Author Topic: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!  (Read 4562 times)

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Offline Antilife

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #75 on: July 17, 2016, 02:43:00 AM »
yes.... and if a big Sugar Factory pay them..... They change again Disciplinary!! For real Neapolitan Pizza Must use sugar !!

Offline fagilia

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #76 on: July 18, 2016, 03:05:46 AM »
Actually Franco Pepe told me this new electric oven was on the way. He told me soon you Can skip the fornaio and you dont have to turn the pizza anymore.
Probably antilife and sub knows more about this.

Offline Antilife

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #77 on: July 18, 2016, 10:14:06 AM »


Izzo Forni  "Scugnizzo Napoletano"
I remember in January during Formamentis Forum in Naples, when Mr Izzo ask to meeting to allow elettric oven in diciplinary for his oven.
A great Meeting .....and i remember Enzo Coccia when say: "La disciplinare e' una buffonata" "Disciplinary is a foolishness" because  the Best Pizzeria not follow this...

Online Don Luigi

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #78 on: July 18, 2016, 10:32:30 AM »
That's quite impressive...
On a neapolitan pizza journey with Wood fired oven Pizza Party 70x70
My Pizza

Offline fagilia

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #79 on: July 19, 2016, 06:37:08 AM »
Exactly what do you mean enzo said? That disiplinary is not good and therefore you should do what you want?
Thank you for video, this was the oven yes.
Is Izzo giving money to pizzaiolos to promote this oven Antilife? I see so many making some advertising for it?
« Last Edit: July 19, 2016, 06:38:46 AM by fagilia »

Offline Antilife

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #80 on: July 19, 2016, 08:23:40 AM »
I think enzo was referring to the fact that the disciplinary writes the recipe but then no major pizzeria follows. Every important pizzeria in Naples has its own recipe which is completely different from the Disciplinary. Then I also think the fact that it is all a business issue. Remember that if you want the LOGO of AVPN (associazione Vera Pizza Napoletana) you must pay a subscription and say to follow the receipe. Moreover it seems that encourage you to always use the same products that are, Caputo flour, Gustarosso or Agrigenus, Fiordilatte Agerola.

Offline invertedisdead

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #81 on: July 19, 2016, 12:48:05 PM »
I think enzo was referring to the fact that the disciplinary writes the recipe but then no major pizzeria follows. Every important pizzeria in Naples has its own recipe which is completely different from the Disciplinary. Then I also think the fact that it is all a business issue. Remember that if you want the LOGO of AVPN (associazione Vera Pizza Napoletana) you must pay a subscription and say to follow the receipe. Moreover it seems that encourage you to always use the same products that are, Caputo flour, Gustarosso or Agrigenus, Fiordilatte Agerola.

Almost like a franchise. Trying to turn non chain pizza as close as they can to chain pizza.
Ryan

Offline fagilia

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #82 on: July 19, 2016, 01:47:33 PM »
I hear you antilife but i do disagree on some things. My pizzeria is a member to AVPN and they know i do not follow the rules. They are not rules but more a guide. If you listen too what everybody has to say in the AVPN office no one would disagree to make it your own way. I once went to a lesson the teach at AVPN and they clearly say all pizzaiolo make it their own way and its no problem.
These rules are good as they can guide us who are not born in Naples and has no Pizza Napoletana eyes. We can not see what they can see without training. If you follow the rules as a beginner you will end up with a pretty good product yes?
Many of the pizzas made outside Naples do not look like normal pizza napoletana. These guides are good but should not limit the pizzaiolo as you say.
This is what i have experienced so far.
Nobody never told me what tomato to use or what flour to use.


Offline invertedisdead

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #83 on: July 19, 2016, 02:07:30 PM »
Nobody never told me what tomato to use or what flour to use.

