Author Topic: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!  (Read 379703 times)

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Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1380 on: March 28, 2012, 12:15:38 AM »
Omid, those are as beautiful as your short bulk fermented pies but seemingly with more leoparding.  Did you find the texture or taste to be much different?  If so, which one do you like better and why? 

Chau


Offline bakeshack

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1381 on: March 28, 2012, 01:36:56 AM »
Omid, it's been a while but your pizzas are always top notch!  Very nice as always!

Marlon

Offline wheelman

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1382 on: March 28, 2012, 09:41:50 AM »
great photos Omid! 
how active would you say your starter is when you mix the dough (maybe on a scale of 1-10)?
thanks
bill

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1383 on: March 28, 2012, 05:32:56 PM »
I really like this video, it's in Italian, but you can understand what's happening by watching.



and this video is awesome, watch closely at 1.25 and see a guy with skillz!


ohhh and Pizza Napoletana! those pizzas are outstanding!

Dear PizzaVera, thank you for the compliment and the videos. Have a great day!

All are your trademark beautiful. Notwithstanding, the salumi and olive is a masterpiece.

CL

Dear Craig, thank you!

Omid, it's been a while but your pizzas are always top notch!  Very nice as always!

Marlon

Thank you, dear Marlon!
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1384 on: March 28, 2012, 05:34:28 PM »
Omid, those are as beautiful as your short bulk fermented pies but seemingly with more leoparding.  Did you find the texture or taste to be much different?  If so, which one do you like better and why? 

Chau

Dear Chau, thank you! Yes, I felt that both the texture and taste of the base and crown of the pizzas were markedly different than my short-bulk dough. The texture was a bit denser, but not rough or tough at all. And, the taste was pleasant. (Of course, my gas oven, in my opinion, can not provide the same flavor as a Neapolitan oven that uses wood as fuel!) Have a great day!
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1385 on: March 28, 2012, 05:38:09 PM »
great photos Omid!  
how active would you say your starter is when you mix the dough (maybe on a scale of 1-10)?
thanks
bill

Dear Bill, thank you! In regard to the starter culture, it was recently given to me by a Milanese friend who told me that it is from Naples (not to be mistaken for Camaldoli or Ischia culture). So, I am in an experimental phase in respect to this culture. The culture seems to possess good leavening power. If the following is any indication of the culture's leavening (levitation) propensity, when I add 100 grams of it, while in its active state, to a mixture of 250 grams of water (at 60ºF) and 250 grams of flour (at 60ºF), the total volume more than doubles between 5 to 6 hours at 60-62ºF of ambient temperature. I have repeated this test several times, yielding the same exact result. Before I applied the culture (which was given to me in an active state) to the referenced dough in Reply #1374, I had regularly refreshed it for 72 hours at 6- to 8-hour intervals. Further, I should add the following if it is of any value or impact: before adding the culture to the salt-water in Reply #1374, I thoroughly oxygenated or frothed the culture in 50 grams of water, which was subtracted from the total water. (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14506.msg178774.html#msg178774)

Flour: 1000 grams of Caputo Pizzeria "00" (datum point)
Water: 620 grams (62%)
Sea Salt: 28 grams (2.8%)
Starter Culture: 12 grams (1.93% via water)
●50 grams of the 620 grams of water was used to froth the starter culture.
●Direct method of dough production: Water ➡ Salt ➡ Frothed Culture ➡ Flour = Pizza Dough

After the frothing is done, about 70% of the culture is pure foam. True or false, the aeration of a starter culture is believed to stimulate the fermentative micro-organisms therein—and possibly to alter the yeasts-lactobacilli ratio, i.e., to increase the number of autochthonous yeast cells against the number of lactobacillus cells which normally outnumber the former. Please, see the pictures attached hereunder, which I hope demonstrate the procedure. When I add the frothed culture to the salt-water inside the mixer bowl, the multitude of tiny bubbles stay afloat and undisturbed on top of the salt-water until I add the flour. Have a great day!
« Last Edit: March 30, 2012, 01:05:50 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1386 on: March 28, 2012, 05:52:50 PM »
Omid, your new starter looks great.  I have yet to aerate my starter such as you show.  If you were to aerate one of your other starters with the same device, would it look the same?   What is the purpose of doing so? Do I need one of these things?  :D

Offline alex_chef2000

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1387 on: March 28, 2012, 06:23:35 PM »
Thanks Omid, will use the frother next time I make Pizza, controlling the temperature of water has been helpful with the dough fermentation, adding air will improve the pizza dough aswell.

I use this frother everyday for making my Lavazza cappuccinos, love it, life warranty. 

