Author Topic: Mondako test ride on steel plate  (Read 2157 times)

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Offline Jet_deck

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Mondako test ride on steel plate
« on: October 25, 2011, 12:40:01 PM »
I followed Scott123's guidelines for a NY style crust from here :http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13827.msg138896.html#msg138896

I grabbed a piece of 1/2" steel plate from the shop before I left.  The plate measures 16" left to right, but only 11" front to rear, facing the oven. I made 2 batches in the Bosch with the spatula dough scraper, it was a tremendous help on this small batch.  I mixed the first batch to just a scrappy cottage cheese looking ball, and another a bit longer closer to window pane but there yet.  I covered both balls with plastic wrap then proofed them in my hot texas garage on the hood of my vehicle for 1.5 hours. Picture 1

I dumped the more developed ball into a pile of flour and began stretching.  I had it out to nearly 16" when i remembered it wan't all going to fit on the plate.  I cut the skin in half put in on the wooden peel and dressed it.  Ham, black olives and Oaxaca cheese.  Drained Cento Passata with salt, sugar, oregano for sauce. picture 2

The plate measured 530 degrees.  I loaded the skin on the stone, turned on the broiler and pulled it out after 6 min. picture 3 and 4.  They were pale, but well cooked and not doughy.

I wanted a little darker crust so I took the remaining 1/2 skin, topped and baked.  (pre bake picture 5) This time starting the broiler 3 minutes before launch. (after bake pic 6, 7 and 8)
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Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #1 on: October 25, 2011, 12:43:08 PM »
You will notice in pictures 6 and 7 the darker pizza sitting next to it's pale friend from the first bake.  I hope these qualify for NY'ish.  I balled the scrappier dough and put it to rest in the refer until tonight.
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

scott123

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2011, 01:15:46 PM »
An 11" plate, Gene?  What are you trying to do, make silver dollar pizzas for the kids?  ;D

Seriously, though, I'm impressed.  Pie #2 is very much on par with a good NY slice from the 'golden age' of NY pizza (1975 to about 1995). For your first outing with steel, especially an odd shaped piece of steel, that's amazing.

I'm guessing this 11 x 16 plate was probably just lying around, right? Any chance you can get something larger? With NY, the magic really doesn't start happening until you hit at least 16" in diameter, with 18" being the holy grail.  My oven can only fit a 17.5", so I'm forced to make 17" pies, but I look forward to the day when I have a larger oven.

How far is the plate from the broiler? Could you position it a little closer?

Btw, kneading goes hand in hand with fermentation time.  The cottage cheese-yness is strictly an extended cold ferment thing (longer than a day).  If you go with an emergency time frame, then more kneading/smoother dough is in order.

Pre-heat time?  I forget, what's your oven's peak temp?
« Last Edit: October 25, 2011, 01:17:27 PM by scott123 »

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2011, 03:45:04 PM »
Thanks for saying that it looked like the real deal, that makes me feel good about the results.

Yes, I will have them shear me a piece 5 x 16 to add to what I have, so that should put me up to 16 x 16.  I can get the plate up closer to the broiler.  Would you rather see a shorter cook time -or- more browning?  Or both?

Preheat 2 hours.  I don't know the peak temp, but 500 is all that is available on the input.

Thanks for the suggestions. :chef: :pizza:
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

scott123

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #4 on: October 25, 2011, 05:00:23 PM »
Gene, you are officially the first person to be working with steel plate along with an oven who's dial only goes to 500.  The fact that you're able to hit 530 is encouraging, but you're still a bit behind the eight ball as far as getting the oven temp you'll need for the perfect bake times.

Encouraging faster browning with a bit more sugar would help. You could add more sugar to the recipe, but I'd rather see you bump up the sugar by going with the 2 day ferment that's in the original recipe.  That will give you a faster bake time and a little more charring.

When it comes both to launching pizza comfortably and enjoying the best aspects of a NY slice, your hearth can't be too big.  As I've said elsewhere, you want the plate sized so that it will touch the back wall and the door will have just enough clearance to close. It sounds like 16" x 16" is what you're going to be working with for the foreseeable future, but, remember, bigger is always better.

And speaking of bigger...  for an oven with a 500 dial, 3/4" steel would guarantee you those magical 4 minute bakes. Most people steer clear of 3/4" because of the hassle of reinforcing a shelf to handle the extra weight, but most people don't have your DIY skills :)

1/2" steel plate will pre-heat to your oven's peak temp (530) in no more than hour.   Any more pre-heat than that and you're just driving up your utility bill. And ramping up the surface temp of the stone with the broiler isn't buying you much.  Since the thermostat at the top of the oven will always be turning the broiler on and off, you'll never be able to drive the core temp of the plate that much higher than what you get with the hour-ish bottom element pre-heat. The broiler element's most important role is both being close enough to the pizza to brown it quickly and to stay on during the bake.

