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Offline grayman

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My first experiment of dough
« on: January 11, 2012, 04:31:07 AM »
After lurking,reading and learning in the forum almost one month from the register,I eventually step out my first step and try my first dough ball yesterday.Here, I'd like to thanks the Moderator,Peter since we could see him everywhere and he offer many many useful information over the forum for the people especially new guys.
As a totally newie in baking before,I do not know any tools,any ingerdient,any procedure,almost none about dough.And Pizza is not a main food in China here,for me,I even do not know which could be call as a good pizza(we know pizza almost all from the international chain pizza restaurants,like pizza-hut or papa-johns).so I want to know and want to try what pizza is.if possible,I'd like to try a pizzeria since we could see pizza would be more and more popular here and even a good pizza.

I try the dough in my home,one 12 inch dough ball:
1)tools: electric hand mixer,big stainless bowl, digital scale and thermometer,measuring spoons,etc.
2)receipe:
Flour (100%):    201.75 g
Water (59%):    119.03 g
IDY (0.35%):    0.71 g
Salt (1.75%):    3.53 g
Oil (1%):    2.02 g
Total (162.1%):   327.04 g     TF = 0.102 (2% bowl residue)
Room Temperature:    64F
Water Temperature:    62F(purified water without cooling)
Flour Temperature:    64F(use the same as the room temperature)
3)Procedure: follow the steps: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg36489.html#msg36489

before my experiment,I have make some notes about my doubts:
1,Temperature,if use 20 as the fiction factor,the dough temperature should be (64+62+64+20)/3=70F. (as PMQ Tom's term: http://www.pmq.com/mag/2003spring/tom_lehmann.shtml)
  I do nor if it is good,while Tom suggest the desired temp of finished dough ball should be 80-85F,and peter's number are around 65F(http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg37191.html#msg37191) and between 70-80F(http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,576.msg36173.html#msg36173)
2,Percentage of water,as reading some posts of peter try many experiments in high rate about 65% or higher,I think I should try lower first.
3,Yeast,since it getting cooler,I use a little more IDY at 0.35%,I hope the dough could get a fermentation windows of 6 days or more.Addtionally,I will try ADY without actived(when I get).
4,Oil,I have no idea about it.In Peter's clone papa-johns recipe,he use as high as 7.3%,and in Tom's receipe many people use at 3%,but in one of member November's post:http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg40104.html#msg40104, he suggest the ideal percentage of oil to add to the flour is 1.58% under these precepts,after all,I like to try lower level at 1% as the basic Lehmann dough formulation.

after making the dough ball,below are some data:
1,the finished dough ball weigh: 315g, that mean actual bowl residue:(327.04-315)/327.04=3.7%,more than my estimation.
2,the temperature of the dough ball: 77F, (I suppose:70F,mean more fiction factor)
3,total time:30 minutes, (a little long,while I make it first time,I think I would shorten it in 20 minuts next.)
4,after half of the flour were added into the bowl,the dough is not easy to mix,I changed the whisk to the hook.and the dough was getting hard to hadle.
5,after kneading,the dough was in quite good condition as: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,576.msg28694.html#msg28694
6,tha dough ball's diameter is about 9cm.

the dough ball was put in the refrigerator to cool ferment,and I decide to use it at this weekend.
any comment to my first would be apperciated.

Gray


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #1 on: January 11, 2012, 12:29:06 PM »
All is looking well,Gray. For your first couple of trials though I would suggest you try to stick closely to the recipe.This will provide you the experience of American pizza,other than chain-restaurants,that you mentioned you would like to enjoy.With that platform established for yourself it should make it easier for you to then know what direction you'd like to tweak or modify the recipe more to your tastes.We are all about experimentation here so don't worry,there'll be plenty of time for that!  ;D

It appears you have something close to a New York Pizza style of dough.I would be interested in knowing what your thoughts/plans are towards your baking procedure.Can we get a picture of the oven you use there in China?

Good luck with your experiment ,Gray.It sounds like you have done some good homework already and I look forward to seeing your results.......any questions,just ask!
Oh, one last thing.I am curious as to why you are looking for a 6 day fermentation window...just wondering.Thanks!

