Author Topic: My Neapolitan Progress  (Read 33809 times)

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Online Pete-zza

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #50 on: January 09, 2012, 12:42:20 PM »
Jordan,

My recollection is that the oil that is sometimes used is sunflower oil, as Marco (pizzanapoletana) mentions in Reply 24 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,656.msg11520/topicseen.html#msg11520.

As to the autolyse, I have read that a riposo is sometimes used at the end of the dough knead, which some people may refer to as autolyse, but I have not read of the classic autolyse being used as conceived by Prof. Calvel. But, there is no harm in trying autolyse, or even another form of rest period that is not technically an autolyse, to see if it helps.

Peter


Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #51 on: January 09, 2012, 12:52:38 PM »
Jordan, not sure if you saw this or not but I made this in the home oven awhile ago.  Does this pie have any qualities of a NP pie?


Offline salvatoregianpaolo

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #52 on: January 09, 2012, 12:54:38 PM »
Jordan,

Yes!  Another good point:  the pies were much larger than I anticipated, as well, both at Da Michele and Gino Sorbillo.  Yet as big as they were, they were so light on the stomach.  

Regarding Autolyse, Peter knows a lot more about it than I do, as I'm pretty sure he's read Prof. Calvel's book, but what I've garnered from Jeffrey Hamlman, who was a student and proponent of Calvel's methods, is the true benefit to autolyse lies in it's ability to shorten knead times.  This "minimizes oxidation and loss of carotenoids," resulting in "greater volume, a better flavor, a creamier and more open crumb structure, and more pronounced cuts." (Bread: A Baker's Book of Techniques, Hamelman)  The real benefit, as I see it, is helping the baker to avoid over-mixing the dough.  Since you are hand-mixing, it would be very difficult for you to do that.  Of course, experimentation is best, and the only real way to find out what works for each and every one of us!

Grazie,
Salvatore

Offline Jordan

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #53 on: January 09, 2012, 01:09:59 PM »
Jordan,

My recollection is that the oil that is sometimes used is sunflower oil, as Marco (pizzanapoletana) mentions in Reply 24 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,656.msg11520/topicseen.html#msg11520.

Pete, in the quote it says "sunflower oil", in the link it says "soya seed oil" and if you google "Da Michele Soy Oil" you will see in the 2nd or 3rd link a NY Times article from 1989 where in the first column of paragraphs it says they finish there pie with a mixture of olive and "soybean oil".. So, which one is it? Is there a brand out there that you or anyone you know uses that is a "mixture" of olive and soybean oils? What is Soya seed oil? Ive never heard of this..  Confused.. Also, I will def try the autolyse for sure! But what is this "riposo" you speak of? Thanks pete!

Chau, wow.. that pie looked incredible. The tear was what did it for me! I live at 817 tappan st. forked river, NJ.. Feel free to ship one of those my way! haha but, to answer your question, yes and no. The pie looked incredible, but the cornicione isnt quite there from what I see before and even after you tear the pie. Im sure if you through that bad boy in a 900f wfo it would spring up in a heart beat and charr like a dream. When you finish tearing it, and eat the slice, I notice the pie has some sort of stiff quality, not stiff as a bad thing, but neapolitan pizza is floppy and wont hold that shape you were able to achieve prior to taking that bite. I hope this answers your question. But, all in all. I would need to taste to make true judgements.

Salvatore, Im happy you posted some quotes because for someone hand mixing like me if def makes me want to try this technique! Thank you sir. And as for your comment "Yet as big as they were, they were so light on the stomach" I remember having a conversation in regards to this light feeling and its incredible the amount of information Omid was able to give me on this subject. Its the way the dough is handled at all stages of its creation. From the mixing to the slapping out. Also as you guys know, which I just learned, some mixers (mostly the planetary mixers) are too fast and dont work at slow enough RPM's as lets say the fork mixer used at da michele, so the dough really suffers from being over worked in the mixing and kneading stages in the machine. Apparently it also gets heated up, which is very bad! And it causes bleaching of the dough. Which I am not an expert on, but I am aware of it being a bad thing. Of course with knowledge of mixers and the way dough works you could probably use any mixer and get a decent product. Its like Jimmy Hendrix picking up a toys R us brand guitar, obviously he wont be able to play to his full abilities because he wont have his original tools (ex. a slow RPM fork mixer) but his knowledge, skill, passion, and feel for what he loves will produce a product that is still golden.
-Jordan

