Author Topic: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd  (Read 1978 times)

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Offline NPHORIZON

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Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« on: September 16, 2005, 12:42:10 AM »
Hello I am new here.  Already I have obtained a great deal of info here.

I will be building a brick oven shortly and need to determine the ideal temp and cooking time.  The widely held view in the industry has been that a coal or wood oven is ideal as are very high temps in excess of 650.

There are some here who claim 650 is too hot and reccommend temps in the range of 450.  Any thoughts?

Finally Peter Reinhart's recipe for NY style specifies a 12" pizza - 12 ounces.  No doubt this recipe is geared for home users who have small pizza stones.  Nevertheless he recommends a rolled out thickness of 1/4 inch which is considerably thicker than the standard .1 factor.  Not sure how this would bake in a wood oven.

Any thoughts would be appreciated.


Offline scott r

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #1 on: September 16, 2005, 01:01:42 AM »
NPHORISON,

Depending on the style of pizza you decide to cook, 450 might be right, while 850 would be perfect for others.  I personally have been preferring a very quick bake of one minute combined with a 800 degree oven, lower protein flour (harder to brown than high gluten) a really wet dough, and fresh or buffalo mozzarella.  Last week I made an American style Sicilian pizza.  For this recipe the dough had a lower hydration, the cheese was processed (not fresh), and the bake lasted 15 minutes at 500.  Your recipe and style will determine your ideal temp and time.

Just because you have a brick oven does not mean that you have to fire it at 900 degrees.  Bertucci's is an example of a pizzeria chain that has woodfired ovens that are fired at about the same temps as a cranked home oven.  If you want to make a thicker pie, just don't get the fire raging, and leave the pie in longer.  If you are having a hard time getting thicker pies cooked enough before the bottom burns try using a flour with less protein.  This will allow you to bake the pie a little longer before browning sets in.

Offline Bill/SFNM

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #2 on: September 16, 2005, 01:21:59 AM »
There are some here who claim 650 is too hot and reccommend temps in the range of 450.  Any thoughts?

welcome!

What temperature are you measuring? In a very hot oven, the temp conducted from the floor has a greater effect on the cooking of the dough than the temp of the air. And the heat radiated from the fire (if you use a live fire) and the roof of the oven is the predominant way the toppings get cooked. Makes for a pretty complex scenario in which the above factors and the thickness of the dough and the amount of toppings and the baking time all become critical in getting the perfect pie.

I really don't do NY-style, preferring Neapolitan with a floor temp of 800+, a lively fire, thin crust, few toppings baking for no more than 90 seconds.

Bill/SFNM

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #3 on: September 16, 2005, 12:07:22 PM »
Nick,

If Peter Reinhart says 12 ounces for a 12-inch pizza, the thickness factor for that pizza as I would calculate it is 12/(3.14 x 6 x 6), or 12/113.04 = 0.106. For the Lehmann NY style, I typically use 0.10-0.105. Peter Reinhart talks about rolling out the dough to about 1/4-inch thickness. If you shape by hand so that you produce a decent rim, then I think the dough will conform to the thickness factor I calculated. I don't see any reason offhand why such a pizza cannot be baked in a brick oven.

Peter

Offline NPHORIZON

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #4 on: September 16, 2005, 04:32:49 PM »
NPHORISON,

 Bertucci's is an example of a pizzeria chain that has woodfired ovens that are fired at about the same temps as a cranked home oven.  If you want to make a thicker pie, just don't get the fire raging, and leave the pie in longer. 

Thankyou Scott,

That is very interesting about Bertucci's.  Given that the 2 ovens operate at similar temp's, do you feel that the product of a brick oven in this scenario should be superior nontheless?  I only have experience with PN and high temp's in which case the results are obviously superior.

NP

Offline NPHORIZON

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #5 on: September 16, 2005, 04:40:52 PM »
Thanks Bill and Pete,

You've both added to my knowledge database!


Pete,

You are correct, after re-reading P.R's recipe, it does state "roll out".  Funny how you can gloss over something like that!  Makes total sense that with rolling out you will not have the thinner center.  Your NY style pizza photos are breathtaking by the way!

NP.

Offline scott r

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #6 on: September 16, 2005, 05:20:09 PM »
Even in Italy I found some pizzerias with woodburning ovens that were not fired very hot.  What I found was that the smoky flavor from the wood did help these pizza's out even if the texture was not what it would have been at higher temps.

Offline Wallman

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Re: Reinhart Recipe Seems Odd
« Reply #7 on: March 02, 2006, 11:11:53 PM »
I just finished reading American Pie and also noticed Reinhart says "roll out."  However, in his descriptions of how to shape pizzas he gives directions for either tossing or hand shaping on a work surface.  So I wonder if "rollout" is a typo or simply bad editing.

I'll be running a head-to-head taste test tomorrow of Reinhart's Neo-Neopolitan dough vs. Pete-zza's Tom Lehmann formulation.


 

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