Bob


p.s. Welcome to the forum!
« Last Edit: January 11, 2012, 02:31:59 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #2 on: January 11, 2012, 01:50:20 PM »
Gray,

I agree with Bob that it looks like you did your homework. In some respects, I think you did it too well. Many of the issues you raise will become more important when and if you decide to sell pizza commercially rather than just to make pizza for yourself in a home environment. Here are my comments and observations.

1. I wouldn't worry too much about friction factor. In my early experiments, when I was in the learning stage, I did a lot of friction factor experiments with different types of dough mixers, including stand mixer, food processor and bread maker and even including hand kneading. I did not do similar calculations for the dough making method you used with an electric hand mixer. Friction factors are much more useful in a commercial environment where a given dough is made over and over again in the same amounts and in the same mixers with few changes. In a home environment, changing dough recipes, dough batch sizes, dough mixing equipment and a lot of other factors that are fairly routine can change the value of the friction factor. So, I wouldn't worry about friction factor at this point.

2. In a home environment, I often suggest using a water temperature that will achieve a finished dough temperature of around 75-80 degrees F. Tom Lehmann very frequently mentions a finished dough temperature of 80-85 degrees F. The reason for the difference is that a home refrigerator runs several degrees warmer than a commercial cooler. Tom speaks in the context of a commercial operation. I speak in the context of a home environment.There have been times where I used water temperatures that were low enough to produce a finished dough temperature lower than those mentioned above but I was doing so because I wanted the dough to ferment for much longer periods than normal doughs. In some cases, the window of usability I was trying to achieve was measured in weeks, not days. To get that extension of fermentation, the normal choices are to use small amounts of yeast and cold temperatures. More than once, I have gone below finished dough temperatures in the range of 75-80 degrees, in some cases much lower. On the matter of finished dough temperatures, you might find it useful to read the recent thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14376.msg143632.html#msg143632.

3. I agree with you that it is perhaps a good idea to use a lower hydration for now rather than a higher hydration. But, utimately, what hydration value you use will be dictated by the types of flours you can get in China and your skills in working with doughs of different hydrations. In the U.S., we have so many choices of flours that we can use hydration values that can cover a very wide range. I also agree that using 1% oil makes sense, especially for a NY style dough formulation such as you posted, although with experience you may decide that using up to 3% might be better. You correctly noted the high oil quantities in the Papa John's clones that I made but that is typical for American style pizzas. For a NY style dough recipe, you do not want to use as much oil as used for the American style pizzas. You quoted member November on a value of oil to use but that was with respect to a particular type of flour to use with a specific protein content. However, whether you use 1% oil or 1.58% oil is not likely to produce a noticeable difference.

4. Even though you increased the amount of yeast because of the cooler temperature where you are, you may find that 0.35% IDY is too much for a six day or longer fermentation period. However, since you have already made your test dough, you should observe the behavior of the dough over the next several days. If the dough becomes quite gassy with a lot of fermentation bubbles before the expiration of the six-day window, you will perhaps want to use the dough then to make pizza. If you tell me what the prevailing temperatures are where you are in China, I might be able to offer more comment.

5. Your total dough preparation time of 30 minutes, while on the long side, is unlikely to be detrimental although it may shorten the total fermentation time somewhat. With experience, you will most likely shorten the total dough preparation time.

Overall, I would say that you did a good job with your research and identifying many of the principles that are involved in making pizza dough. I commend you for that and wish you good luck.

Peter

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #3 on: January 11, 2012, 09:59:50 PM »
Thanks Bob and Peter,your commendation and comments make me more energetic to go ahead,to such a forum,thanks again!
In my thought,when I know more and try more to figure out a good pizza,I decide to offer in my drinks shop as the main food to let more people know.

