Author Topic: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.  (Read 24786 times)

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Offline fornographer

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Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« on: April 09, 2012, 08:59:54 PM »
Hello,

First off, thank you everyone for sharing your knowledge and passion for Neapolitan pies.  I have been lurking for a while and finally have my own WFO (a Forno Bravo Andiamo 70).   This past weekend, I tried cooking my first pizzas using the things I learned from here.  

My first batch of test pies were better than any of the Mellow Johnny Papa places in town but still very far from the standards being set in this forum (TXCraig, Omid, Chau, Dellavechia..you folks are Jedi Masters etc).  

Here some of the test pies

San Felice 00 Flour (very old 14+ months)
Cento Marzano Tomatoes
Some cheap fresh mozzarella from local grocery
Natural homemade starter: 10%
Hydration: 62%
Bulk Fermentation:  24 hrs at 63F
Balled Fermentation:  8 hours at 72F


Though visually ok, the taste was too sour.  I put too much of my starter (at a very mature stage) and let it ferment for too long.  The dough was chewy which I suspect was due to over mixing and/or old flour.   The balls almost opened by themselves and were tough to put on the wooden peel and difficult to launch.   The oven needs more seasoning and I need to learn more about how it behaves.  The floor was 900F when I baked and the dome was over 1000F.

Overall, I rate my first effort as a D and very eager to climb the learning curve.  

Cheers.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2012, 06:28:03 PM by fornographer »


Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #1 on: April 09, 2012, 09:09:31 PM »
The oven looks cool and the pies look good.  I've made plenty of D and F pies in my day and still do occassionally.   The chewiness is likely in part from the over mature starter as you suspect.  The acids break down the dough and toughen the crumb accentuating any toughness from over mixing as well.   The breakdown, along with a long ferment also cause the dough to become super slack.  Before you pitch the old flour you might try a batch with a much younger starter.   Use only about 10% seed for the new starter, let it get active (6-8hours at room temps), then dump half, refeed, and when it gets active again, it should be okay to use.   I make it a habit to taste the starter before using to make sure it has very little acidity.    If you continue having trouble with the starter, there is no shame in using CY or commercial yeast as well until you feel comfortable.  

Also, a 10% starter will take around 12 hours or soon at room temps of 75F to fully ferment the dough.   For a 48 hour dough, I believe Craig uses around 1.5% starter at 65F.   So even if you start with a young starter,  if you let the dough sit too long, it will over mature and ruin the dough.   You might consider using less starter, shortening your fermentation times, or both. 

Let's see some more pictures.   And honestly, I'm still fumbling around with everyone else.  :-D
« Last Edit: April 09, 2012, 09:20:13 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline RobynB

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #2 on: April 09, 2012, 09:45:08 PM »
Ooooh, pretty oven!!  Your first pizza looks a lot better than mine did  ;D  Trust me, it gets easier and better.  Practice is your best teacher, along with this forum.  Welcome!

Offline PortMoodyFoodie

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #3 on: April 09, 2012, 10:15:38 PM »
Great start!  Is that a Forno Bravo Andiamo 70 oven?  I've been thinking about ordering that exact one!  How is it working for you?  Or is it too early to tell?

Offline pizza dr

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #4 on: April 09, 2012, 10:47:34 PM »
"D" ?   No way... Maybe for the Jedi masters :P  Looks good to me. Can't wait to see the progress.

Love the Oven

Scot


Offline scott123

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #5 on: April 09, 2012, 11:06:31 PM »
Is that foil covering the door?  I wouldn't have foil anywhere in a WFO.  If it hits 1100ish, you'll have a puddle of aluminum.

Offline David Deas

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #6 on: April 09, 2012, 11:14:08 PM »
It'll flake and need replacing.
« Last Edit: April 09, 2012, 11:17:45 PM by David Deas »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2012, 11:24:03 PM »
If that maranara is a D, I can't wait to see your A-game. Looks like you are well on your way to making topnotch pies!

Craig
I love pigs. They convert vegetables into bacon.

Offline Bigfoot21075

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #8 on: April 10, 2012, 08:47:32 AM »
Cool oven! Can't wait to see your progress.... I love the idea of the Andiamo, but shipping to the east coast is a fortune.

Offline Kermit

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #9 on: April 10, 2012, 09:15:50 AM »
As Craig said, if that marinara is your D game, I might fear for the level of your A game as that is one good looking pie.

The last pie looks a bit pale - was it due to fewer flames?


Offline fornographer

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #10 on: April 10, 2012, 07:12:42 PM »
Great start!  Is that a Forno Bravo Andiamo 70 oven?  I've been thinking about ordering that exact one!  How is it working for you?  Or is it too early to tell?

Yes, it is the Andiamo 70.  It's working well so far.  I spent 8 days curing it and went full blast this past weekend. 

Offline fornographer

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2012, 07:16:18 PM »
As Craig said, if that marinara is your D game, I might fear for the level of your A game as that is one good looking pie.

The last pie looks a bit pale - was it due to fewer flames?

Yes, the last pie was due launched after the flames stopped lapping over to the other side of oven.   

I just ordered half a cord of firewood and am looking forward to months of practice and learning from everyone.

Cheers!

Online thezaman

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #12 on: April 10, 2012, 08:57:05 PM »
this is my forth year with my primevera 70. i love the portable version that they just released,and you own. looks like you are way ahead with the oven than i was when i first got mine. you have al of these awesome pizza geeks to guide you, you will be a seasoned pizzaiolo in no time.