I think should buy a couple more for other than espresso drinks.

Any addition to our experiments are helpful!!!

My culinary regards,


Chef Alex.:
 
 

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1388 on: March 29, 2012, 03:40:34 AM »
Omid, your new starter looks great.  I have yet to aerate my starter such as you show.  If you were to aerate one of your other starters with the same device, would it look the same? What is the purpose of doing so? Do I need one of these things?  :D

Dear Chau, yes, if I were to froth my other starter cultures, I would obtain the same result. I have been doing this on and off for about a year. I assume the ratio of culture to water has to be conducive to frothing. In other words, if I add too much water to the culture, then the frothing (i.e., the foam) won't happen. Also, the warmer the water, the better frothing you will obtain. And, as I mentioned above, I do this because: "True or false, the aeration of a starter culture is believed to stimulate the fermentative micro-organisms therein—and possibly to alter the yeasts-lactobacilli ratio, i.e., to increase the number of autochthonous yeast cells against the number of lactobacillus cells which normally outnumber the former." At last, to answer your last question, I'd say that it would be difficult to froth your culture without a frother, which can also be used for many other culinary purposes. Have a great day!
« Last Edit: March 30, 2012, 01:07:05 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline nbickett

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1389 on: March 29, 2012, 09:12:16 AM »
Omid,

Do you usually add your starter ("active") to the mixture of water (i.e., no extra flour)? In other words, in this case you would have already fed the starter and then froth a portion of the active starter with the water? If so, I would wonder how water alone could invigorate the leavening capacities of the starter (i.e., without additional flour). Or have I misunderstood you?


Offline wheelman

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1390 on: March 29, 2012, 10:13:46 AM »
Wow!  thanks for another unexpected facet of pizza.
bill

Offline BeerdedOne

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1391 on: March 29, 2012, 12:50:26 PM »
Hi all,

With regard to the oxygenation of the starter, I can confirm that the procedure will enhance the leavening process by temporarily driving the yeast towards an aerobic respiration metabolic pathway (as opposed to the anaerobic fermentation pathway).  This is probably particularly true if you use your starter after it has fallen.  Both processes will produce CO2 gas as a byproduct, however yeast in the presence of ample oxygen will multiply in numbers readily, which (all things being equal) will serve to decrease the amount of time required to leaven the dough.  Once the oxygen is depleted, the yeast will begin to switch over to the anaerobic process of fermentation (conversion of sugars to alcohol and CO2 gas).  

JP
« Last Edit: March 29, 2012, 01:01:29 PM by BeerdedOne »

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1392 on: March 29, 2012, 10:54:32 PM »
Omid,

Do you usually add your starter ("active") to the mixture of water (i.e., no extra flour)? In other words, in this case you would have already fed the starter and then froth a portion of the active starter with the water? If so, I would wonder how water alone could invigorate the leavening capacities of the starter (i.e., without additional flour). Or have I misunderstood you?

Dear Nbickett, that is right, I used no extra flour when I frothed the 12 grams of fully active starter culture in 50 grams of water in Reply #1374 and 1385 above:

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14506.msg178774.html#msg178774
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14506.msg178939.html#msg178939

(You can, if you like, add some flour, which will probably cause a stronger foam/bubble formation after frothing and, hence, will encapsulate more air.) You asked, "I wonder how water alone could invigorate the leavening capacities of the starter. . . ?" I think that it is not the water alone, but the enrichment of the culture-water mixture with "oxygen" (which constitutes 1/5th of the air we breathe) and more! Dear BeerdedOne kindly touched on this matter briefly in Reply #1391 above. My underlying assumption is that the aeration of a starter culture stimulates the fermentative micro-organisms therein—and possibly alters the yeasts-lactobacilli ratio, i.e., increasing the number of autochthonous yeast cells against the number of lactobacillus cells which normally outnumber the former. Microbiologists refer to this phenomenon as the "Pasteur effect". In making dough, according to Wikipedia:

"The yeast initially respires aerobically, producing carbon dioxide and water. When the oxygen is depleted, anaerobic respiration begins, producing ethanol as a waste product. . . .

Yeast species either require oxygen for aerobic cellular respiration (obligate aerobes) or are anaerobic, but also have aerobic methods of energy production (facultative anaerobes). Unlike bacteria [which are single-celled prokaryotes], there are no known yeast species [which are unicellular eukaryotes] that grow only anaerobically (obligate anaerobes).