Bob,
you know,I just start to try with the most simple tools and equipments at home.Regarding the baking,I just use my simple and common electric oven with maxmum temperature at 480F,could you give me the procedure?I just search for this as the next step.In commercial,I think I could use as Tom's suggestion:the gas fired, air impingement oven + the Hearth Bake Disk (http://thinktank.pmq.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=9269&p=63422#p63466)
And about the fermentation window at 6 days or more,actually,there are not any special thought about it,but refer Peter's post: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6758.msg58196.html#msg58196,saying that PJ "delivered fresh to the stores by truck twice a week. " and if I would produce the dough in bulk to supply in one week one time? for example,when I make the doughs in Saturday,and I could use them in Monday,Tuesday,even Friday.but I do not know if it could work?or mixing dough twice one week? 

Peter,
thanks for you information,I think I could learn more from each of your posts.
For the flour,I do not know which protein percentage of my bread flour(maybe between 11.5%-12.5%),name "Golden Statue" Brand of Lam Soon Group,May you suggest how could I do a simple test of the flour hydration?and why I try the hydration is follow your post: Professionals usually use around 56%-59% hydration for similar doughs. (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8576.msg74321.html#msg74321)

Oil,before your comment,I thought the NY style is the same as American style,like the Papa John's.I think I will try 3% next,but I do not see any information talking about the function in the dough of oil except November's post,any more?

Yeast,I used lesaffre IDY,since the dosage is 0.71g that is too small for me to scale,I put one tiny spoon of 1ml, maybe it is 0.6-0.7g I guess but not more.and since I use my spare refrigerator,so it is seldom opening and closing the door while cooling the dough,it is about 39F,when I check the ball last night after one whole day fermented,it rise a little about 10cm diameter as the picture below. However,I will keep in mind of your notice to use the dough.

Regarding how to use the dough ball to make pizza,I know nothing too,that would be another first try I think.and I have search the supermarket yesterday,but no Classico or 6-in-1s Tomato Sauces as mention in the forum,only some other brands from Italy,I decide to try the sauce with fresh tomato as: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,12820.0.html

Anyway,I will try.

Gray

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #4 on: January 12, 2012, 01:01:16 PM »
Gray,

OK,now I have a little clearer understanding of what you are trying to do.I wasn't quite sure what you meant in saying "try pizzeria".If you are going to be restricted to having only one day for dough making then I would think that for consistency sake you'll need to perhaps consider some sort of freezing and thawing schedule.I'm sure Peter will know best on this matter if it infact becomes the way you need to manage your dough for retail.

I'd be happy to give you some help on the bake.A pic of your oven would be of benefit,Gray. Do you have a pizza baking stone and/or pizza screen? I will wait for your reply

Bob

p.s. It would be fun and interesting if you would please post a picture of your "drinks shop" there in China.Thanks!
« Last Edit: January 12, 2012, 04:01:34 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #5 on: January 12, 2012, 07:34:46 PM »
Peter,
thanks for you information,I think I could learn more from each of your posts.
For the flour,I do not know which protein percentage of my bread flour(maybe between 11.5%-12.5%),name "Golden Statue" Brand of Lam Soon Group,May you suggest how could I do a simple test of the flour hydration?and why I try the hydration is follow your post: Professionals usually use around 56%-59% hydration for similar doughs. (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,8576.msg74321.html#msg74321)

Oil,before your comment,I thought the NY style is the same as American style,like the Papa John's.I think I will try 3% next,but I do not see any information talking about the function in the dough of oil except November's post,any more?

Yeast,I used lesaffre IDY,since the dosage is 0.71g that is too small for me to scale,I put one tiny spoon of 1ml, maybe it is 0.6-0.7g I guess but not more.



Gray,

The company that makes your flour might be able to tell you the hydration to use. But, typically, for a flour with a protein content of 11.5-12.5%, you would use a hydration of around 60-62%.

If you used 0.71 grams of IDY, in the U.S. that would be around 3/16 teaspoon, or 1 1/2 times a 1/8 teaspoon measuring spoon. I believe that one U.S. teaspoon is equivalent to about metric 5 ml. So, if my math is right, that would be about 1 ml, which is what you said you used.

If you want to read more on the purpose and function of oil in pizza doughs, see Reply 1 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7915.msg67933.html#msg67933.

