Author Topic: This afternoon's bake  (Read 12628 times)

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Online Pete-zza

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #60 on: May 31, 2011, 02:15:56 PM »
Alexi,

That is correct. My recollection is that it was easier or more efficient to use percent of water rather than the classic hydration number to do the calculations for the preferment dough calculating tool.

Peter


Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #61 on: May 31, 2011, 04:48:17 PM »
This picture is of a dough that barley rose. I forget what the hydration and how long the fermentation was but the starter was 5% of water and 100% caputo. It was probably around 60% hydration and 24hr fermentation. Everytime I'd use the starter it would barely rise which kind of worried me. Then I read the posts Peter linked early of Marco saying that you shouldn't expect to much rise.

thats interesting...Lately I have been doing the eyeball pies...and go in that order...Using water and then matching the flour mixing and stopping, mixing and stoppinguntil the feel I want is reached.  Its good to know my methodology is somewhat authentic, even if Im not using the right oven.

For speed mainly. If your balling as much dough as they have to; time is money. You can get a lot of dough balls done fast the way they do it at full speed. Chau's video is great because you can see him at full speed.


Offline pizzablogger

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #62 on: May 31, 2011, 06:12:43 PM »
As far as VPN type dough balling, of which Chau linked to an excellent video, this is perhaps the definative video I have seen on the topic.

The technique is pretty much perfectly illustrated and, interestingly, even though the video is not in English (Japanese), it is understandable none the less.

Somewhat long video, but the multiple angles of the hand forming and tearing off of the ball, including slower motion of him doing it with just his hands (no ball) so you can see the motion and finger positioning, is very helpful indeed.

I've sweated this guys entire video series far too many times, but highly informative!

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Online Pete-zza

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #63 on: May 31, 2011, 10:23:22 PM »
In re-reading this thread, it is clear that Matt is following the classic Marco method. On the matter of knead time, my recollection is that Marco disagreed with the idea of kneading the dough for 20 to 30 minutes, as some of the VPN instructions apparently called for. See, for example, Marco's famous "crap" post at Reply 116 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1298.msg13378.html#msg13378. Another critical component to Marco's method was using a fermentation temperature of 18-20 degrees C, or 64.4-68 degrees F, which is roughly the range that Matt used. What I did not think to ask Matt earlier is whether he was using a temperature control unit or whether he was using a room temperature of 18-20 degrees C. If the fermentation temperature is much higher than the range that Marco advocated, then it would be natural to see a significantly greater rise, just as would occur with commercial yeast. In this respect, I believe that K (pizzablogger) correctly stated the case.

There is still one mystery that has never been answered, and that is the significance of the bulk room temperature rise before division of the bulk dough into individual pieces. Marco always dodged and skirted that issue because I believed he wanted to reserve that discussion for the book that he was planning to write but which never did materialize. There have been attempts by the members, me included, to try to explain the significance of the bulk rise, but, without Marco's affirmation, we could not be sure of any of the many explanations that were offered.

Peter

Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #64 on: June 01, 2011, 06:25:05 AM »
In re-reading this thread, it is clear that Matt is following the classic Marco method. On the matter of knead time, my recollection is that Marco disagreed with the idea of kneading the dough for 20 to 30 minutes, as some of the VPN instructions apparently called for. See, for example, Marco's famous "crap" post at Reply 116 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1298.msg13378.html#msg13378. Another critical component to Marco's method was using a fermentation temperature of 18-20 degrees C, or 64.4-68 degrees F, which is roughly the range that Matt used. What I did not think to ask Matt earlier is whether he was using a temperature control unit or whether he was using a room temperature of 18-20 degrees C. If the fermentation temperature is much higher than the range that Marco advocated, then it would be natural to see a significantly greater rise, just as would occur with commercial yeast. In this respect, I believe that K (pizzablogger) correctly stated the case.



Peter

Peter,
I have 3 different fermentation chambers & purposely chose the ambient temperature in my basement to keep my method as traditional as possible.  Increasing the temperature of the bulk fermentation will lead to a dough with more expansion which is not what I'm after.  Once I form the panetti I move the dough boxes to a warmer location for their final fermentation.