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #54 on: January 09, 2012, 01:26:16 PM »
Thanks Jordan, that was just a pie I was messing around with in the home oven.  I wasn't expecting you too much.  I agree, the dough may act very different in a wfo.  The stiffness may also be a difference of thickness factor and size of pizza as well.  In the home oven, I'm only able to make a 10-11" pie at most because the size of my broiler.  I would love to travel to Naples or anywhere in the states to have the real deal someday.  Until then I can only keep experimenting.  ;D

Good luck in your quest.
Chau

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #55 on: January 09, 2012, 01:36:33 PM »
Chau - I have to say that is an amazing pie. I did not see that until now - incredible Da Michele clone.

John

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #56 on: January 09, 2012, 02:44:15 PM »
Jordan,

I completely forgot about the soya seed oil. Soya seed oil/soy oil is soybean oil. In the U.S., it is commonly called vegetable oil. It is very popular among pizza operators, including the big chains, because it is so readily available and just about the cheapest oil you can find. Sunflower oil on the other hand is much harder to find at the retail level. None of the stores near me carry it.

Riposo is a rest period that usually takes place at the end of the knead, as Marco mentions at Reply 59 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1415.msg15195.html#msg15195. It is not a classic autolyse because the dough at that stage has just about all of the ingredients in it although sometimes the salt might be added late in the process, especially if the flour is a strong flour. Evelyne Slomon also discusses her understanding of riposo and its origins in the next to the last paragraph in her post at Reply 16 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3873.msg32525.html#msg32525. Bill/SFNM is also a big user of riposo, as he mentions at Reply 225 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14506.msg147521/topicseen.html#msg147521. See, also, Bill's quoted material in Reply 341 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1053.msg12210/topicseen.html#msg12210.

Peter

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #57 on: January 09, 2012, 09:55:46 PM »
Chau - I have to say that is an amazing pie. I did not see that until now - incredible Da Michele clone.

John

Thanks John.  That was during the time we talked about doing a DM clone.  I gave it a few tries then got side tracked with other experiments.

Offline Jordan

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #58 on: January 09, 2012, 10:30:38 PM »
Jordan,

I completely forgot about the soya seed oil. Soya seed oil/soy oil is soybean oil. In the U.S., it is commonly called vegetable oil. It is very popular among pizza operators, including the big chains, because it is so readily available and just about the cheapest oil you can find. Sunflower oil on the other hand is much harder to find at the retail level. None of the stores near me carry it.

Riposo is a rest period that usually takes place at the end of the knead, as Marco mentions at Reply 59 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1415.msg15195.html#msg15195. It is not a classic autolyse because the dough at that stage has just about all of the ingredients in it although sometimes the salt might be added late in the process, especially if the flour is a strong flour. Evelyne Slomon also discusses her understanding of riposo and its origins in the next to the last paragraph in her post at Reply 16 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3873.msg32525.html#msg32525. Bill/SFNM is also a big user of riposo, as he mentions at Reply 225 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14506.msg147521/topicseen.html#msg147521. See, also, Bill's quoted material in Reply 341 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1053.msg12210/topicseen.html#msg12210.

Peter

Thanks so much for the links pete! I really understand the process now after reading. But in regards to the oil Da Michele uses to finish there pies, I highly doubt it is vegetable oil.. Do you know if there is any popular oil used in Naples that isnt a Extra Virgin Olive Oil? Apparently Da Michele uses Soybean oil because its cheap, but in the article it says they use a mixture of olive and soybean oils to finish there pies. Im very interested in this. I have found these on the web and I wonder if they would be good for finishing a pie (similar in flavor to da michele of course) !!

