First Attempt - YUM!!!

[chiguy]

 Hello peter & dave,
 I read the posts and have came up with a couple reasons for the lack of rise on the dough. The poolish is made with .33% yeast and specifically with cold water. It says 10-11 hours in the refridge which may not be long enough at cold temp to achieve enough fermentation? And there is always the possibility Dave may have been on the lighter side of .33% when he added the yeast for his poolish, adding to a even less fermentation. Also if he mixed the additional .66% yeast and 25% flour while the poolish was still very cold, there is a chance that the dough was still very cool and the 1hr & 40min additional rise time with a cooler kitchen temperature made for the under-fermented dough. The original recipe did also specify a rise in a warm place, i would assume this to be at least 80F? There are alot of reasons for lack of fermentation in a dough, old yeast,not enough yeast, too cold:dough or storage/refridgerator,not enough fermation time or poor gluten network. I assume it is between time and temperature in you're case. I also would not be so quick to give the recipe a thimbs down. The bland and cardboard taste you experienced are usually terms associated with under-fermentation. I hope it comes out better for you the next time.                          Goodluck, Chiguy 

[Pete-zza]

chiguy,

What you say makes sense, and it was the temperature issue that prompted my comment about the igloo. When Marco posted his recipe, it was late in March, not in the middle of December, and when JimBob used the recipe it was in June. So, some adjustment in the formulation may be required for this time of year, either increasing water temperature, using more yeast, or both, and possibly even lowering the salt a bit. As I have mentioned recently, I have been making adjustments to my dough formulations (mainly water temperature and amount of yeast, or both) to compensate for generally lower temperatures this time of year. Marco may also have an explanation we are all missing.

Peter

[chiguy]

 Hello Peter,
 I know what you mean about making the adjustments for winter. In the summer I keep a gallon of water on the tile floor, it keeps the water a bit under 70F. In the winter i bring it up to the counter top and it stays just about the same. I am sure Marco with his background in pizza making has the answer and hopefully it is similar to ours. I feel some of these italian recipes can take on more of a artisan type procedure. Alot more careful planning and experience, but how is one to learn if they do not try?   Chiguy

[canadave]

chiguy,

Good points...I guess I shouldn't be so hasty to dismiss the recipe on the basis of one bad experience.  I just don't seem to tolerate recipe failure well

In regard to the temperature--it is indeed quite cold up here near Edmonton, but I made sure to do the rise in my oven, which I heated to 100 degrees F quickly and then turned off.  The interior of the oven was nice and dark and warm (but not hot).

[chiguy]

 Hello Canadave
 The slightly heated oven was the right idea.  I still feel by the time the warmer temperature penetrates the colder dough, 1hour 40 min may not have been long enough to achieve adequate fermentation. This added with the possiblity of the poolish not fementing enough as well. I know you followed the recipe exactly, so the bland results make it even more frustrating. I've been there, It is what i mentioned to Peter that the Italian recipes can take on a artisan type approach. They may make water temp adjustments among other things to get the dough correct. The avg daily temperature for Sicily in December is 52F. I do not mean to imply that you do not have the knowledge to produce a great Sicilian pizza, I have read you're post before and know you have plenty of experience. I think it will just come down to making some more adjustments by way of fermentation time and temperature.          Goodluck,  Chiguy   

[pam]

Well, I'm sorry, but I've gotta give this recipe a thumbs down.  Problems:

--the dough never rose in the slightest (my yeast is fine, I just used it a week ago)
--the dough was WAY too wet and sticky, even after I broke with the recipe and added a bunch more semolina flour to try to dry it out a bit
--the taste was bland and cardboardish
--the 500-600g of final dough never came close to filling the pan to a depth of 1.5cm as it was apparently supposed to

Maybe it was just me and the way I prepped it--I'm willing to entertain that notion.  I'm willing to give it one more shot, if someone (either the original poster or someone else) would like to give more detailed instructions.

Candave,

You may have been using the wrong stuff.

The first time I tried making a pie using "semolina flour," I bought the gritty yellow stuff sold as "durum semolina" at Bulk Barn (I used to live in The Big Smoke; that's Toronto to those of you South of the 49th Parallel, eh? ) instead of durum flour (which looks and feels like AP or Bread flour) and had a similar experience: way too wet and sticky, couldn't dry it out despite adding massive amounts of flour beyond what the recipe called for, didn't rise, bland, etc. Once I figured out my mistake, I tried it again using durum flour: worked like a charm, and tasted frickin' awesome. (Sure wish I could find some place to buy durum flour locally, now that I'm living in the Deep South.)

[canadave]

Now THAT may very well be true.  The package just said "semolina", no mention of flour; and it basically looked like sand, not flour.  I'll see if I can swing by my local Italian grocer and check things out.

[pietradoro]

Maybe have a look at this: fine semolina flour.


http://www.todarobros.com/detail.aspx?ID=386

[pizza king]

Though i am newb as most would like to call me in my pizza making experiance I wanted to attempt making Sicilian For the superbowl

Yesterday i started by making the dough very similar recipe to Tom Lehmann NY Style Recipe...I was upset not to be able to find the Seminola file four in whole foods or Trader joes in my Area...or even high protien king Author was the way i went...

So I said the hell with it  and made an ordinary dough recipe... Then greased the panand put the dough in pan and placed it in the fridge over night. The result were outstanding.. one key i made finger prints in the dough before putting it in to the fridge and in the morning as well ... it grew in the pan also a let it grow before i put in the pan...


Then i cooked sauce on it by its self for approx 10 minutes at 550 and then added the cheese ...!!! It should be attempt without following that complex seminola recipe..make sure to grease the pan with olive oil ..