Matt

Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #65 on: June 03, 2011, 05:13:30 PM »
I picked up some traditional Fior Di Latte; unheated, unstretched & made from virgin curd.  There have been alot of questions as to why the fior di latte in Italy looks different than the one that we are used to.  I have mentioned this before; what we are use to seeing in North America is fresh mozzarella & not fior di latte.  As you can, see fior di latte is not stored in water & has a crumbly consistency.  I will post some more pictures once I open it up.

Matt

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #66 on: June 03, 2011, 05:24:02 PM »
Matt,

Would you post a picture of the label.

Thanks,
Craig
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Offline andreguidon

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #67 on: June 03, 2011, 05:30:56 PM »
Hey Matt, i use something similar to you fior di latte...

http://www.yema.com.br/produtos/mozzarella_marguerita.html
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Online JConk007

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #68 on: June 03, 2011, 05:32:50 PM »
The american style fiore d latte , they even call it Fresh Mozzerella I am trying for 1st time this weekend this 3 lbs $11.47 at RD
John
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Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #69 on: June 03, 2011, 05:33:35 PM »
Matt,

Would you post a picture of the label.

Thanks,
Craig

Craig,
The only label per say was the weight & price. I bought it right from the factory, it was made this morning.  

Matt


Offline Essen1

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #70 on: June 03, 2011, 05:52:56 PM »
As you can, see fior di latte is not stored in water & has a crumbly consistency.  I will post some more pictures once I open it up.

Matt

Is it safe to say that it is also not as wet as regular fresh mozza?

If that's the case, I might be able to use it in my home oven.
Mike

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Offline BrickStoneOven

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #71 on: June 03, 2011, 06:26:02 PM »
Matt is the FDL you got made from Agerolese milk? Does the place you bought the cheese from only sell locally or do they have distributors?

Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #72 on: June 03, 2011, 06:40:10 PM »
Is it safe to say that it is also not as wet as regular fresh mozza?

If that's the case, I might be able to use it in my home oven.

Mikey,
I think it breaks down quite easily. You will have better luck using trece which is like fresh mozzarella but a little more dry & you can pull it apart in strands.

Matt

Offline Essen1

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #73 on: June 03, 2011, 07:40:06 PM »
Mikey,
I think it breaks down quite easily. You will have better luck using trece which is like fresh mozzarella but a little more dry & you can pull it apart in strands.

Matt

Thank you very much, Sir! 

Thing is, I have never seen Trece around here. Even a quick online search didn't give me any leads to sources in my area.
Mike

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Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #74 on: June 03, 2011, 08:25:47 PM »
Thank you very much, Sir! 

Thing is, I have never seen Trece around here. Even a quick online search didn't give me any leads to sources in my area.

What about nodini?

Offline Essen1

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #75 on: June 03, 2011, 08:45:54 PM »
What about nodini?

Every search comes up empty for both. I even checked out some of the Italian importers don't carry it.

Damn!

I'm sure I'll find it, though. Thanks for the pointers, bro.
Mike

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Offline malvanova

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #76 on: June 03, 2011, 08:54:56 PM »
Hi Matt, I tried nodini here in Chicago but they were too soft great to eat as is ,but makes a puddle on a pizza.
  
  Bought some cheese curds last weekend and for the first time I made mozzarella that melted and not liquified on pizza, I see that's the only way to go, I saw curds made by Poly-OO at the restaurant depot,26lb for $50,, trying that next time, I hear it can be frozen . will see with the 5lb I froze.

Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #77 on: June 03, 2011, 09:34:42 PM »
Every search comes up empty for both. I even checked out some of the Italian importers don't carry it.

Damn!

I'm sure I'll find it, though. Thanks for the pointers, bro.

Anything for you bud!  Good luck.

Matt

Offline Matthew

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #78 on: June 03, 2011, 09:41:20 PM »
Hi Matt, I tried nodini here in Chicago but they were too soft great to eat as is ,but makes a puddle on a

Hi Phil,
Very strange.  I use Nodini & Trecce all the time in Pizza in Teglia & it melts beautifully. I pull it apart & let it dry out in the fridge the night before I use it.

Matt

Offline norma427

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Re: This afternoon's bake
« Reply #79 on: June 03, 2011, 10:21:16 PM »
Matt,

I want to thank you for starting this thread.  :)  I used the Ischia starter by 5% of the weight of the water and fermented the dough at room temperature for 26 hrs. and got really good results.

Pictures below

Norma
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