This oil is super cheap! Organic Soybean oil, 64 oz. at $13!!

http://www.amazon.com/Cibaria-Organic-Soybean-Oil-64/dp/B004D0AJVS/?tag=pizzamaking-20

This is a 8.5 oz. bottle of Soybean and Extra Virgin Olive Oil for $2.50!! and the second link only $1.29

http://www.ecrater.com/p/12573303/pampa-pure-soybean-extra-virgin
http://www.netgrocer.com/pd/Pampa/Pure-Soybean-Oil-and-Extra-Virgin-Olive-Oil/8-50-fl-oz/857361000596/?clksrc=gproduct

Heres a 8 oz. bottle of blended soy and olive oil for $4.50

http://www.bonanza.com/listings/8-Ounce-Soybean-and-Olive-OiL-Blend/13004655

Another brand of Blended Olive and Soybean oil, 8.5 oz for $3.61

These are the ones I was able to find on the net. Do any of these look good? Or has anyone had experience with these? Please let me know! I am interested in cloning the Da Michele, and Im sure you guys know that! I would love to be able to have the kinda oil they use or something similar and since this stuff is like dirt cheap it would be a gold mine for the tongue! Thanks!

-Jordan


Offline dellavecchia

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #59 on: January 10, 2012, 06:20:03 AM »
Hi Jordan - Vegetable oil is a generic term for a number of different seed oils, one being soybean. Most producers of "vegetable" oil use soybeans as their source.

http://www.crisco.com/Products/ProductDetail.aspx?groupID=15&prodID=303

When you say "finish" the pie at Da Michele, are you saying they dress the pizza after it comes out of the oven? My understanding is that they only drizzle just before it goes in. And the use of a flavorless oil (soybean) is to let the tomatoes and cheese come through as cleanly as possible. It also may allow them to keep the costs down.

Chau - Do you have a thread post that outlines your clone formula/workflow?

John

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #60 on: January 10, 2012, 09:48:56 AM »
Craig, I have been reading a lot of your posts and looking at your pies and I must say they look absolutely delicious! I am happy you decided to chime in this thread, and I am glad you told me about your experience with autolyse. I am aware that it is not common practice in naples, but Dellavecchia has told me that Da Michele does an autolyse, so Im tempted to try it. And I heard it makes your dough kneading time significantly shorter, but I dont know if this is proven. Since I do all my mixing and kneading by hand, its difficult for me to come to a conclusion on whats the best possible technique. I dont want to keep wasting dough, even though I know experimenting is all the fun, but there is a lot that can go wrong with simply altering 1 step in your dough making procedure..

I wasnít trying to suggest that you shouldnít try it; rather I would encourage you to try it. Itís how you learn. I donít see it as wasting dough, and dough is pretty inexpensive. Youíll pick up all sorts of experience in many areas when you experiment, and youíll learn lots of things you didnít set out to learn. And, as you noted, itís fun.

As Iím sure you are figuring out, there are many ways to skin the cat. Employing some variant of autolyse may reduce your kneading time, notwithstanding my knead time is about 3 minutes without it, and there are methods producing good results with zero knead time.

Thank you for the complement on my pies. Iím happy to help the best I can with any specific questions you might have.

Craig
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline BurntFingers

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #61 on: January 10, 2012, 10:33:13 AM »
Jordan,
I've read through many of the posts in My Neapolitan Progress.  You are getting there..  Might I recommend that you go up to north Jersey and check out  the Pizzaiolo at Amano .  Occasionally, they offer free demonstration classes using their Neapolitan WFO's. They have only certified Pizzaioli working there.   They use the 00 flour in the Blue Caputo Bags and sell the small 1kg Red bags of Caputo 00 flour.  We have attended a few of their sessions and picked up a few tricks and methods that we have tweaked and used in our WFO at home.   Truth be told we don't fire it up unless we can make at least 10 pizza's. The most we've done in an afternoon is 36 for a party.  If we don't have a crowd to eat them they go in the freezer.
The recipe we use we developed to suit our household equipment.  We do measure everything in grams and use only Caputo 00 Blue and starter from Campania.  Often times after the pizza oven cools down we bake breads.  Bread and Pizza from scratch is a two or three day event.  No use rushing things. Our typical yield is 16 loaves of artisan breads. It goes into freezer or we give it away. 
Bill 

