Author Topic: Pepperoni Brands --  (Read 59028 times)

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Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #25 on: November 02, 2005, 01:43:30 AM »
I'm wondering if "natural casings" and/or the thickness sliced have anything to do with cupping pepperoni?

I'm asumming that "cupping pepperoni" is when the pepperoni takes on a bowl shape after baking.

My typical brands curl somewhat at higher temps (not a bowl shape) and develops a char that is pleasant, not like burnt bacon.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.


Offline Steve

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #26 on: November 02, 2005, 09:59:29 AM »
Just curious, has anyone compared Swiss American pepperoni with Ezzo pepperoni?

Offline 007bond-jb

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #27 on: November 02, 2005, 11:37:09 AM »
I now know I'll never try Sara Lee brand pepperoni again. After baking I tasted kinda like a mix of cheap bologna & salami.  ??? The best tasting thats avalible in my area is Boars Head. Also I thought the natrual casing caused the curl or cupping

Offline abatardi

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #28 on: November 02, 2005, 12:27:32 PM »
Hey Everyone.

My name is Frank Giovanni.  I am the sales manager for Swiss American Sausage Co.  www.sasausage.com

Out of good faith..... If you are a member of this group and just a plain 'ol pepperoni lover, I can get you a sample if you can help with the overnight shipping.  Pepperoni is on me...  if you pay shipping.  limited quantity of course.

Let me know if I can help.  AND!!!!  Check out my personal website:  www.deltabluesfestival.net/pizza_oven.htm

Thanks.

Ciao.

Frankie G




Frankie - Awesome!  That pepperoni is good stuff.  I first had it with Giotto at the mountain view Amici's.  I brought my girlfriend there later and she loved it as well.  I might have to take you up on that free sample offer.  :-)

Do you guys distribute to any stores at all?  I haven't seen it anywhere, but maybe I'm just not looking hard enough.

Also that is a pretty nice oven you have!  I'm jealous.  :-)

- Aaron
Make me a bicycle CLOWN!

Offline giotto

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #29 on: November 02, 2005, 12:55:26 PM »
Swiss American has different ones for the pros, this is the Classic.  Well aware of that particular cash & carry... I checked it out before... didn't see a resemblence. 

Natural casing is important to the cup (bowl) shape... If that's all you want, it's easy to get.  But you will not get the unique spicy taste of the Swiss American Classic or the texture. 

It's made for commerical heated ovens.  With a fire-breathing refractory brick oven, I enjoyed a slight char of the Swiss American Classic pepperoni... not to be confused with anything else.

It all depends on how serious you are about your toppings. This to me was a dead-on opportunity.

Enjoy Abatardi! 
« Last Edit: November 02, 2005, 01:03:06 PM by giotto »

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #30 on: November 02, 2005, 12:58:38 PM »
If the Saralee brand you purchased is anything like the general grocery version of Gallo, Yes, its pretty gross. It just tastes like extremely poor quality meat that someone dumped tons of spices into to try to cover it up.

About 20 years ago, I was able to get Gallo "premium" at Costco, they stopped carrying it, so I grabbed the general grocery version! BIG mistake! I hadn't seen the premium version since, until a month ago, at United Grocers Cash& Cary.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #31 on: November 02, 2005, 07:07:54 PM »
Giotto,
I just saw the pic you posted from Amici's. The pepperoni, damn the whole pie looks great!

After visiting Swiss-American website I am left to assume that the Classico is only supplied in whole-link. (Maybe Frankie G. can let us know one this one.) 

If this is the case, I would be very interested in knowing about how thin they're slicing the pepperoni.

 Anybody have any guesstimates?
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Frankie G

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #32 on: November 03, 2005, 11:14:20 AM »
Whew....  The questions come so fast.

Cool.

Ok....  Our Classic Style Pepperoni is made in the classic way.  We use an edible casing that represents a natural casing.

When the casing is left on the pepperoni, and is exposed to the oven's heat, the casing is the first thing that shrinks.  This brings the sides of the pepperoni up (or down in some cases) and that is where the "cupping" comes from.

Oddly enough, the majority of the professional pizza world thinks that their customers do not like pepperoni to cup.  So we make a product in an artificial casing.  When the pepperoni is dry, we remove the artificial casing and the pepperoni is sliced.  Without the casing, it has less o a chance to cup.  (capisco?)

Unfortunately, Swiss American only sells to the pizza trade currently.  That's why I offered samples if people pay for shipping.  I feel that it's unfair if I talk about it and not let one taste it.

Also.....  I will be posting David's Oven to my website.  If you have a woodfired oven ......   send me a pic.... and I'll get it up.

Have a great day and thanks for all the nice comments and all the interests.

Offline giotto

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #33 on: November 03, 2005, 01:34:35 PM »
Frankie G:

Well, the good news is that I noticed Amici's was #1 independent pizza operator the last time I checked... And as Lydia and Abatardi pointed out, it's a beautiful thing how they let those little Swiss American guys cup... As Emeril would say, time to take it up a notch... After all, Pepperoni is still the #1 topping in America.

