Author Topic: A PHILOSOPHY OF PIZZA NAPOLETANISMO! (Read 171105 times)

norma427 · « **Reply #1240 on:** February 04, 2012, 09:08:42 PM »

Omid,

I don’t know much about the oven picture you posted, or know much of anything about WFO’s but saw a similar one on Facebook today. This is the picture I saw on Facebook today.

Norma

thezaman · « **Reply #1241 on:** February 04, 2012, 09:15:41 PM »

thank you for that video.it is neat to see the oven go from very rough bricks to such a beautiful finished product. those are amazing skills!!!

Ev · « **Reply #1242 on:** February 04, 2012, 11:03:33 PM »

That's got to be the same oven in both shots. Perhaps the video is from a rebuild project?

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1243 on:** February 05, 2012, 05:55:29 PM »

Quote from: Matthew on February 04, 2012, 07:05:58 PM

Rafaelle (Lello) is a super guy. He learned from Stefano's father & to this day keeps a photo of him in his wallet.

Matt

Dear Matthew, thank you for the information.

Quote from: norma427 on February 04, 2012, 09:08:42 PM

Omid, I don’t know much about the oven picture you posted, or know much of anything about WFO’s but saw a similar one on Facebook today. This is the picture I saw on Facebook today.

Norma

Dear Norma, as dear Ev indicated, it appears that the oven in the picture you posted above is the same as the oven in the picture I had posted. I believe the oven is located at the Fremont branch of Via Tribunali Neapolitan pizzeria in Seattle, Washington. (http://www.viatribunali.net/index.php)

I have noticed that both websites for Stefano Ferrara ovens (http://www.sfallestimenti.it/) and Raffaele Vassallo ovens (http://www.mvforni.com/) feature pictures of what appears to be the same oven, as shown in the 2nd and 3rd pictures below. Perhaps, when Raffaele Vassallo built the oven, as shown in the video (

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbgHnVjTMko" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MbgHnVjTMko</a>

), he was still working for Ferrara Forni. I do not know. At last notice that the five individual white tiles to the left and right sides of the oven's mouth in the video are missing in all the pictures below! Good day.

Quote from: Ev on February 04, 2012, 11:03:33 PM

That's got to be the same oven in both shots. Perhaps the video is from a rebuild project?

norma427 · « **Reply #1244 on:** February 05, 2012, 07:15:03 PM »

Omid,

I think the oven is in NY. At least that is what Napoliforni Mv NapoliForni's posted on his Facebook page, under his one picture album.

This is the link to the New Pizzeria with a picture below http://www.viatribunali.net/index.php?page=New-York If you have a Facebook page click on the link above.

Norma

Tscarborough · « **Reply #1245 on:** February 05, 2012, 07:41:55 PM »

It is amazing (not really), how finish can hide sloppy? non-precise? work. I am not saying that an oven has an inherent NEED to be laid to normal masonry standards, but of the 2 videos I have seen of Italian builders neither would win any awards from masonry associations for their skill or abilities. Again, an oven does not need to be be laid to the same standards as exposed masonry work, but the efforts of the amateurs I have seen here and at Forno Bravo really put the experts to shame.

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1246 on:** February 05, 2012, 08:33:20 PM »

Quote from: norma427 on February 05, 2012, 07:15:03 PM

Omid,

I think the oven is in NY. At least that is what Napoliforni Mv NapoliForni's posted on his Facebook page, under his one picture album.

This is the link to the New Pizzeria with a picture below http://www.viatribunali.net/index.php?page=New-York If you have a Facebook page click on the link above.

Norma

Dear Norma, I think you are right. All the pictures, except the very first one, I posted in Reply #1243, represent not the oven featured in the video. Good catch!

norma427 · « **Reply #1247 on:** February 05, 2012, 08:38:35 PM »

Omid,

If you are interested here are two more articles about Via Tribunali in NYC.

http://www.boweryboogie.com/2011/02/via-tribunali-boasts-new-brick-oven/ and

http://www.boweryboogie.com/2011/12/plywood-removed-from-caffe-vita-and-via-tribunali-on-ludlow/

It makes made wonder if the oven is a rebuild or a new one. I sure don’t know.

Norma

cornicione54 · « **Reply #1248 on:** February 05, 2012, 09:08:55 PM »

The new oven at Ludlow Street is a Strazzullo Michele (or built from parts provided by Strazzullo Michele). http://panjiva.com/Via-Tribunali/4601337
There's at least one other oven (white) in the Via Tribunali group that is a Strazzullo Michele.

At least one of the ovens in the Caffe Vita chain (which is owned by Via Tribunali group) is an MVForni (ie Raffaele Vassallo).