Offline tommy

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #13 on: April 11, 2012, 06:39:31 PM »
Your 'D' pies look just fine to me!

I'm interested in hearing more about your journey and this oven. I've been considering Forno Bravo for some time, but it just seemed like a hassle to get a proper stand (and I'm not very handy!).  I hadn't heard of this oven until seeing this thread, and if it's as "roll of the crate" easy as it sounds, and it gets hot and operates well, I'm very much looking forward to getting one, shipping charges be damned!

Nice job.

Offline fornographer

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #14 on: April 11, 2012, 07:36:30 PM »
Your 'D' pies look just fine to me!

I'm interested in hearing more about your journey and this oven. I've been considering Forno Bravo for some time, but it just seemed like a hassle to get a proper stand (and I'm not very handy!).  I hadn't heard of this oven until seeing this thread, and if it's as "roll of the crate" easy as it sounds, and it gets hot and operates well, I'm very much looking forward to getting one, shipping charges be damned!

Nice job.


Hi Tommy, Thanks! Yes, I too spent a long time deciding whether to build my own or buy a fully assembled WFO from Forno Bravo.  I actually think I've come up with a good plan to mount the Primavera 70 (http://www.fornobravo.com/forum/7/placing-p70-stand-14977-3.html#post129444) but changed my mind at the last minute after the Forno Bravo rep sent me more detail information and pictures of the Andiamo 70 from their factory.  I'm glad I did!  

Yes! The cost of shipping to Atlanta was murderous.  I have made countless quotes from the Forno Bravo webpage and noticed that the shipping costs, when plotted, were closely related to the gas prices; which makes perfect sense.  So, when I noticed that the prices were trending higher, I used one of the quotes I received (I think they were good for 30 days) and went ahead and ordered the oven.   So that's a tip, start getting quotes from FB on the ovens that you are interested in so you can pick from them (the cheapest shipping) when you're ready.  

I have never had anything delivered to me by a semi and in a monolithic crate! I had to do some coaching as the delivery guy didn't seem to have a good plan--as you will see from the pics--to unload the crate.  It was hairy!  I simulated the process of unpacking and rolling the oven to my back porch but quickly realized the real thing was a lot tougher.  Prying that crate was tough.  Forno Bravo has done an excellent job securing the oven with fixed chocks that removing them was quite an ordeal.   The oven is heavy, it sank on the dry ground when I started pushing it to the back of my house.  It was obvious that I could use the sides of the crate as a rolling platform and that worked well :)

Below are some pictures from the delivery:  
« Last Edit: April 11, 2012, 07:39:25 PM by fornographer »

Offline fornographer

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #15 on: April 11, 2012, 07:37:13 PM »
more pics

Offline fornographer

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #16 on: April 11, 2012, 07:38:58 PM »
more

Offline tommy

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #17 on: April 11, 2012, 07:49:02 PM »
Great pics, Fornographer!  And thank you for your thoughtful response.

I had a gravity feed smoker delivered on a semi a few years ago.  I must admit, it's quite a sight to see a semi in front of your house just to deliver your cooking apparatus.  And I must admit I'm thinking this delivery will make me even more giddy. 

Glad to see that using the crate sides is an option.  I've got pavers all the way back to my patio, but thought it might be hairy rolling this beast on them.  Using the crate sides was just what I was thinking, so I'm glad to see that's an option. 

Question:  is it truly rollable once it's set in place?  Not that I'd need to move it too much (I'm not planning on throwing it in the back of my SUV for parties), but I'm hoping a couple of guys can reposition it once the delivery guy is gone.

Gas prices are crazy, but I've already got my quote. :)

Now, more pics of pies?

Phar Lap

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #18 on: April 11, 2012, 07:55:45 PM »
Fornographer,

Thanks so much for the delivery pictures of the Andiamo 70...one question: how did you roll the oven out of the crate?; it looks like it is 4 to 6 inches of the ground when you took off the side panel...did you jerry-rig a ramp?

Thanks...Adam

Offline fornographer

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Re: Fornography: A Neapolitan pizza journey.
« Reply #19 on: April 11, 2012, 07:59:30 PM »
Great pics, Fornographer!  And thank you for your thoughtful response.

I had a gravity feed smoker delivered on a semi a few years ago.  I must admit, it's quite a sight to see a semi in front of your house just to deliver your cooking apparatus.  And I must admit I'm thinking this delivery will make me even more giddy. 

Glad to see that using the crate sides is an option.  I've got pavers all the way back to my patio, but thought it might be hairy rolling this beast on them.  Using the crate sides was just what I was thinking, so I'm glad to see that's an option. 

Question:  is it truly rollable once it's set in place?  Not that I'd need to move it too much (I'm not planning on throwing it in the back of my SUV for parties), but I'm hoping a couple of guys can reposition it once the delivery guy is gone.

Gas prices are crazy, but I've already got my quote. :)

Now, more pics of pies?

It is well and truly easy to move once set in place.  Once on a reasonably smooth surface, it just glides without straining every sinew of your being.  Only the front casters can be locked so plan on getting some chocks.  The wheel is made out of plastic that will get damaged easy if you roll it too much on an abrasive surface.  The casters look like they can easily be replaced. I may replace them in the future with bigger wheels and maybe pneumatic so they can roll on rough terrain which what most of my backyard consists of.  

I have two iterations in the works for this weekend and I'll make sure to post more pics.  :)

Cheers.


 

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