So "just" 3 "more" questions:

- Is the Gallo, which you referred to earlier, a replica of your Classic with casing and the premium gallo/galileo as referred to by Lydia earlier?

- When you send the Classic sliced, does it include the edible casing so it will cup?

- Steve Z, the Admin for this site, was wondering what are the differences with Ezzo pepperoni? He explains what 3 phase is with ovens, and is now looking for your professional insight on Ezzo differences. 

In the end, even the consumer will bring their preferences to the pizza industry! Thanks for keeping this thread happening.


Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #34 on: November 03, 2005, 02:14:07 PM »
If you enjoy making sausage, pepperoni is not very difficult to make, especially a semi-dry cured and smoked pepperoni. I think traditional pepperoni is not smoked, but I really like the result from lightly smoking the pepperoni after it has cured for 1 - 2 months. I usually use 50% pork and 50% beef for the best flavor and texture for pizzas.

Bill/SFNM

Offline Frankie G

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #35 on: November 03, 2005, 02:58:23 PM »
Answers to questions:


- Is the Gallo, which you referred to earlier, a replica of your Classic with casing and the premium gallo/galileo as referred to by Lydia earlier?

No.  I would rather not comment on a competitors product...  I have personal opinions but I do not want to be unprofessional.

- When you send the Classic sliced, does it include the edible casing so it will cup?

Yep.  The casing is left on when it is sliced.... so the pepperoni will cup.

- Steve Z, the Admin for this site, was wondering what are the differences with Ezzo pepperoni? He explains what 3 phase is with ovens, and is now looking for your professional insight on Ezzo differences.

I have never heard of Ezzo Pepperoni...  Sorry.


And as far as making pepperoni.. go ahead but be careful when you include BEEF.  Remember... there is such a thing as ecoli.  Also.. if you like smoke... try a little liquid smoke and use on a "carrier" so it can be dispersed throughout the formula.  Put the liquid smoke in with the salt.  Mix.  then as the salt is evenly mixed in your formula... you will have better coverage with the smoke throughout. 

Just a thought.


Frankie G
« Last Edit: November 03, 2005, 03:02:31 PM by Frankie G »

Offline giotto

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #36 on: November 03, 2005, 03:41:50 PM »
Frankie:

Quote
Galileo, Gallo (same product)  Produced in San Leandro for California

I thought your quote above was suggesting that it was the same product as yours... Now I realize that you were saying that Galileo and Gallo were one in the same. Thanks for clarifying.

Regarding curing, I used to cure jerky... The sanitizing is partly what drew me away from it.  It's not the process that's difficult.  As with most foods at home, you have to work at it to get it right, including texture and taste, and it's a multi-day process.  Sure I got it down pat... after a year.  I remember seeing pizza stated as easy... Here I am again.
« Last Edit: November 03, 2005, 03:58:24 PM by giotto »

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #37 on: November 03, 2005, 04:13:43 PM »
I was under the assumption that pepperoni couldn't be sliced without the casing. Or is this only true of pepperoni that is made in the edible natural type casings?? But I'm truely ingnorant on this.

I need to take Pepperoni 101 or something  ???

While researching products I am also defining my own and my family's preferences: taste, texture; all beef or beef-pork blend, natural casing etc. I am also looking for a steady and convenient source.

The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Frankie G

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #38 on: November 03, 2005, 04:15:22 PM »
to the best of my knowledge:

Sara Lee owns:

     Gallo, Galileo, Capri, Gomez, Deli D' Italia and a few others.

If I am incorrect, welcome correction. Just trying to be helpful.

Frankie G

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #39 on: November 03, 2005, 05:02:31 PM »

And as far as making pepperoni.. go ahead but be careful when you include BEEF.  Remember... there is such a thing as ecoli.  Also.. if you like smoke... try a little liquid smoke and use on a "carrier" so it can be dispersed throughout the formula.  Put the liquid smoke in with the salt.  Mix.  then as the salt is evenly mixed in your formula... you will have better coverage with the smoke throughout. 


I'm not too worried about food-born illness. I use nitrite/nitrates, smoke to an internal temp of ~145F and bake the pie in a 800F+ oven. So far, so good  :).

Use liquid smoke? :o Never! Detest the stuff. Why go to the all the trouble to grind, stuff, and cure the pepperoni and then use liquid smoke? I guess it's fine for commercial use to a market that can't tell the difference.

Bill/SFNM

Offline giotto

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #40 on: November 03, 2005, 06:53:49 PM »
C. Botulinum toxin is described as a soil-borne, mesophilic, spore-forming, anaerobic bacterium.  It is carried into the kitchen via raw foods, as well as our hands, clothing, among other places.  It produces spores, that are extremely durable.  While the bacterium is destroyed 212F, the spores are not destroyed so easily.  They require 240F for a sustained length of time.  Then of course there is the posion that is brought about by the spores.  The toxin is so strong that 1 tsp of the pure substance could kill 100s of thousands of people. Fortunately, the cases have dropped due to increased information, procedures, and decreased home usage since the 40's.

