Author Topic: Trapped behind knowledge - need help (Read 3093 times)

mcalohan · « **Reply #20 on:** June 08, 2012, 06:17:43 PM »

Sorry man but lemme be straight with you, I don't have to defend my pizza against someone who hasn't eaten it.

shuboyje · « **Reply #21 on:** June 08, 2012, 07:43:53 PM »

That's really not my goal.

I think it's safe to say most active posters here have done lots of trial and error in our pizza making experiences. With that you begin to gain lots of visual clues to the taste of a pizza. There are things that could lead to a great pizza while not having those visuals, but I think they would be so far outside of the norms from what most people expect a pizza to taste like they would not be commercially viable. For instance good sauce is good sauce, it is simple. If there is something very different about yours thats makes it worlds better to you it may not be commercially viable. Same goes for cheese and dough. So, as I already said, if your pizzas have qualities that make them world class in your opinion while not obtaining some of the visuals one would expect from a world class pizza of that style I would venture to guess the flavor profile is too far outside the normal expected profile to be commercially viable.

I'm not knocking your pizzas, they look good, we would all eat them and probably ask for more, but I highly doubt they are world changing.

I certainly don't have any insecurities. I love pizza, I love making pizza, and I love the pizza I make, but I also know there are many here who are much more skilled then myself and who produce better pizzas then I do. I'm fine with that. I feel the frequent posters here represent a pretty elite level of pizza makers, and when you are in that company there is almost always gonna be someone better then you.

pizzaneer · « **Reply #22 on:** June 08, 2012, 07:51:00 PM »

Quote from: shuboyje on June 08, 2012, 05:28:31 PM

Have you looked around the site much?

They certainly aren't horrible looking pizzas, but they don't look like anything that needs intellectual protection either. I personally don't see them as being on par with what is produced here by many members daily who openly share their methods for all to learn from. Hate to be the first to burst your bubble with honesty, but your original question was looking for help with a valuable recipe and/or workflow...I don't see the value. We have established consultants who contribute here who can get a pizzeria to a higher level.

second that - after slideshowing the album... THE CLOWNS ARE COMING!! RUUUNN!!!.... I didn't see a single thing that was above "dead average". Note that you were NOT asked to give away any secrets, just tell us why you think they are special, and worth the childish, attention-seeking fuss you have made about them. Plenty of people here on this forum have freely shared their amazingly way much more delicious & far-better pics, recipes and workflows to the benefit of us all.

mcalohan · « **Reply #23 on:** June 08, 2012, 07:51:20 PM »

I edited my post a while ago man to remove the part about your insecurities. You've been writing that for a little bit....

Wow, you're sure smart man. I never could have put together that much information from just pictures. Much less qualifying that my pizza looks so differant that everything else out there that people wouldn't eat it. I appreciate your educated opinion and look forward to more of your deep analysis.

mcalohan · « **Reply #24 on:** June 08, 2012, 08:10:59 PM »

Ok this is what I made tonight. Went with a nice hand tossed style.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v234/mjcalohan/?action=view&current=IMG_20120608_190847.jpg

Over the next couple of days I'm gonna start making some good pictures of pizza.

Ok listen up, it's time you heard this and heard it good. Being an internet tough guy is a guaranteed fool proof way of telling everyone exactly how small you are as a man.

Bill/SFNM · « **Reply #25 on:** June 08, 2012, 08:27:08 PM »

Quote from: mcalohan on June 08, 2012, 08:10:59 PM

Ok listen up, it's time you heard this and heard it good. Being an internet tough guy is a guaranteed fool proof way of telling everyone exactly how small you are as a man.

Personal attacks are NOT tolerated on this forum. Please focus discussions on the topic of pizza.

mcalohan · « **Reply #26 on:** June 08, 2012, 09:14:52 PM »

Oh... ok, I got it. So long as I don't word it personal, I'm allowed to say what I want right? Like those two "trolling me", that's cool right? Inciting a fight is fine so long as you don't actually take a swing. Ok, got it. Thanks dude.

