Author Topic: 10h dough  (Read 3716 times)

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Offline andreguidon

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10h dough
« on: April 01, 2012, 09:01:00 AM »
Well, i am always making 24h dough, this time i made a 10h dough.

100% 00 green 5stagioni flour (W250) http://www.le5stagioni.it/le5stagioniITA/prodotti-rinforzato.html

i made this by hand using the VPN formula.

+ - 1620g flour
1000l water
55g salt
3g CY

bulk for 2h and balled for 8h.
i liked this, specially because i made it with weaker flour.
please pay no attention to the mozzarella, this was not a good choice, this was more a dough test run.
this pies where all cold wen the picture was taken, the hot ones where eaten, and this i made to freeze (hope it works).

« Last Edit: April 01, 2012, 09:04:12 AM by andreguidon »
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #1 on: April 01, 2012, 09:05:38 AM »
Andre,

Those are beautiful. You will have Mr. Margherita-ville (Larry) drooling over those :-D.

Peter

Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #2 on: April 01, 2012, 09:52:25 AM »
thanks Peter! i really like the 10h dough made with weaker flour, wen i make it with stronger flour (caputo W280 or 5stagioni blue W320) its not so soft and tender.
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Offline dellavecchia

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #3 on: April 01, 2012, 09:59:16 AM »
My gosh that is quite the picture Andre. Beautiful baking. I have a 12 hour dough fermenting right now using a weaker flour as you did. I have 10% starter at 68 degrees. At what temp did you bulk and ball?

John

Online TXCraig1

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #4 on: April 01, 2012, 10:03:16 AM »
Yes. Beautiful coloration. Very nice.

CL
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Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #5 on: April 01, 2012, 10:33:11 AM »
thanks Guys! i really like the coloration that a shorter dough has, thats why i while back Peter help me with a formula for 24h using a poolish.

John, the room temp was 72F.
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Offline norma427

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #6 on: April 01, 2012, 10:57:57 AM »
Andre,

Wow, those are all beautiful looking pies!   :chef:  Your coloration looks perfect.

Norma

Offline Matthew

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #7 on: April 01, 2012, 11:01:16 AM »
Bellisimi!

Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #8 on: April 01, 2012, 11:53:39 AM »
thank Norma!
Grazie Matt!
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Offline Matthew

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #9 on: April 01, 2012, 11:56:43 AM »
thank Norma!
Grazie Matt!

Are you with me in that a 10 hour dough with a weaker flour is as good as a 24 hour dough with stronger flour.

Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #10 on: April 01, 2012, 11:59:58 AM »
yep! that was the conclusion that i got out of this.... i was always obsessed about longer fermentation, but this formula works great also!!
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #11 on: April 01, 2012, 12:11:21 PM »
Andre,

Are you using a new dough formulation or did you adapt the poolish version to a shorter period?

Peter

Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #12 on: April 01, 2012, 12:55:29 PM »
Peter, this was a direct dough, i followed the VPN formula. but i am thinking about adapting a poolish version for a 10h dough.
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Offline Pizza Napoletana

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #13 on: April 01, 2012, 04:58:08 PM »
Well, i am always making 24h dough, this time i made a 10h dough. . . .

Dear Andre, well done! Thank you for the picture.
Recipes make pizzas no more than sermons make saints!

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Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #14 on: April 01, 2012, 06:10:57 PM »
thanks!
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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #15 on: April 01, 2012, 06:22:48 PM »
Are you with me in that a 10 hour dough with a weaker flour is as good as a 24 hour dough with stronger flour.

Matt, for texture? Do you feel the same for sourdough?
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #16 on: April 01, 2012, 06:23:49 PM »
Well, i am always making 24h dough, this time i made a 10h dough.

100% 00 green 5stagioni flour (W250) http://www.le5stagioni.it/le5stagioniITA/prodotti-rinforzato.html

i made this by hand using the VPN formula.

+ - 1620g flour
1000l water
55g salt
3g CY

bulk for 2h and balled for 8h.
i liked this, specially because i made it with weaker flour.
please pay no attention to the mozzarella, this was not a good choice, this was more a dough test run.
this pies where all cold wen the picture was taken, the hot ones where eaten, and this i made to freeze (hope it works).



Andre,

What was your bake time and temp?

Thanks!
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage


Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #17 on: April 01, 2012, 06:27:05 PM »
My bake time is around 70-75s deck temp around 410-420C.
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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #18 on: April 01, 2012, 06:36:41 PM »
Thank you. Again, beautiful!
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #19 on: April 01, 2012, 06:47:30 PM »
Craig i am also curious about this 10h dough made with SD...
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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #20 on: April 01, 2012, 06:58:57 PM »
Craig i am also curious about this 10h dough made with SD...

From my experiments with bread, I'm thinking yes, but at a high temp fermentation - around 95F maybe.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline dellavecchia

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #21 on: April 01, 2012, 07:04:15 PM »
I just finished baking a 12 hour dough with a 10% starter - actually a levain. It had all the qualities of good NP pizza as well as a complexity of flavor. The fermentation hovered at 68-70 degrees for 10 hours, and then 85 for 2 hours. I even got good leoparding. It is basically making bread with a preferment.

John

Offline Matthew

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #22 on: April 01, 2012, 07:16:52 PM »
Matt, for texture? Do you feel the same for sourdough?

Craig,
I have never done a 10-12 hour with starter alone.  I have done it several times using yeast & a bit of old dough.

Matt

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #23 on: April 01, 2012, 07:32:31 PM »
From my experiments with bread, I'm thinking yes, but at a high temp fermentation - around 95F maybe.

Andre & Craig, I've made plenty of pizza (both NP, NY and inbetween) in the 8-12h room temp range with a starter.  You get a great texture and flavor.  You can go high temp if you want but room temp works best for me.  The benefit is you don't have the enzyme activity to contend with.  You can dial in the flavor to any degree you want by varying your percentage of starter, the starter you use and at what stage, and fermentation temps.  

The only thing you have to adjust is your hydration.  You'll want to go about 2-3% higher than your normally use to get a similar texture and moistness.  Ischia has plenty of flavor.  I would start with room temps, see if you like it, and then try a higher temp.  But room temps will do you fine.

Here's a 12h room temp pie made with starter.

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14201.msg144552.html#msg144552
« Last Edit: April 01, 2012, 08:38:34 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline andreguidon

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Re: 10h dough
« Reply #24 on: April 01, 2012, 07:34:38 PM »
John, what is the difference between a starter and a levain? i have always thought that it was the same.
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