Author Topic: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina  (Read 180042 times)

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Offline pythonic

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #775 on: June 02, 2014, 08:31:27 PM »
*** Corrections: I initially put "DKM" in here where I meant BTB -- oops. ***

I took my visiting sister, her husband and my wife down to Chicago yesterday for a museum visit and planned the trip around visiting Malnati's on State street -- I had only been to Uno's on previous trips to Chicago but after reading this thread, had to try Malnati's.

My sister and I split one of the buttery-crust versions of the classic sausage deep dish pies; it was fantastic as I had expected.  The crust was airy but with a crunchy bottom, really nice texture.

So this new reference benchmark gave me the impetus to ask here about what the heck went wrong with my last two attempts to duplicate this crust...

A few weeks ago, I tried the basic recipe from the realdeepdish.com website.  I followed the usual procedures for making a Chicago-style as I always do, and found that the crust didn't really "fluff up" like I was expecting -- usually with a Chicago-style pizza from Uno's I can eat it by cutting off a chunk easily with the side of my fork -- the crust should be tender enough that there's just a bit of extra resistance as it cuts through the bottom part of the crust.  Well, trying to do that with this pizza was very hard -- the crust was dense and tough.  Had to use a lot of pressure to cut off a piece.  Hmm.  I figured it might be the recipe...

The following week, I took a stab at the later BTB crust recipe in this thread with semolina.  Followed the instructions very closely.  Very little kneading, and I mean VERY LITTLE, mostly to just get the dough in a ball, so I wouldn't develop the gluten -- adding the butter at the end like the recipe indicates.  Refrigerator rest in a ziploc bag overnight, warmup prior to putting into the pan.

I thought I was right on target with this dough because when I pulled the warmed-up dough out of the bowl to put into the pan, where I tore the dough off the ball (I was using an 8-inch pan with 9-inch recipe, so I left a little dough in the bowl), the dough had a beautiful fluffy character to it.

I pressed it into the pan (I'm using one of the pizzatools.com dark gray pre-seasoned deep dish pans), added the cheese, sausage and sauce and baked it -- I had preheated the oven and my stone to 475 then dropped the oven to about 440, and put the pan on the stone.  Rotated after about 15 minutes, put a little foil over the top to prevent overbrowning of the top cheese.  Baked for about 25 minutes total.

I was stoked because the dough going in looked so great, but when I cut the pizza the crust was just kind of dense and tough.  Again, fork-side-cutting was difficult.

What the heck could I be doing wrong?  I'm attaching a photo I took of the BTB attempt.  Maybe I'm just loading the thing with too much sauce, and that's keeping the dough from rising properly when baked?  The Malnati's pizza we had yesterday did have a lot less sauce than I use.  As you can see in the photo, the crust bottom and sides were nicely browned and didn't look overdone to me, but as the crust there was extremely tough, I have to wonder what could have caused that -- I sprayed the pan with a little Crisco cooking spray prior to pressing the dough in.  Should I use more?  Less?  Something else?  Would it help to let the pressed-out dough in the pan sit for a while before adding the toppings to let it rise a bit?

I think I'll make another batch of dough tonight and try again tomorrow, with less sauce this time, more like I had at Malnati's.  But if anyone has some ideas about what I could do differently to correct this problem, I'd appreciate hearing them!

Edit: I just put the dough into my proofing box for the initial 90-minute rise.  Went together nicely and I have my fingers crossed...

Klankster,

You may have been using too much semolina for your likes. Mixing procedure is also key with the oil and water.  Check out my creation using BTBs recipe as a starting guideline.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=30152.0
« Last Edit: June 02, 2014, 09:23:54 PM by pythonic »
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Offline dulcevita

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #776 on: July 07, 2014, 01:27:12 PM »
 
    ***Using the deep-dish dough calculation tool, the flour (in this case KAAP) came out to
             "Flour (100%):  190.25 g  |  6.71 oz | 0.42 lbs," but per Peter's suggestion, you need to deduct
             the amount of semolina to ensure a proper balance of flour in total.





what does this mean, what do i deduct from?

Offline Garvey

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #777 on: July 07, 2014, 01:45:24 PM »
The 190.25g of flour is all the flour: all purpose plus semolina flour, combined weight.

i.e.,
Quote
Flour ***  (100%):  161.71 g |  5.7 oz | 0.36 lbs
Water (47%):  89.42 g  |  3.15 oz | 0.2 lbs
ADY (.6%):  1.14 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.3 tsp | 0.1 tbsp
Salt (.5%):  0.95 g | 0.03 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp
Olive Oil (5%):  9.51 g | 0.34 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.11 tsp | 0.7 tbsp
Corn Oil (18%):  34.24 g | 1.21 oz | 0.08 lbs | 7.61 tsp | 2.54 tbsp
Butter/Margarine (1%):  1.9 g | 0.07 oz | 0 lbs | 0.4 tsp | 0.13 tbsp
Semolina (15%):  28.54 g | 1.01 oz | 0.06 lbs | 8.2 tsp | 2.73 tbsp
Total (187.1%): 355.95 g | 12.56 oz | 0.78 lbs | TF = 0.126875
 
    ***Using the deep-dish dough calculation tool, the flour (in this case KAAP) came out to
             "Flour (100%):  190.25 g  |  6.71 oz | 0.42 lbs," but per Peter's suggestion, you need to deduct
             the amount of semolina to ensure a proper balance of flour in total.