Offline salvatoregianpaolo

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #62 on: January 10, 2012, 10:37:17 AM »
John is right, and the only time oil is added is just a drizzle before the pizza goes into the oven.  Once it is finished baking, nothing else is done to it.  A neutral tasting oil will allow the other flavors to stand out more, as Extra Virgin Olive Oil, especially those freshly pressed, can have a very strong and overpowering taste.  I brought back quite a bit from the agriturismo we stayed at in Tuscany, and I am careful in it's application.  It isn't the best choice for every dish.  

That said, I would venture to believe any use of a soybean oil would be strictly to cut cost.  In general, when Italian cooking calls for a lighter oil, one would just reach for a non-EVO, in other words, an olive oil made from subsequent pressings.  They will be lighter in taste and not take over the dish.  

Salvatore

Offline Jordan

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #63 on: January 10, 2012, 01:37:48 PM »
Thanks John, but out of those oils I posted links of are any of them good? Or is there any suggestions you or others could give me on a milder oil that would be good for "dressing" pies? Sorry I said finish, and yes I meant it as they finish off the pie with "A mixture of olive and soybean oils before it goes in the OVEN".

Craig, I am def up for experimentation, but I have to for sure learn to experiment with smaller quantities of dough.. I have made 2 batches of dough with 1.7kg of flour consecutively and that was not the best choice in that I am only making test doughs. But I dont wanna do such small batches because it might be hard to knead in such small quantities and since I use my hands, Im not sure about the amount of difficulty this might be for me. I am also wondering of a good hand kneading technique there is out there that works similar to what a "diving arms" or fork mixer does. I watched the famous Da Michele video where they show there mixer going and its extremely slow and nothing like the videos I see of people hand kneading there dough really quickly.. I would like to learn how to affectively knead and copy the speed, finesse, and love the slow RPM mixers give to the dough. I feel like the videos I see of people punching the dough is not the most effective, especially I feel like it would heat up the dough which is another bad thing.. And since most people on this forum are getting these incredible $1000+ mixers for their dough, I am one of those lone soldiers that isnt really interested in getting one. I would love to learn the trade by hand, but not seeing anyone do it or showing me or having a reference of videos to watch its becoming an issue for me on this subject. I will keep digging till I find gold!

Bill, Thanks for all the info man! Sounds like you have a killer time making all those pies and bread! After I get the neapolitan down I would love to learn to make some delicious sour dough bread! Yum!!! And I like how you said its a 2-3 day process. Its all about not rushing and loving the time you spent doing what youre passionate about. It would be an honor for me if one day we could cook up some pies together being were both located in NJ!

Salvatore, your posts are always enlightening. Along with my notes to John, is there any oil that you would recommend for dressing a pie prior to it going in the oven? I am trying to stay away from the 100% extra virgin olive oils since theyre way too fruity and not something I would like for my margheritas. But, I also dont want to go out and buy one and have to return it because it tastes terrible on pizza or any other dish for that matter. Suggestions would be greatly appreciated!

Thank you guys! And I think I will be making a batch of dough sometime today or tomorrow with intense data recorded. I will be keeping a log of all my dough from now on just like Omid and Chau said I should. And I will be trying to figure out a way that every time I make dough I can do 2 test batches at the same time to be able to see whats best for me.

-Jordan
-Jordan

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #64 on: January 10, 2012, 02:02:43 PM »
I feel like the videos I see of people punching the dough is not the most effective, especially I feel like it would heat up the dough which is another bad thing.. And since most people on this forum are getting these incredible $1000+ mixers for their dough, I am one of those lone soldiers that isnt really interested in getting one. I would love to learn the trade by hand, but not seeing anyone do it or showing me or having a reference of videos to watch its becoming an issue for me on this subject. I will keep digging till I find gold!

