Author Topic: Finally some NP pies  (Read 17972 times)

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Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #80 on: March 01, 2012, 03:35:08 AM »
Tonight's dinner:

100% San Felice STG
61% Water
2.5% Culture
2.8% Sea Salt

Hand mix/knead method with 2 S&F sessions.  My KA mixer broke down  :(

2 hrs bulk fermented, 42-hr balled @ 62-65F.  It looks like this is the sweet spot for me in getting even leoparding around the crust.  I'm very happy with the long "window of usability" of this dough since I feel that I could have used the dough 4-6 hrs earlier and another 4-6 hrs later without any significant detriment to the end product. 

The dough was very airy but did not have the extra large bubbles that I would usually get with the long bulk method.  I haven't revisited the long bulk method but I will do it this weekend so I can post any significant difference in my results.  I have been quite happy with this current workflow though. 

Some pics:










Offline tscaife

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #81 on: March 01, 2012, 06:03:40 AM »
Beautiful pies a s always Bakeshack!

Do you notice a difference in flavor between the short and long bulk rise?

Any differences in flavor, texture or window of usability between the shorter vs longer balled phase? (42h @ 62*-65* vs 28h @ 68* - 72*)

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #82 on: March 01, 2012, 08:33:16 AM »
Nice Marlon, I need to play around with a shorter bulk for NP as well.   Crumb looks great.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #83 on: March 01, 2012, 11:11:16 AM »
Frekin' gorgeous pies Marlon. What all is on the second?

CL
Pizza is not bread.

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #84 on: March 01, 2012, 01:38:33 PM »
Thanks guys! 

Craig, the 2nd pie has cremini & white mushroom, aged cheddar, mozzarella, mascarpone, black pepper inspired by your mushroom pie.

Tscaife, the short and long bulk dough pretty much have the same texture and flavor in my experience.  The main difference, which was originally my purpose of doing the short bulk method, was to control the fermentation bubbles in my balled dough and make the dough last longer so I don't have to rush or bake at a specific time just in case something in my schedule comes up.  It gets pretty handy especially during parties and I'm cooking so many other stuff. 

With regards to the 28-hr & 42-hr balls, the flavor is almost the same with a very slight hint of the sourdough flavor with the 42-hr which I prefer.  Texture-wise, both are soft and tender but in a slightly different way for each. The 28-hr is not as aerated (but still very light) and gives you the flatter rim look like some pizzas I see in Naples.  The 42-hr is much closer to the long bulk method but without the large bubbles that burn in the oven.  I guess they are an illustration of the window of usability of this method with the 28-hr showing what you would get during the very early stages while the 42-hr shows the prime stage of the dough.  Next time I will go for the late stages of this window by using it at 50 hrs or so and see the difference.  I guess in my experience with the long bulk method, I couldn't do that without getting very large bubbles or if I use it early, the dough will not be as easy to stretch.  Maybe it was just me but I plan to work on that next time. 

Marlon

Offline tscaife

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #85 on: March 01, 2012, 02:39:38 PM »
Thank you Marlon!

I made dough at 2 + 24 @ 67*-70* Monday night with 3% (of flour weight) starter and they looked and smelled great! Based on the smell I think they would have been slightly sour. Unfortunately I couldn't eat them...

Direct vs indirect fermentation is very intriguing and I appreciate you sharing your experience.

Todd

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #86 on: March 01, 2012, 03:30:05 PM »
You're welcome, Todd.  Have you baked the dough you made last Monday already? 

Offline tscaife

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #87 on: March 01, 2012, 04:04:45 PM »
No pizza for lent.

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #88 on: March 01, 2012, 04:22:01 PM »
Oh I understand.  For us, it's no rice for lent.  So, I guess I have to make pizza 2x a week.  ;D

Offline tscaife

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #89 on: March 01, 2012, 05:43:27 PM »
Oh I understand.  For us, it's no rice for lent.  So, I guess I have to make pizza 2x a week.  ;D

Please do and keep the pics coming. I want to keep torturing myself.  :pizza: :pizza: :pizza:


Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #90 on: March 01, 2012, 09:01:17 PM »
Tonight's dinner. . . .

Dear Marlon, looking at the beautiful pictures of your pizzas, you appear to have been skillfully applying the initial short fermentation of your dough mass followed by long fermentation of the resultant dough balls. Thank you for the pictures!
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

http://pizzanapoletanismo.com/2011/09/27/a-philosophy-of-pizza-napoletanismo/

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #91 on: March 02, 2012, 12:25:49 AM »
Omid, thank you for the kind words.  Coming from you, it means a lot to me. 