Offline dulcevita

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #778 on: July 07, 2014, 06:38:55 PM »
Ok, just though by chance maybe it meant to deduct it from the 161.71 g. Thanks for the reply.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #779 on: July 07, 2014, 07:01:56 PM »
Ok, just though by chance maybe it meant to deduct it from the 161.71 g. Thanks for the reply.
Good luck with your Chicago deep dish pizza d.   :chef:

cb
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Offline dulcevita

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #780 on: July 07, 2014, 07:29:44 PM »
Thanks I actually try'd a recipe I had found on here. It was very good but i'd like to tweek it a lil. I think I may use buttered flavored oil and mess with some of the levels of ingredients or maybe let the dough rise in some oil itself  like in focaccia . this one does not seem to have that same oil'y quality I look for in my CSDP ( new acronym to dispute) or my focaccia bread. 

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #781 on: July 07, 2014, 07:42:31 PM »
Thanks I actually try'd a recipe I had found on here. It was very good but i'd like to tweek it a lil. I think I may use buttered flavored oil and mess with some of the levels of ingredients or maybe let the dough rise in some oil itself  like in focaccia . this one does not seem to have that same oil'y quality I look for in my CSDP ( new acronym to dispute) or my focaccia bread.
I think corn oil is THE way to go and use butter flavored Crisco for your pan. Once you have a solid recipe the only thing to really mess with, to me, would be semolina amounts.

And for a solid, authentic recipe I don`t think you can do any better than to go with member pythonic, Nate, most recent CSDP recipe. He is on his game d.   :chef:

cb
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Offline dulcevita

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #782 on: July 07, 2014, 07:59:59 PM »
Ill have to give it a try I can only eat so much though. I love this site, but it makes things so easy. >:D

Offline vcb

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #783 on: July 07, 2014, 08:56:24 PM »
Shouldn't that be CSDDP ?  :pizza:  :chef:
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #784 on: July 07, 2014, 09:03:59 PM »
Shouldn't that be CSDDP ?  :pizza:  :chef:
:-D    you are sharp Ed.

Sorry, I should have recommended your excellent site also, to Miss d,  as a great base for starting out on this style pizza.

cb
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Offline dulcevita

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #785 on: July 07, 2014, 11:38:22 PM »
Ya, just checked it out looks awesome. cant wait until my pizza game picks up a little and I can contribute back to the site, there's def alot of helpful info on this site.

Offline Clive At Five

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #786 on: February 19, 2015, 07:31:56 PM »
Hey, all! It's been quite some time since I dropped in, but I'm still making pizzas and I figured I'd share one of my latest pies and pick the brains of the knowledgeable pizza-makers here :)

I recently moved, which came with a couple setbacks to my recent pizza-making. For one, I lost my pizza stone in the move, which isn't the end of the world since I can just get a new one (recommendations?) I am also struggling with a foreign oven (who would've thought I'd miss old satan's furnace?).

The crusts of my recent pies have been coming out fairly pale and flexible. I've tried increasing the temp, but that leads to over-cooking of the top. I've tried decreasing the temp & increasing the cook time (low and slow?) but after 45 minutes for a 9-inch, there's still no color. I've tried using different types of pan lubricant (butter for it's lower smoke point, oil in an attempt to "fry" the crust). I've tried to vary the recipe to create a crispier crust (notably higher and higher amounts of rice flour). No matter what I try, the crust comes out... floppy and pale. (Note pics below, pic 1 is uncooked, pic 2 is cooked. Virtually no difference in color.)

My ideal pie has a golden, crisp and slightly flaky crust -- I realize that this is probably EVERYONE'S ideal deep dish, but so that it's clear that these are my pizza goals, I figured I'd make the obvious known. :)

The pies always taste great, but the texture is off. (Hats off to BTB and all the contributors to this fantastic recipe!)

Thanks for your feedback!

-Clive
« Last Edit: February 19, 2015, 08:10:18 PM by Clive At Five »

Offline Brewman

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Re: Malnati Deep Dish with Semolina
« Reply #787 on: March 05, 2015, 09:51:43 PM »
What brand of yeast is used for the dough? ADY or IDY?