Bill/SFNM · « **Reply #27 on:** June 08, 2012, 09:18:53 PM »

Quote from: mcalohan on June 08, 2012, 09:14:52 PM

Oh... ok, I got it. So long as I don't word it personal, I'm allowed to say what I want right? Like those two "trolling me", that's cool right? Inciting a fight is fine so long as you don't actually take a swing. Ok, got it. Thanks dude.

Exactly. You can say someone's pizza sucks and engage in lively debate about the reasons you think that may or may not be true. You may not engage in negative personal comments. Feel free to contact Steve, the owner of this list, if you have problems with this policy.

mcalohan · « **Reply #28 on:** June 08, 2012, 09:23:29 PM »

Nope, we're 100% clear. I ain't gonna be a problem bro. I had a little venom in my comment but it honestly did come from the heart with positive intentions. It was a jab and I ain't gonna argue with ya but I do want it to be known that it did come from a place of love.

pizzaneer · « **Reply #29 on:** June 08, 2012, 09:34:11 PM »

In the spirit of love, allow me to ask you AGAIN what makes your pizza special.

Your pie pictures are nothing out of the ordinary.

So if you could answer the pizza-related question I have asked, we can just move on.

I'm certainly not going to drop down to personal attacks, why would I? Why would anyone here do that? The point of this forum is that we all HELP each other, not waste each other's time in silly, parochial little mind games.

And... trolls suck. I'm not one. Ask anyone.

mcalohan · « **Reply #30 on:** June 08, 2012, 11:05:46 PM »

What makes it special is exactly what I said. I've never seen, or heard of, or been able to find through research, anyone making dough the way I do and I'm unsure what to do about it. It is a commercially viable recipe which makes it valuable. I ain't real big on money as it perpetuates inequality but I live in America.

I've been told it's amazing and as a lifelong pizza lover/worker/manager I know it is amongst the best I've ever eaten. Yeah I know everyone thinks that their kid is special when it is simply the result of reproduction but this one is different and I'm kind of at a loss..... this ain't something I created last week, I've been carrying this around for a while.

A private investor is probably gonna be the only way I could ever get a place open and I have thought about it quite a bit. Gonna do a super thin for lunch, I'll post a pic.

pizzaneer · « **Reply #31 on:** June 08, 2012, 11:19:24 PM »

Quote from: mcalohan on June 08, 2012, 11:05:46 PM

Gonna do a super thin for lunch, I'll post a pic.

Ok. Looking forward to it.

SinoChef · « **Reply #32 on:** June 09, 2012, 05:46:31 AM »

In my experience, "Secret Recipes" and "Proprietary Blends" are great for marketing. Like the 11 secret herbs and spices campaign.

My advice to anyone looking to open any kind of food service venue is "Kitchen Nightmares" from Ramsey. Watch them all over and over, till you have each one memorized. Ego is a killer in this business. And much like the Dog Whisper guy works very little with the actual dog, Ramsey spends 90% of his time adjusting the owners mentality.

Pizzeria Bianco is one of the best in the entire world. So how does this happen?

http://www.google.com.hk/search?q=dominos+Phoenix,+AZ&hl=en&newwindow=1&safe=strict&client=firefox-a&hs=mGJ&rls=org.mozilla:en-US:official&prmd=imvns&source=univ&tbm=plcs&tbo=u&sa=X&ei=3RjTT9L3CNGjiAfW_q2bAw&ved=0CCEQtQM&biw=1024&bih=434

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #33 on:** June 09, 2012, 07:44:23 AM »

Quote from: mcalohan on June 08, 2012, 08:10:59 PM

Ok this is what I made tonight. Went with a nice hand tossed style.
http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v234/mjcalohan/?action=view&current=IMG_20120608_190847.jpg

mcalohan,

Boy, you're right...your pizzas really are special! Your "nice hand tossed style" pizza you "made tonight" also made an appearance in the slide show you posted earlier in the day. http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,19493.msg190890.html#msg190890

Wait!! Lemme guess....the clown must know your recipe too....awesome!! How do I get in touch with him?
Thanks!