Pasteur showed that by bubbling oxygen into the yeast broth, the yeast cell growth could be increased, but fermentation was inhibited – an observation later called the 'Pasteur effect'". (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeast)

"The Pasteur effect is an inhibiting effect of oxygen on the fermentation process. The effect was discovered in 1857 by Louis Pasteur, who showed that aerating yeasted broth causes yeast cell growth to increase, while conversely, fermentation rate decreases. The effect can be easily explained, as the yeast being facultative anaerobes [i.e., producing ATP by aerobic respiration in presence of oxygen and shifting to fermentation in absence of oxygen] can produce energy using two different metabolic pathways. [An "ATP", very simply and briefly put, is a unit of biochemical/cellular energy.] While the oxygen concentration is low, the product of glycolysis [i.e., the breakdown of sugar glucose by enzymes, releasing energy and pyruvic acid, a yellowish organic acid that occurs as an intermediate in many metabolic processes] . . . is turned into ethanol and carbon dioxide, and the energy production efficiency is low (2 moles of ATP per mole of glucose). If the oxygen concentration grows, pyruvate [i.e., the yellowish organic acid] is converted to acetyl CoA that can be used in the citric acid cycle, which increases the efficiency to 38 moles of ATP per mole of glucose. Under anaerobic conditions, the rate of glucose metabolism [i.e., fermentation] is faster, but the amount of ATP produced (as already mentioned) is smaller. When exposed to aerobic conditions, the ATP production increases and the rate of glycolysis slows, because the ATP produced acts as an allosteric inhibitor for phosphofructokinase 1, the third enzyme in the glycolysis pathway. So, from the standpoint of ATP production, it is advantageous for yeast to undergo Krebs Cycle in the presence of oxygen, as more ATP is produced from less glucose. [Krebs cycle is the sequence of biochemical reactions by which most living cells generate energy during the process of aerobic respiration. It takes place in the mitochondria, consuming oxygen, producing carbon dioxide and water as waste products, and converting ADP to energy-rich ATP.] All the processes used in alcohol production are kept in anaerobic conditions, while breeding yeast for biomass is done in aerobic conditions, the broth being aerated. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pasteur_effect)

"Uses of aeration of liquids: To increase oxygen content of wort (unfermented beer) or must (unfermented wine) to allow yeast to propagate and begin fermentation." (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aeration)

According to the website http://www.exploreyeast.com/yeast_development.php, which is a daughter website for the French yeast producer Lesaffre (http://www.lesaffre.com/en/): See the 1st & 2nd pictures hereunder.

I hope the above has addressed your concern. Have a great night!
« Last Edit: March 30, 2012, 01:12:52 AM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1393 on: March 29, 2012, 10:56:01 PM »
Hi all,

With regard to the oxygenation of the starter, I can confirm that the procedure will enhance the leavening process by temporarily driving the yeast towards an aerobic respiration metabolic pathway (as opposed to the anaerobic fermentation pathway).  This is probably particularly true if you use your starter after it has fallen.  Both processes will produce CO2 gas as a byproduct, however yeast in the presence of ample oxygen will multiply in numbers readily, which (all things being equal) will serve to decrease the amount of time required to leaven the dough.  Once the oxygen is depleted, the yeast will begin to switch over to the anaerobic process of fermentation (conversion of sugars to alcohol and CO2 gas).  

JP

Dear BeerdedOne, thank you for the explanation. Good night!
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline Pulcinella

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1394 on: March 30, 2012, 02:07:15 AM »
My underlying assumption is that the aeration of a starter culture stimulates the fermentative micro-organisms therein—and possibly alters the yeasts-lactobacilli ratio, i.e., increasing the number of autochthonous yeast cells against the number of lactobacillus cells which normally outnumber the former.

Gorgeous pie.

omid why would you want to increase the number of yeast cells in relation to the number of bacteria in your sourdough starter?

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1395 on: March 30, 2012, 03:04:54 AM »
omid why would you want to increase the number of yeast cells in relation to the number of bacteria in your sourdough starter?

Dear Pulcinella, I try to alter the ratio of the microflora (by suitably refreshing my starter culture, frothing the daughter culture, and by other means) inasmuch as I personally find a more than moderately sour Neapolitan crust quite unpleasant! I prefer my pizza possess subtle but not indistinct lacticity. Thereby, as a general rule, the more lactic acid is generated in a sourdough pizza dough as a result of the lactic acid bacteria's (LAB) metabolic activities, passage of time, and the attendant ambient temperatures, the more lactic or sour will be the end product, along with some other ramifications if the culture and the dough inoculated therewith are not properly managed. The LAB usually outnumber the indigenous yeast cells in a starter culture. Further, it is said that when the pH of a sourdough dough declines beyond a certain point as a result of excessive lactic acid production by the LAB, the leavening activity of the yeast cells diminish or come to a halt. Per the quoted passage (whose truth value needs to be examined) I sent you the other day:

". . . The yeast and bacteria in the [starter] culture will cause a wheat-based dough, if the gluten has been developed sufficiently, to retain gas, to leaven or rise. Obtaining a satisfactory rise from sourdough culture, however, is more difficult than with packaged yeast [i.e., the commercial or baker's yeast], because the LAB almost always outnumber the yeasts by a factor of between 100:1 and 1000:1, and the acidity of the bacteria inhibits the yeasts' gas production. [After a certain point,] the acidic conditions, along with the bacteria also producing enzymes that break down proteins, result in weaker gluten and a denser finished product. Refreshment intervals longer than three days acidify the dough and may change the microbial ecosystem. . . . When using a particularly liquid starter with a high concentration of lactobacillus or acetic acid bacteria, the large amount of lactic and acetic acids produced needs to be managed carefully, since the acid can break down the gluten in the bread dough; this becomes less of a concern in a stiffer starter, where the yeast usually predominates. . . ."

Good night!
« Last Edit: April 05, 2012, 06:10:29 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1396 on: March 30, 2012, 10:28:49 AM »
Omid, increasing the yeast count would alter the yeast:bacteria ratio, but I doubt it would reduce the number of bacteria meaningfully. They don't really compete much for food. Would this really reduce the acid production unless the increased yeast activity allowed you to shorten the fermentation time? Would you lose overall flavor if this is the case?

I wonder if you really wanted to give the yeast an unfair advantage vis-à-vis the bacteria if you would allow them to stay in the frothed state for some time before incorporating into the dough? Maybe even feeding them some of the formula flour right before frothing?

I started a batch yesterday employing your froth method (which I had not previously considred). I frothed the yeast with a hand whisk (worked just fine). I then added the rest of the water with the salt already dissolved. I then immediately incorporated the flour. I did this as gently as possible with a spatula and a folding motion to try to incorporate as much air in the dough as possible. I'm curious to see if I notice any difference.

Best Regards.
Pizza is not bread.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1397 on: March 30, 2012, 10:43:26 PM »
After 24 hours, there was noticeably more yeast activity.

CL
Pizza is not bread.

Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1398 on: March 31, 2012, 06:24:24 AM »
Omid, increasing the yeast count would alter the yeast:bacteria ratio, but I doubt it would reduce the number of bacteria meaningfully. They don't really compete much for food. Would this really reduce the acid production unless the increased yeast activity allowed you to shorten the fermentation time? Would you lose overall flavor if this is the case?

I wonder if you really wanted to give the yeast an unfair advantage vis-à-vis the bacteria if you would allow them to stay in the frothed state for some time before incorporating into the dough? Maybe even feeding them some of the formula flour right before frothing?

I started a batch yesterday employing your froth method (which I had not previously considred). I frothed the yeast with a hand whisk (worked just fine). I then added the rest of the water with the salt already dissolved. I then immediately incorporated the flour. I did this as gently as possible with a spatula and a folding motion to try to incorporate as much air in the dough as possible. I'm curious to see if I notice any difference.

Best Regards.

Dear Craig, since the propagation and activities of the extant microflora in a sourdough starter are concealed from direct human perception, and since my knowledge of these microbial organisms is scanty, I am not able to indubitably answer the questions for you and for myself. Additionally, as revealed by various applied microbiology literatures, this issue is further complicated by the fact that different starter cultures are occupied by different species of lactobacillus bacteria and wild yeasts, each of which has its own peculiar growth and metabolic characteristics that make each culture different from one another. How can a layman, such as myself, identify the type of sourdough culture1 one has? Moreover, how can a layman identify the type of lactic acid bacteria2 and fungal micro-organisms that thrive in a culture? Given the scope of this difficulty, I, by necessity, rely on my repeated experiences and observations of these microbial phenomena, and I look therein for patterns and uniformities on which I can base my speculations.

Quote
1. According to Modern Food Microbiology, authored by James Monroe Jay, Martin J. Loessner, and David Allen Golden:

"Sourdoughs are placed into three groups and each has its unique fermentation consortium.
Type I sourdoughs are fermented at 20-30ºC [68-86ºF] and the two primary organisms are L. sanfranciscensis and L. pontis.
Type II [sour]doughs employ baker's yeast as a leavening agent, and the dominant lactics are L. pontis, L. panic[/i], and from one to nine other lactobacilli.
Type III [sour]doughs are dried products of traditional fermentations. . . ."