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1249 on:** February 13, 2012, 02:55:21 AM »

Quote from: norma427 on February 05, 2012, 08:38:35 PM

Omid, If you are interested here are two more articles about Via Tribunali in NYC.

http://www.boweryboogie.com/2011/02/via-tribunali-boasts-new-brick-oven/ and
http://www.boweryboogie.com/2011/12/plywood-removed-from-caffe-vita-and-via-tribunali-on-ludlow/

It makes made wonder if the oven is a rebuild or a new one. I sure don’t know.

Norma

Quote from: cornicione54 on February 05, 2012, 09:08:55 PM

The new oven at Ludlow Street is a Strazzullo Michele (or built from parts provided by Strazzullo Michele). http://panjiva.com/Via-Tribunali/4601337
There's at least one other oven (white) in the Via Tribunali group that is a Strazzullo Michele.

At least one of the ovens in the Caffe Vita chain (which is owned by Via Tribunali group) is an MVForni (ie Raffaele Vassallo).

Dear Norma and Cornicione, thank you for the links and information. Have a great week!

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1250 on:** February 13, 2012, 09:34:28 PM »

Today's lunch (using the direct method, 2.5 minutes of Santos mixing & kneading, Caputo Pizzeria flour, 62% hydration, 2.5% culture, 2.8% sea salt, 4+25 hours of fermentation at controlled room temperature, and home gas oven):

Ev · « **Reply #1251 on:** February 13, 2012, 09:48:09 PM »

Pizza just doesn't get any better looking than that!

flyboy4ual · « **Reply #1252 on:** February 13, 2012, 09:48:26 PM »

Omid,

Great looking pies! Was there much flavor in the dough with such a short fermentation time?

Thanks,

Scott D.

parallei · « **Reply #1253 on:** February 13, 2012, 10:16:46 PM »

Beautiful pies Omid. The cheese and tomato is stunning, but you'd have to race me for a slice of the pep and mushroom.

Drgolf369 · « **Reply #1254 on:** February 13, 2012, 11:15:47 PM »

Omid:
Great art, great photography.
If you knead for only 2+ minutes, does it matter how the dough is mixed?
How does the gluten develop without working it longer?
Thanks,
Joel

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1255 on:** February 14, 2012, 12:26:25 AM »

Quote from: flyboy4ual on February 13, 2012, 09:48:26 PM

Omid,

Great looking pies! Was there much flavor in the dough with such a short fermentation time?

Thanks,

Scott D.

Dear Scott, I thank you dearly for your compliment. The flavor was there after 4 hours of dough-mass fermentation and 25 hours of dough-ball fermentation at room temperatures of about 72 to 78° F. Please, see the first and second pictures below, which may provide some clues. The first picture shows the dough balls at the beginning of the second fermentation, and the second picture exhibits the dough balls after undergoing 25 hours of fermentation. Nonetheless, the flavor of the pizza was categorically not as uplifting as the flavor of the pizza I baked tonight for dinner (using the direct method, 2.5 minutes of Santos mixing & kneading, Caputo Pizzeria flour, 62% hydration, 2.5% culture, 2.8% sea salt, 4+42 hours of fermentation at controlled marble chamber and room temperatures, and home gas oven). Have a great night!

Regards,
Omid

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1256 on:** February 14, 2012, 01:05:51 AM »

Continued . . .

Pizza Napoletana · « **Reply #1257 on:** February 14, 2012, 01:12:17 AM »

Quote from: Ev on February 13, 2012, 09:48:09 PM

Pizza just doesn't get any better looking than that!

Quote from: parallei on February 13, 2012, 10:16:46 PM

Beautiful pies Omid. The cheese and tomato is stunning, but you'd have to race me for a slice of the pep and mushroom.

Dear Ev and Parallei, I am grateful for your extolments! The pepperoni and mushroom pizza would have tasted better with the accompaniment of comrades such as yourselves. Good night!

bakeshack · « **Reply #1258 on:** February 14, 2012, 02:23:10 AM »

Omid, I love the balance of the small blisters around the cornicione!

Do you think the direct method (short bulk + long final rise) promotes smaller bubbles in the dough during fermentation as compared to the longer bulk and shorter final rise where you would usually see larger bubbles form in the dough after 24-36 hrs of bulk fermentation which I believe causes the large burnt bubbles in some parts of the cornicione during baking? You could really see these large bubbles when you stretch the dough.

Marlon

Tman1 · « **Reply #1259 on:** February 14, 2012, 09:25:03 AM »

I'll know I've arrived when my pizza's look as good as these coming out of a WFO... geez, they look awesome! How do you not work for a pizzeria?