If you're following my recipe and have the broiler about 7" from the steel plate, I'd move it up a groove.

The extra sugar from the cold ferment isn't going to get you into the ideal 4 minute realm, so we'll probably have to try a few other things, but, for now, since your pizza turned out so well, I want to take small steps. Next time, go with a 2 day cold ferment and move the plate closer to the broiler.

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #5 on: October 25, 2011, 05:28:44 PM »
.... And speaking of bigger...  for an oven with a 500 dial, 3/4" steel would guarantee you those magical 4 minute bakes....

I'm taking home a 3/4" plate 16" x 12".  How long should I preheat it?  3 hours? :-D
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scott123

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #6 on: October 25, 2011, 06:14:07 PM »
Gene, don't believe what anyone says, size matters  :-D I'm loving the 3/4", but, again with the 12" x 16"?

I'm guessing that since you're 'taking it home' it sounds like this is another plate that was just lying around.  If it is free or close to free, then, by all means, play around with it, but I'd really like to see you, at some point, work with the biggest plate your oven can handle.

One of the many fantastic things about steel plate is that it's high level of conductivity allows for blazing fast pre-heats.  As you go thicker, obviously, the pre-heat time expands, but, since it's steel, it shouldn't need much time to begin with. For 3/4", I honestly think that an hour will do the trick.  If you're worried about it, go with 75 minutes. No more than that, though.

Think about how quickly a cast iron griddle pre-heats on a red hot burner.  Convection is a lot slower than conduction, but you're still talking about a material that accepts heat very readily.
« Last Edit: October 25, 2011, 06:26:06 PM by scott123 »

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #7 on: October 26, 2011, 09:13:02 PM »
... I'm loving the 3/4", but, again with the 12" x 16"?....


I have created some unneeded confusion, so let me fix that.  The interior of my oven is 18" wide x 16" deep.  The half inch plate that I started with is 18 wide, not 16, i mis-measured.  It is 12" deep, so I am filling up the width of the oven, just not the depth.

The 3/4" plate that I brought home last night was actually 3 pieces of "bar stock" 3/4" thick, 4" wide and I had it cut 16" long (thinking thats what I already had that fit the width).  I had 3 pieces cut for a total width of 12"

Instead of changing to many variables last night, I decided to just raise the 1/2" plate in the oven, and not use the 3/4" material.

I let the dough ball sit at room temp for 2 hours to warm up.  It smelled like alcohol, not a beery musty smell, but like grain alcohol, everclear, or vodka.  Is that Esterish?  I stretched it out to 18" cut it in half and topped it.  With only a 14" peel, I have 2" of extra dough hanging over the sides.  Anywho, I got it placed on the steel, and hit broil.  I forgot to hit the extra start/enter button to confirm broil.  So nothing remotely exciting happened.  But pictures, anyway.
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends

scott123

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #8 on: October 26, 2011, 09:37:42 PM »
Ah, I see what you're talking about now, Gene. Thanks for clearing that up.

It sounds like one more piece of bar stock will give you 3/4" x 16 x 16, right?  That's, for your oven, the best possible scenario.  The two inch total clearance (one inch per side) should be perfect for allowing heat from the bottom to reach the top of the plate.

Can you get your hands on a quality 16" peel?  Once you have that and can do 15.5"ish pies, you will be completely dominating NY style pizza.

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #9 on: October 26, 2011, 10:35:16 PM »
 Once you have that and can do 15.5"ish pies, you will be completely dominating NY style pizza.

That is good to know my friend. :P :chef:
« Last Edit: October 26, 2011, 10:43:20 PM by Jet_deck »
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Offline ThePieman

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #10 on: October 31, 2011, 01:54:14 AM »
A 16" x 16" x .75" plate would be almost 60 lbs. Would you need to reinforce the oven rack and/or oven side walls to hold that much weight?

Offline communist

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #11 on: October 31, 2011, 10:23:55 AM »
My 40 lb steel plate 17 x 17 x 1/2 bends my rack.  I would not want to go much over that without risk of collapsing my rack.

Offline Jet_deck

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Re: Mondako test ride on steel plate
« Reply #12 on: October 31, 2011, 10:33:30 AM »
A 16" x 16" x .75" plate would be almost 60 lbs. Would you need to reinforce the oven rack and/or oven side walls to hold that much weight?

It is easier for me to ask for forgiveness than to ask for permission.  So I probably won't try to reinforce anything.  But I think that everyone else should.
Her mind is Tiffany-twisted, she got the Mercedes bends


 

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