While nitrates do help prevent the creation of C. botulinum toxin, they can also mask food spoilage. Nitrates are converted into nitrites in our body by metabolism, either when we eat them or by their interaction with the protein of raw meat cured. The nitrites in turn help to make nitrosamines... and that has caused other controversy. So it's use is limited, and so is it's protection.

So now let's look at the USDA.  A USDA jerky company would only bring out minimal beef at any point in time.  If one fly or insect was seen, just one... everything, and I mean everything, had to be thrown out that was out on the floor, and that one insect had to be found, shown, and then removed, and everything scrubbed down before business could be re-introduced.  They too used nitrates, unlike me, and mine was approved for 12 months by the USDA.  You could have eaten off the floor... everything was being scrubbed down anyways with chlorine bleach type substance. 

Even my local state-approved Safeway store is constantly changing formulas for scrub down, because the bacteria builds up an immunity.  In our hospitals, we have MSRA issues due to increased immunity and the time will likely come where medicines will be superceeded because of it. 

800F for a pie is a great thing.  But I like to eat cured meats at room temp too and would not recommend disregard for sanitation.  Chlorine bleach wipes of all surfaces should always be used, as well as proper handling procedures before and after the moistness is reduced (unfortunately, bacteria can thrive even with lack of oxygen when combined with moistness).

Despite handling even by professionals, I don't always like the preservation ingredients.  I'll never forget Tyler Florence's expression when he learned that tomatoes were smoked as a measure to preserve them at an Italian Villa... I knew exactly what he was thinking. 
« Last Edit: November 03, 2005, 07:55:42 PM by giotto »

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #41 on: November 03, 2005, 07:59:55 PM »
Giotto:

I'm glad you addressed this issue. This is the main reason why I never attempted to make pepperoni at home.


The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.


Offline Steve

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #42 on: November 03, 2005, 08:21:31 PM »
I just ordered a sample package from Frankie. Once my package arrives, I will be able to compare the Swiss American pepperoni with Ezzo pepperoni. Ezzo is some of the best that I've ever tasted... it will be interesting to taste the two side-by-side.  :)

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #43 on: November 03, 2005, 08:47:40 PM »
Steve

I look forward to your comments, I have not had the chance to try Ezzo's.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #44 on: November 03, 2005, 09:30:07 PM »
I dusted off my Hormel Sausage booklet. I dont know the age of my booklet. Covers do not have a copyright or a printing date. But its been in my possession for too many years to mention  :o

"Leoni pepperoni has the same spicy flavor and top-quality ingredients as our traditional double-linked Rosa Pepperoni, but is stuffed into a wider diameter (approx. 2 1/2") artificial casing" Intended for sandwich- deli.

Anybody seen it, heard of it, or used it???

I'm wondering if Leoni might have been renamed Rosa Grande???

« Last Edit: November 03, 2005, 10:24:44 PM by Lydia »
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline scott r

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #45 on: November 03, 2005, 10:19:33 PM »
I have not seen the Leoni, but if it is really the same as the Rosa I can comment on the flavor.  I use the Hormel Rosa all the time.  Ezzo has no distribution here in the Boston area.  Rosa is the next best thing that I know of around here, and it is nice not to have to deal with shipping.  The taste is very close to Ezzo with just a little less of a pork flavor.  You can get that great cup and char easily.  This is the pepperoni that is used at Lombardi's in NYC.

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #46 on: November 03, 2005, 10:54:06 PM »
Thanks Scott!

I added an afterthought to my previous post....

Leoni possibly renamed Rosa Grande??
The book has no mention of Grande. I know... my book is old.  ;)

It states: "Rosa is a medium chopped beef and pork. The prominent spice is Italian Red Pepper which imparts a hot flavor to the product."

Also it refers to something they call "Slicers" (traditional flavored, preferred by pizzerias, in link form and artificial casings; and the 3 1/2 pound  ??? CANNED ??? version is presliced.

It clearly shows that this "CANNED" version is not the same pepperoni that is vacuum packed for general grocery.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline scott r

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #47 on: November 04, 2005, 12:59:19 AM »
The Rosa Grande is just slightly wider than the Rosa.   The two Rosas are the same size as the two Ezzo's I think.

Offline Lydia

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #48 on: November 04, 2005, 11:40:57 AM »
  :-\ ... if they taste the same it sounds like it may very well be a possibility. . .

Also I don't know Ezzo's diameter.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Frankie G

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Re: Pepperoni Brands --
« Reply #49 on: November 04, 2005, 01:49:48 PM »
I just ordered a sample package from Frankie. Once my package arrives, I will be able to compare the Swiss American pepperoni with Ezzo pepperoni. Ezzo is some of the best that I've ever tasted... it will be interesting to taste the two side-by-side. :)

Good luck to me!!!!

Frankie G