding form or shape). Someone else can confirm (or set me straight), but I believe bread flour does absorb more moisture than AP.

[buceriasdon]

At hydrations levels of 70 or more percent, quite frankly, it won't matter whether you use AP or bread flour. You have to do a sequence of stretch and folds that you find works for you and even then efforts to handle the dough can be difficult for the novice. Yes, it can be quite frustrating but with continued practice with flour dusting to achieve capillary adhesion, a dough ball can be opened, stretched, topped and loaded, maybe not very round, but with an outcome nothing like you have ever expereinced before. Go to the baking section of your local supermarket and pickup some parchment paper. It's a miracle what it can do with these hydration levels. I routinely use AP Mexican flour, very low gluton at 90% hydration and parchment paper and I have achieved amazing light crusts using crummy flour and parchment paper. Please don't give up, the effort is worth it.
Don

[fazzari]

Again experimenting with Reinhart's techniques and varying his recipes a bit.....in search of the KISS pizza I know is out there.  This week I'm lowering the hydration a bit, just to make the dough easier to open up...to give it a bit more body so to speak.  Here is the recipe to make 6 twelve ounce dough balls, using KABF, olive oil, cool tap water, salt and instant yeast.

Flour (100%): Water (72.5%): IDY (.5%): Salt (2%): Olive Oil (2%): Honey (2%): Total (179%): Single Ball:

1185.95 g  |  41.83 oz | 2.61 lbs 859.81 g  |  30.33 oz | 1.9 lbs 5.93 g | 0.21 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.97 tsp | 0.66 tbsp 23.72 g | 0.84 oz | 0.05 lbs | 4.25 tsp | 1.42 tbsp 23.72 g | 0.84 oz | 0.05 lbs | 5.27 tsp | 1.76 tbsp 23.72 g | 0.84 oz | 0.05 lbs | 3.39 tsp | 1.13 tbsp 2122.85 g | 74.88 oz | 4.68 lbs | TF = N/A 353.81 g | 12.48 oz | 0.78 lbs

Again dumped everything in Kitchen Aid bowl....mixed 4 minutes on stir, rest 5 minutes, mixed 3 minutes on stir plus one half.  Poured dough onto a baking sheet smeared with 1 tablespoon of oil.  Did a quick stretch and fold to lightly oil the dough ball.  Scaled, balled and refrigerated.

The following pizza dough was in the fridge for only 9 hours, it was reballed 4 hours prior to baking, and brought out of refrigeration 90 minutes prior to baking.  I wasn't expecting much from this young dough, but was pleasantly surprised at it's amazing texture and good flavor.  It was baked in 550 degree deck oven.
John

Louis,
The absolute hardest part about this dough is getting it out of the bowl...it is a gloppy, wet dough, but if you read the directions above, the dough is poured onto an oiled surface, stretched and folded to coat the dough, and then scaled, balled and refrigerated.  If by chance the dough is super, super sticky, one can use a little more oil, or simply drop the scaled mass of dough in the oiled refrigerator container.  For the experimentation I have done, I have used no further stretch and folds than the one to coat the dough with oil.  My goal was to make this as simple as possible.

As for my home oven, again after much experimenting, I've found that covering an entire rack with unglazed ceramic tiles, and then placing that rack on the very top shelf, creates a mini oven in my bigger oven....enough heat is held in the very top to nicely brown the edges...

John

[Zeppi]

Louis,
The absolute hardest part about this dough is getting it out of the bowl...it is a gloppy, wet dough, but if you read the directions above, the dough is poured onto an oiled surface, stretched and folded to coat the dough, and then scaled, balled and refrigerated.  If by chance the dough is super, super sticky, one can use a little more oil, or simply drop the scaled mass of dough in the oiled refrigerator container.  For the experimentation I have done, I have used no further stretch and folds than the one to coat the dough with oil.  My goal was to make this as simple as possible.

As for my home oven, again after much experimenting, I've found that covering an entire rack with unglazed ceramic tiles, and then placing that rack on the very top shelf, creates a mini oven in my bigger oven....enough heat is held in the very top to nicely brown the edges...

John

Thank's !

I made  the dough by hand and mixed everything at onces like mentionned and
it was like if there was to much water for the amount of flour .
I'll try another batch soon and will get back.
I will try to get some flour from a bread maker near where I live.


Louis