Marlon

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #92 on: March 04, 2012, 10:04:55 PM »
Lunch today:

100 % Caputo Pizzeria
61% Water
2% Starter
2.8% Salt

Hand mixed/kneaded.  24 hrs bulk fermented @ 60F, 14 hrs balled @ 60F and 75F during the last 4 hours.  Baked at 890F for 55 secs. 

1.  Merguez sausage, cherry tomato, red onion, fresh mozzarella, basil
2)  Chorizo, jalapeno, tomato, egg, mozzarella

I made a few more variety of toppings but my guests were hungry today so I didn't get a chance to take pictures anymore.

Some pics:




Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #93 on: March 04, 2012, 10:10:58 PM »
Your crust looks fantastic Marlon.  So did you decide which workflow you liked better?

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #94 on: March 04, 2012, 10:24:20 PM »
Chau, thank you!  It was very light, probably lighter than my previous 2 bakes using the short bulk/long ball method.  I really love the texture from the long bulk method because it always comes out a bit lighter with more bubbles in the crust.  Maybe it was also partly due to my switch over to hand mix/knead method, I'm not sure yet.  My only issue is controlling the large bubbles which I feel I was able to accomplish somehow with this particular bake, maybe a little more next time.  I like the short bulk method because of the ease in the workflow, so I am thinking of doing a hybrid of the 2 methods next time.  Maybe I'll do 8-hr bulk and 24-30 hr ball.  I noticed that when Omid increase the bulk fermentation time (but still shorter than the total balled time) with his last 2 pies, his crust looked a bit more puffy and lighter but with no extremely large bubbles which tend to burn with high heat. 


Marlon

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #95 on: March 04, 2012, 10:48:55 PM »
Yes I agree Marlon, a hybrid of the 2 will accomplish a lighter crust and avoid the large bubbles.  So a moderate bulk.   We should probably see it as a matter of gluten strength or volume displacement rather than a timed event.  I will continue experimenting as well. 

Chau
« Last Edit: March 05, 2012, 12:20:26 AM by Jackie Tran »

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #96 on: March 05, 2012, 12:09:22 AM »
Chau, I agree.  I usually just use time as a guide when I'm posting here for others to get an idea.  I always go by look and smell of the dough so I can make the necessary adjustment during fermentation taking into account the ever changing temperature, humidity, etc.  It gets more difficult once balled because I use the large proofing boxes for my balled dough so I cannot fit them in the cooler, etc.  All the variables we have to contend with at home, unlike in a commercial setting, make it especially difficult for the discerning home bakers and pizzaiolo's to achieve the product that we cannot get anywhere else unless we go to each other's house.   :-D

Marlon

Offline pizza dr

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #97 on: March 06, 2012, 08:14:23 AM »
What time should I be over?

Those pies look great.  You have a very distinct style to your pizzas.  I took your egg idea this weekend though...  I sous vide an egg for about an hour and placed it on top of a fresh chorizo, mozz pie.  It was over the top.  I mean that literally... my brother and I could only eat a few bites... very rich.  Of course it was after we had a half dozen or so slices  before that ;D... maybe I'll do that one again towards the beginning of the afternoon.

Scot

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #98 on: March 06, 2012, 02:07:22 PM »
Thank you Scot!  I appreciate it!  You can come anytime you are here in SoCal.   I'm still working on the aesthetics of the pie but I'm very happy with the flavor and texture right now.  It is very light.

I agree, the chorizo pie has a lot of punch and very rich.  If you can eat the whole pie, you're done for the day!  :-D. It's an absolute crowd-pleaser though.   I usually make it midway.

Marlon

Offline bakeshack

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Re: Finally some NP pies
« Reply #99 on: March 28, 2012, 01:17:58 AM »
Tonight's dinner:

100% Central Milling Panissimo 00
68% Water
2.8% Salt
3% Starter

Hand mixed/kneaded.  3-hrs bulk, 22-hrs ball (65-70F).  At this hydration level, the dough is very similar to the Caputo and San Felice.  Very light and easy to open.  Baked at 850F for 70-80 secs.  The crust was very light and tender just like the Caputo Pizzeria.  

Some pics:

1)  Cherry tomato, fresh mozz, basil
2)  Iberico ham de bellota, manchego cheese, tomato sauce
3)  Figs, prosciutto, garrotxa cheese, fresh mozz, marcona almond
4)  Catalonian sausage, caramelized onions, red onion, fresh mozz

« Last Edit: March 28, 2012, 06:26:33 AM by bakeshack »