Bob

Tscarborough · « **Reply #34 on:** June 09, 2012, 10:25:40 AM »

But when you change it to "pizza pheonix AZ" you get this:

http://www.google.com.hk/search?hl=en&newwindow=1&safe=strict&client=firefox-a&rls=org.mozilla%3Aen-US%3Aofficial&biw=1024&bih=629&tbm=plcs&q=pizza+Phoenix%2C+AZ&oq=pizza+Phoenix%2C+AZ&aq=f&aqi=g-c1g1g-c8&aql=&gs_l=serp.3..0i7j0j0i7l8.16714.17666.0.18857.5.5.0.0.0.0.84.395.5.5.0...0.0.0TneI2goZtM

I'll take a stab at your dough. It is a low hydration (say 55%) using AP flour, it has oil and probably powdered milk. Those pizzas don't look bad at all.

Don K · « **Reply #35 on:** June 09, 2012, 10:42:20 AM »

Quote from: SinoChef on June 09, 2012, 05:46:31 AM

My advice to anyone looking to open any kind of food service venue is "Kitchen Nightmares" from Ramsey. Watch them all over and over, till you have each one memorized. Ego is a killer in this business. And much like the Dog Whisper guy works very little with the actual dog, Ramsey spends 90% of his time adjusting the owners mentality.

This is sound advice. Check your ego at the door and adjust your attitude. Unless you are a marketing genius and know the ins and outs of starting a successful restaurant business, you are going to need lots of help from people that do. I don't care how good this super secret recipe/method that you have is, you will fail without the proper attitude. You came here with only a vague description of what it was that you want help with, and then berated and insulted the few people that tried to give their honest opinion based on the limited information that you gave them. There are no trolls here.

I'm still not sure what exactly it is that you are asking the members of this forum to help you with. If you are looking for advice on how to secure investors for venture capital, then I know a little about that. You will have a hard time finding someone that is going to invest in your venture if you have no skin in the game. If you have no money invested in the project then you are going to have to demonstrate to the investor that you have a lot of dedication, knowledge, a plan, and the ability to make it successful. It's going to take more than just a super secret dough recipe/method to convince him to assume 100% of the risk in the venture.

If you have no business knowledge or experience then perhaps what you need is a partner and not an investor.

Meatballs · « **Reply #36 on:** June 09, 2012, 11:20:11 AM »

Really, I don't see what could be so groundbreaking about pizza dough. Unless its a dry mix hydrated with no kneading immediately before use and then tops and bakes itself with solar energy resulting in precut slices in a box... I'm sure somebody has done it before. Pizzas look ok, not groundbreaking, so I assume it must be the process. Just wondering why everybody is all atwitter...

Ron

CDNpielover · « **Reply #37 on:** June 09, 2012, 11:20:42 AM »

I agree with the others... those pies don't look that good at all. Had you checked your attitude at the door, you would have received a TON of great advice and encouragement, but since you're acting like a kid people are just going to tell you how it is.

Chicago Bob · « **Reply #38 on:** June 09, 2012, 11:26:34 AM »

Quote from: Tscarborough on June 09, 2012, 10:25:40 AM

I'll take a stab at your dough. It is a low hydration (say 55%) using AP flour, it has oil and probably powdered milk. Those pizzas don't look bad at all.

Yes, you are probably very close on pics 6-8 but all the rest look different from one another IMO. #5 looks like the pepperoni was nuked and then put on after the pizza was baked...never seen that before.

CDNpielover · « **Reply #39 on:** June 09, 2012, 11:35:17 AM »

if it was me, i would really be trying to improve my top browning, and also crust browning. in those pics, most of the pies looked undercooked (except for the ones where the crust is burned, of course).