Peter

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #6 on: January 13, 2012, 01:12:57 AM »
Peter,

there is a question I have forgotten about your New KitchenAid dough making method and with electric hand mixer.
in http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg33252.html#msg33252, your add the salt later while most of the flour and yeast have been incorporated into the dough,but in your later post of reply #30 at the same thread: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg36489.html#msg36489, you stir the salt in the water at the beginning to completely dissolve.
I wonder what is the different while the salt added before the yeast or later or the same time as Member Norma427 do(at reply #196):
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH9omJ0Le28" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH9omJ0Le28</a>
.

Meanwhile,I know you have mentioned about Tom's procedure:"Add salt and sugar (if used) to the water. Do not stir in." ( http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7953.msg68396.html#msg68396),if that is different from home and commercial environment?

Gray

Offline norma427

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #7 on: January 13, 2012, 07:38:59 AM »
Gray,

I donít have the experience Peter does with dough, but I have tried mixing dough at home and at market many different ways, from hand mixing, to a hand held electric mixer, to my Kitchen Aid mixer, and also my Hobart mixer at market.

Just to explain a few things, salt and yeast can be added at the same time to the flour, as long as the yeast doesnít stay in contact with the salt for a long while.  Even at home I do add salt on one side of the weighed out flour and yeast on the other side of the flour, then dump the whole mixture into the water.  Sugar also can be added to the water and dissolved or can be added to the flour.  I have added sugar in both ways in my commercial setting and at home.  

If you have any other questions I know Peter knows more than I do, but I am also willing to help with your questions.

Norma
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Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #8 on: January 13, 2012, 10:08:21 AM »
Norma,

Thanks for your kind reply and attention,I can see you in many other threads as another enthusiast and professionalfor me in the forum.
I know you are running a pizza shop?That must be many aspect I should learn from you in the future.
Last night I just refer your posts in the thread about the sauce: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17013.0.html
I am searching more about the sauce and please keep on update it. or any tips for us to share the Novemberís #2 and Steve's mixing well during the tests?

Gray

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #9 on: January 13, 2012, 11:05:10 AM »
Bob,

After searching,I think I have known what the baking stone and/or pizza screen are,since we never use such tools and even I do not see baking stone either.
And below is my home electric oven and looking forward for your instructions.

Peter,

I check my first dough after 3 days cool fermentation,it looks quite well except getting more flat as the picture.
Do you think I could divide it into two dough in 9''.I decide to use one during the weekend and continue the another in the refrigerator.

Gray


Offline norma427

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #10 on: January 13, 2012, 12:57:22 PM »
Norma,

Thanks for your kind reply and attention,I can see you in many other threads as another enthusiast and professionalfor me in the forum.
I know you are running a pizza shop?That must be many aspect I should learn from you in the future.
Last night I just refer your posts in the thread about the sauce: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,17013.0.html
I am searching more about the sauce and please keep on update it. or any tips for us to share the Novemberís #2 and Steve's mixing well during the tests?

Gray


Gray,

I donít know what kind of tomato sauces you have available where you live.  Many different kinds of tomatoes sauces for pizza can be made with good crushed tomatoes (or other tomato sauces) and added herbs or spices.  I have tried many kinds of sauces for home use, including Lesís sauce. http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,11539.0.html  In reply 2 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9744.msg85554.html#msg85554 I told how I compared Stanislaus products with Great Value tomato products to make a pizza sauce.  I donít use that method anymore, but it was good.  This is basically the pizza sauce I use for my pizza at market now at Reply 15 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,12700.msg129490.html#msg129490  I am only playing around with the Classico products right now to see where that will take me.  Steve (Ev) uses the sauce recipe you had linked to.  It is also a very good sauce recipe.  You will have to determine what kind of tastes you like in a pizza sauce.  Different members like different tastes in a pizza sauce.

I am only a part-time professional pizza maker.  Market is only open one day a week.  My pizza market stand is very small.  It is only 8íx13'.

Norma


« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 01:00:13 PM by norma427 »
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #11 on: January 13, 2012, 01:45:08 PM »
Gray

Thank you for the pic of your oven.I am going to assume that the steel looking rod I see at the lower front of the oven is the heating element. Are there more of these leading towards the back under the black pan? Also,on the lower right hand wall is that a grate/cover for a fan? A lil difficult to tell what you have there with that black pan blocking the view.Are there heating elements on the ceiling also and if so can you control upper/lower elements independently.