Jordan - Search for "bread stretch and fold" on youtube and you will find some good videos of the technique. If you were to replace the "kneading for one minute" in the recipe I posted for you with "do one stretch and fold on each corner", you would have the exact workflow I use for most of my 18-24 hours pizza doughs. In the case of a lower hydration, like the low 60's, I "slap" and fold, which involves slapping the dough on the counter while still holding the side closest to you, and then folding the side over onto itself.

John

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #65 on: January 10, 2012, 02:11:09 PM »
And since most people on this forum are getting these incredible $1000+ mixers for their dough, I am one of those lone soldiers that isnít really interested in getting one. I would love to learn the trade by hand, but not seeing anyone do it or showing me or having a reference of videos to watch its becoming an issue for me on this subject.

Jordan, you don't need a $1000 mixer to make great dough. I use an almost 20 year old KitchenAid K5 with a C-hook. My best results have come with minimal kneading in the mixer. I add about 2/3 the flour at once and then the last 1/3 over the next 3-4 minutes trying to incorporate as much air as possible. After that, I only let it knead for 3-5 minutes or so. It has a look when it's ready that I've not been able to adequately capture in a picture. After the mixer, I let it rest a few minutes, give it a few hand kneads until it gets tight, let it rest again for 10 minutes or so then a few more kneads and itís soft and smooth as a babyís bottom.

From time-to-time, I mix by hand. I canít say I prefer one method to the other Ė hand mixing is just more work. When I mix by hand, I use this technique: http://www.gourmet.com/magazine/video/2008/03/bertinet_sweetdough  After the dough has come together and is basically homogenous, it will begin to get stiff (as opposed to the dough in the video, yours probably has no egg or oil, so it will get much stiffer much faster Ė what will be the same is how it goes from sticky and rough to soft, smooth, and no longer sticky). When it does get stiff, I let it rest for 10 minutes or so then knead again until it gets stiff Ė it maybe only 10-12 kneads. After 3-4 of these kneads and rests, it will be soft and smooth.

Craig
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Online Pete-zza

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #66 on: January 10, 2012, 03:10:15 PM »
Jordan,

In the thread I referenced earlier, at Reply 25 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,656.msg11529.html#msg11529, I mentioned how I once tried to locate oils that were used around Naples, specifically, by asking a worker at DiPaolo's about Campania oils. Two posts later, at Reply 27, Marco told me that I was given incorrect information but he proceeded to mention some oils from Cilentro and Sorrento that he thought would be good to use. My recollection is that I did a Google search but did not pursue the matter any further.

Peter


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #67 on: January 10, 2012, 03:34:51 PM »
Thanks John, but out of those oils I posted links of are any of them good? Or is there any suggestions you or others could give me on a milder oil that would be good for "dressing" pies? Sorry I said finish, and yes I meant it as they finish off the pie with "A mixture of olive and soybean oils before it goes in the OVEN".

Jordan,

Here are my favorites:

1) San Damiano Extra Virgin Olive Oil

2) a blend of Columela Hajiblanca EVOO and Colavita Frutatto EVOO in about a 50:50 ratio. The Columela is very buttery and the Colavita has a very olive-fruity flavor. I really like the combined buttery-olivey flavor. Both are widely available

CL
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #68 on: January 10, 2012, 04:13:19 PM »

Chau - Do you have a thread post that outlines your clone formula/workflow?

John

Sorry John, I did not post about the recipe or workflow.  I will dig through my many notes later.  If I see it I will forward it to you.

Chau

Offline salvatoregianpaolo

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #69 on: January 10, 2012, 04:18:10 PM »
Jordan,

Olive oil is not so one-dimensional.  Extra-virgin oil is not necessarily "fruity," in fact, it can be quite the opposite.  Tuscan oils are some of the finest, and rather than fruity they are peppery and herbal.  As I mentioned, I just brought back some recently pressed oil from the latest harvest, and it is sharp, peppery, and absolutely fantastic... when used in the correct application.