(http://books.google.com/books?id=C0sO1gNFWLAC&printsec=frontcover#v=onepage&q&f=false)


2. According to The Lactic Acid Bacteria: The Genera of Lactic Acid Bacteria, authored by Brian J. B. Wood and W. H. Holzapfel, lactobacilli fall into three groups in terms of their metabolic activities:

"Group A: Obligately homofermentative Lactobacilli"
"Group B: Facultatively heterofermentative Lactobacilli"
"Group C: Obligately heterofermentative Lactobacilli"

Each group has its own particular metabolic pathway and metabolizes certain types of energy sources/carbohydrates/sugars, which result in different lactic acid productions at certain range of temperatures. According to Wikipedia: "Group A LAB ferment hexoses [monosaccharides or simple sugars, each with six carbon atoms], producing lactic acid via the Embden–Meyerhof–Parnas (EMP) pathway. Group B LAB also ferment hexoses via the EMP pathway to produce lactic acid; additionally they may ferment pentoses [monosaccharides or simple sugars, each with five carbon atoms] via the phosphogluconate pathway producing lactic acid and acetic acid. Group C LAB ferment both hexoses and pentoses via the phosphogluconate pathway to produce lactate, ethanol, and CO2."

(http://books.google.com/books?id=Q8B_WusVacsC&printsec=frontcover&source=gbs_ge_summary_r&cad=0#v=onepage&q&f=false)

My point is that, we are dealing with a very complex issue that demands careful consideration. Within this particular context of the microflora ratio, I make the following suppositions:

1. The ratio of wild yeast cells to bacteria cells that thrive in a sourdough culture can be modified by refreshing or repeated refreshings, techniques of refreshing, consistency of the refreshed culture, duration of cultivation of the culture, and controlling the temperature during the cultivation.
2. The pH of the culture has an impact on the yeast count and their fermentative activities therein. Disproportionately low acidic environment diminishes the leavening capability of the yeast cells within the culture. In other words, the yeast activity progressively slows down as the bacteria, which usually outnumber the yeasts, generate more and more organic acid beyond a certain threshold.
4. The degree of lacticity and leavening power of the starter culture will fundamentally determine the lacticity and leavening propensity of the pizza dough to which the culture is applied.
3. For production of Neapolitan pizza dough, a proper equilibrium between the wild yeasts and bacteria needs to be procured in order to avoid producing unpleasantly sour and unsprung pizzas.

Considering the above-mentioned suppositions and in respect to your statement, "increasing the yeast count would alter the yeast:bacteria ratio", I believe the yeast:bacteria ratio is always naturally in a perpetual state of entropy or flux regardless! Normally, the bacteria population—which are said to have substantial resistance to acidic environment—triumphs over the yeast population—which are said not to have as much resistance to acidic environment as their counterparts. Hence, I believe, this is one of the reasons that a culture needs to be refreshed periodically in order to reinstitute the ratio to a degree that is suitable toward the desired baked goods. (Sometimes, I like to think of the lactic acid produced by the lactic acid bacteria as their natural defense mechanism against micro-organisms, such as mold, that may try to invade their environment.)

In respect to your questions, "Would this [i.e., frothing the culture] really reduce the acid production unless the increased yeast activity allowed you to shorten the fermentation time?" and "Would you lose overall flavor if this is the case?", I make the assumption that aeration of the culture does not reduce the production of lactic acid, for I could still taste the lactic acid (sourness) in the dough with the same intensity as in a previous dough that was inoculated with the same culture, but not frothed. Even if frothing would effectuate a reduction of acid production (which I do not think is the case), it probably would not substantially impact the overall flavor, for the bacteria are ubiquitous (they reportedly outnumber the yeasts by a range between 100:1 and 1000:1) and I would allow a reasonably long fermentation duration, under right temperatures, to generate organic acids that add complexity and flavor to the dough. At this point, I am not primarily concerned with the number of bacteria; I am primarily concerned with the yeast cells and their leavening capacity. And, I do not desire to undermine the essential role of the bacteria. After all, the bacteria are said to be an integral and indispensable part of the equation or symbiosis.

Please, keep me posted in regard to the progress of your dough. Have a great weekend!

Regards,
Omid

« Last Edit: April 04, 2012, 02:46:20 PM by Pizza Napoletana »
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO!
« Reply #1399 on: March 31, 2012, 11:47:00 AM »
I balled after 24hours. The dough had been in balls for about 10hours when I got up this morning, and they too were noticeably more advanced. What this is going to allow me to do is extend my fermentation time at 64F another 8-10hours beyond what I normally do. Total fermentation time will remain the same at 48 hours.

CL
Pizza is not bread.