Bob
« Last Edit: January 13, 2012, 01:49:36 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #12 on: January 13, 2012, 03:50:06 PM »
there is a question I have forgotten about your New KitchenAid dough making method and with electric hand mixer.
in http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg33252.html#msg33252, your add the salt later while most of the flour and yeast have been incorporated into the dough,but in your later post of reply #30 at the same thread: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg36489.html#msg36489, you stir the salt in the water at the beginning to completely dissolve.
I wonder what is the different while the salt added before the yeast or later or the same time as Member Norma427 do(at reply #196): http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cH9omJ0Le28.

Meanwhile,I know you have mentioned about Tom's procedure:"Add salt and sugar (if used) to the water. Do not stir in." ( http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7953.msg68396.html#msg68396),if that is different from home and commercial environment?


Gray,

The dough that I described at Reply 1 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg33252.html#msg33252 and also in the opening post in the same thread was an experimental dough that used a lot of different techniques that, while not new individually, were combined in a way that I had not seen before. But one of the things I was trying to achieve was to get autolyse-like benefits without actually using an autolyse rest period, specifically, by using a lot of small inherent rest period instead of a single long one, yet keeping the entire dough preparation time under 12 minutes. Since salt is not combined with the flour and water in a classic Calvel autolyse, I left it out at the beginning and added it toward the end. For the method using the hand mixer, I dissolved the salt in the water at the beginning because I wanted to be sure that the salt was fully dissolved before finishing kneading the dough by hand, which is not as efficient at incorporating the salt as my home stand mixer at a late stage (and would take a lot longer).

Norma's method of adding the salt and yeast on top of the flour is a method used by many pizza operators. One of the advantages of that approach is that the workers who make the dough can actually see the salt and yeast and be unlikely to forget them. Also, Norma uses a commercial mixer that is better at incorporating ingredients than my humble home stand mixer. The method that Tom describes for handling the different ingredients as outlined at Reply 3 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7953.msg68396.html#msg68396 is calculated to keep the yeast away from the salt and sugar as much as possible. Dissolving the salt and sugar in the water first and adding the yeast after the flour achieves this objective. Tom does not want the salt and sugar to harm the yeast in any way by leaching fluids out of the yeast cells by osmotic pressure and inhibiting yeast performance. Tom's advice is usually quite conservative. He would rather prevent problems from occurring than having to spend a lot of his time diagnosing the problems that arise from poor or uninformed practices and then explaining what went wrong and how to fix the problem or prevent it the next time. I feel the same way.

As far as your dough is concerned, it is quite normal for it to spread. Normally, I would do the division of a dough into two pieces right after the dough has been made. However, since in your case the division was an afterthought, you should be able to divide the dough into two pieces and return one of them to the refrigerator. However, you should do the division and reshaping gently and not do any aggressive kneading of the dough at this point. As for the size of pizza, in order to achieve the same finished crust thickness as the larger piece of dough, you want to use a radius that is two times the square root of (327.04/28.35/2)/(3.14159 x 0.102). If my math is right, the radius you want to use is about 8.5".

Peter


Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2012, 10:10:42 AM »
It is a terrible experiment...
After 4 days fermentation,when I took out the ball from the refrigerator,it look quite well and more flat but not rise much.I insert my figure in the dough,the hole do not replace any more.so I use it.
I open the ball,it is easy to extent and with some bubble.when I stretch it little more,the center of the pie is getting more thin but the rim not.and the pie punch by keep on opening.When I lift the dough under the light to check the texture,you could see it is not uniform and easy to break in the second picture.
I do not know why my dough do not get more elasticity and resiliency.Even I could say nothing it could be toss like PJ's dough...
If there are problems of my mixing and kneading or the flour is not enough protein content?
I have no idea,it is frustrated...any one could give more help about it?

After I bake 1/4 of the ball into a 6" pizza at 480F about 8 minutes,the crumb & crust is tough to chew,nothing to mention about flavor...
sigh...how could I get more improvement?