Just as with wine, I would recommend tasting as many oils as you can.  That is the only way you will learn what your preferences are.  Other than what I bring back from Italy I have grown quite fond of Frantoia.  It won't overpower the main ingredients in a dish.  For some even milder oils, there are quite a few from Sicily that are very nice.  Learn about the olives, then you will have a better understanding of how an oil will taste based on what olives make up its composition.  (Again, just as with wine!)

Grazie,
Salvatore

Offline Jordan

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #70 on: January 10, 2012, 05:44:32 PM »
Thanks John! After filling in the blanks with the stretch and fold it clears things up, I'll be using 62% hydration with my next batch so should I be doing this slap and fold you infer on higher hydration doughs? I would love to try this!!! Thanks again!

And as for the olive oil, I thank craig for posting his favorites! Is this the one you speak of Craig?

http://www.olio2go.com/Products/San-Damiano-di-Francesca-Barnato-2010__SND-005.aspx

If so, I would love to give it a try. And I am aware of its dimensions, but as I said I am very interested in cloning the da Michele pie and any bit of info sparks my interest. I would be intrigued if any of you are aware of the oil da Michele uses and I would appreciate the info.

I will be doing a set of test doughs when I recieve my trapani sicilian sea salt in the mail. Should be here soon! Here's my notes I wrote on my phone for the experiments. Maybe you guys could give me some input or methods I should alter in these trials in order for me to get better results. Here it goes!!


Current test...

2 batches 
(1000g of flour)

Ingredients 
500g flour (Caputo 00 Pizza)
310g water (Tap at room temp)
13.5g salt (sea salt)
.5g yeast (fresh yeast)

Take temperature of all ingredients and the ambient temp before, while, and after making dough. 

Dissolve yeast in a little water and mix in a pinch of flour before measuring other ingredients 

1st batch (method)
Water
dissolve salt
add 40% of flour
mix
add yeast mixture and mix
Add rest of flour and combine
Rest for 20 min
Stretch and fold for a minute
Rest for 15 min
Stretch and fold one last time

2nd batch (method)
Follow all steps except no rest ("autolyse") and use knuckles to knead and trap air (ex. Pasquale video)

Both batches bulk ferment for 20-24 hours at 71-72deg (Da Michele Temp in chambers)

Makes 3 balls each batch. 250g each.

Balled ferment 4-16 hours 

Test for both batches. Bake at...
1st ball - 4 hours
2nd ball - 8-10 hours
3rd ball - 16-24 hours

Record results and picturs.


So... What do you guys think?!

Thanks!
-Jordan

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #71 on: January 10, 2012, 05:52:31 PM »
And as for the olive oil, I thank craig for posting his favorites! Is this the one you speak of Craig?

http://www.olio2go.com/Products/San-Damiano-di-Francesca-Barnato-2010__SND-005.aspx

Yes, that is what I use on my Margherita.

CL
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline salvatoregianpaolo

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #72 on: January 10, 2012, 07:07:36 PM »
That oil has such great color!  I'm tempted to give it a try...

Sempre imparando,
Salvatore

Offline dellavecchia

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #73 on: January 10, 2012, 07:12:04 PM »
Other than what I bring back from Italy I have grown quite fond of Frantoia.

Frantoia is my favorite, Salvatore. I buy them 6 at a time to save on shipping:

http://www.pennmac.com/items/3155//frantoia-barbera-unfiltered-olive-oil

John

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: My Neapolitan Progress
« Reply #74 on: January 10, 2012, 07:38:31 PM »
Frantoia is my favorite, Salvatore. I buy them 6 at a time to save on shipping:

http://www.pennmac.com/items/3155//frantoia-barbera-unfiltered-olive-oil

John

I can get Frantoia locally, and it is also excellent - not quite as good as the San Daminao (IMHO) - but excellent nonetheless.

CL
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage


 

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