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2012, 11:10:37 AM »
I review the procedure of Peter's describe again. (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,3985.msg36489.html#msg36489)
if I could not knead the dough too much(about 15 minutes),while Peter suggest "The total knead time will be about 4 minutes for the batch size involved".
I think the problem is that there is no uniform thickness and complete smooth in my dough. and it was originated by not fully hydrating the flour,if I could say that?

P.S. Peter,do you have any video I could see and follow your procedure well with the electric hand mixer?Thanks!
« Last Edit: January 14, 2012, 11:12:27 AM by grayman »

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #15 on: January 14, 2012, 10:38:16 PM »

This morning when I get up and one thing make me surprise,the dough I throw out last night was rise much more,more that double as before.and I try to stretch it,it is more elstic.
So I wonder if the dough do not ferment enough when I use it after 4 days?without any problem with my ingredients and procedure?

Gray

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #16 on: January 14, 2012, 10:45:43 PM »
Gray

Thank you for the pic of your oven.I am going to assume that the steel looking rod I see at the lower front of the oven is the heating element. Are there more of these leading towards the back under the black pan? Also,on the lower right hand wall is that a grate/cover for a fan? A lil difficult to tell what you have there with that black pan blocking the view.Are there heating elements on the ceiling also and if so can you control upper/lower elements independently.

Bob

Yes,Bob,you are careful, both the bottom and ceiling have two heating rods and with a fan in the right hand wall.I could set the models of only top heat,only down heat or both top and down and with the fan.
I think my home electric oven is quite common.

Gray

Offline grayman

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #17 on: January 15, 2012, 12:18:03 AM »
after the first experiment,I notes two other questions except the procedure:
1)when the dough could be start to use while put in the refrigerator? and until to when it should be thrown away?what are the signals?
2)when the dough was taken out from the refrigerator,how long it could stay in home environment?either in winter or summer?

Gray

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #18 on: January 15, 2012, 12:20:34 PM »
Gray,

Do you own or have access to a IF thermometer for which you could take some one time measurements ? Is the oven at it's hottest when both upper and lower elements are on at the same time and can they be ran together without the fan ? Are you going to procure a stone or,hopefully, at least a baking screen ?

Bob
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: My first experiment of dough
« Reply #19 on: January 15, 2012, 03:37:39 PM »
Gray,

I have no idea as to what happened to your dough. I'd like to suggest that you repeat the experiment but decide what you want to do up front and not to make changes later. For example, if you want to make two dough balls, make the dough batch for two dough balls and divide them up front before placing the dough balls in the refrigerator. If you want to make four dough balls to make even smaller pizzas, do the division up front again before placing the dough balls in the refrigerator. Looking at the recipe you used, I do not see anything out of order. However, it could be that your flour does not have a sufficient protein content and, as a result, you are not getting sufficient gluten formation.

The length of time that the dough balls can be kept in the refrigerator before using will depend primarily on the amount of yeast and the temperatures involved, including the water temperature used, the finished dough temperature, the duration of any room temperature fermentation before refrigerating, and the temperature of your refrigerator. Under normal circumstances, a dough with 0.35% IDY should be ready to use in about 2 days and last maybe another day or two beyond that. If you use it too soon, there might not be sufficient fermentation and the dough might not rise enough and your finished crust might not be particularly tasty. At that point, the dough might also be on the stiff and elastic side.

Once the dough is taken out of the refrigerator to temper (warm up), the time it takes for the dough to be ready to use to make a skin will depend on the room temperature. In the summer, with a warm kitchen, it might take an hour or so. It will depend on how hot it is. In the winter, it might take 1 1/2-2 hours, again depending on how cold it is. Technically, you should be able to use the dough when its temperature reaches about 55-57 degrees F, but I have found that I get better results when the dough is warmer, maybe around 65 degrees F (assuming that room temperature is that high).

I don't recall if I referred you to the thread starting at Reply 8 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,2223.msg19563/topicseen.html#msg19563. If not, you might want to look at that thread, including a video showing how to open dough balls.

Peter


 

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