It's obvious that Antimo Caputo wants to be synonymous with Neapolitan pizza though.
Ryan

Offline Antilife

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #84 on: July 19, 2016, 02:09:50 PM »
I hear you antilife but i do disagree on some things. My pizzeria is a member to AVPN and they know i do not follow the rules. They are not rules but more a guide. If you listen too what everybody has to say in the AVPN office no one would disagree to make it your own way. I once went to a lesson the teach at AVPN and they clearly say all pizzaiolo make it their own way and its no problem.
These rules are good as they can guide us who are not born in Naples and has no Pizza Napoletana eyes. We can not see what they can see without training. If you follow the rules as a beginner you will end up with a pretty good product yes?
Many of the pizzas made outside Naples do not look like normal pizza napoletana. These guides are good but should not limit the pizzaiolo as you say.
This is what i have experienced so far.
Nobody never told me what tomato to use or what flour to use.

Hi Fagilia,
if you read this official document  ,say that you must follow their discplinary to be real AVPN Member

http://www.pizzanapoletana.org/public/pdf/Albo%20Pizzaioli%20Regolamento%20UK.pdf

read in this document:
OBLIGATIONS OF MEMBERS
The Members of the Pizza makers Register of the True Neapolitan Pizza undertake to:
a) prepare and serve the true Neapolitan pizza, according to tradition, adhering strictly to the rules of the
Regulations (Il Disciplinare) of the AVPN including the production process and ingredients;
b) use and make use where possible proper ingredients like: 00 flour, San Marzano peeled tomatoes or
peeled Italian tomatoes, fior di latte, mozzarella STG or buffalo mozzarella DOP, fresh basil, salt and fresh
yeast. Only fresh, natural and untreated and/or genetically unmodified ingredients are accepted;
c) adopt the proper technique: handmade dough or dough made by mixer, proper workbench, oven
temperature (about 450C/900F), manipulation according to the Neapolitan technique;
d) promote the Regulations (Il Disciplinare) of the true Neapolitan pizza.



If you say that nobody control you and rules,this means that Disciplinary is a stupid thing as i say..

Explain better the sense (parody):
b) use and make use where possible proper ingredients like: 00 flour (BETTER CAPUTO), San Marzano peeled tomatoes or
peeled Italian tomatoes(BETTER GUSTAROSSO), fior di latte(BETTER AGEROLA), mozzarella STG or buffalo mozzarella DOP(ALWAYS AGEROLA), fresh basil, salt and freshyeast. Only fresh, natural and untreated and/or genetically unmodified ingredients are accepted;

It's NOT Bad, you can choose Basil ,salt and fresh yeast.....ahhh not....There are a lot of commercial fresh yeast...but the producer is always one (http://www.lesaffreitalia.it/)
« Last Edit: July 19, 2016, 02:25:06 PM by Antilife »

Offline fagilia

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #85 on: July 19, 2016, 03:02:44 PM »
no i still disagree. For us non neapolitan the disiplinary is a good thing to guide us as a start.
As we became members first i was more thinking like you. Now when i know better i have changed a bit.
Iam not stupid and know offcourse many times money talks in many situations but iam hundred percent sure my own pizza would be worse
if ther where no AVPN.
The money i payed had been payed back thousand fold no question in forms of contact net.
ALso i do not understand fully exact what you mean sometimes so you know.

Offline Antilife

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #86 on: July 20, 2016, 10:22:12 AM »
I understand, but you have paid to have a logo that says quality and instead would mean it is not true. Try to understand what I want to tell you, this does not mean that your pizza is not good. But you are selling a product that is not what you say. this is not very ethical, and is the classic Italian style (as is AVPN).
The pizza is an incredible business, and I hate that cause of the disciplinary I was accused of not respecting the Italian traditions when I lived and studied the traditions of my people ... despite the myriad flaws, the bakery is our pride in the world
« Last Edit: July 20, 2016, 10:44:43 AM by Antilife »


Offline invertedisdead

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #87 on: July 20, 2016, 10:42:26 AM »
I understand, but you have paid to have a logo that says quality and instead would mean it is not true. Try to understand what I want to tell you, this does not mean that your pizza is not good. But you are selling a product that is not what you say. this is not very ethical, and is the classic Italian style (as is AVPN).
The pizza is an incredible business, and I hate that because of the disciplinary I was accused of not respecting the Italian traditions when I lived and studied the traditions of my people ... despite the myriad flaws, the bakery is our pride in the world

Yes, the pizza should be great because of Italian culture and tradition of Neapolitan pizza. Not because of AVPN sticker in the window. People should respect the tradition enough to uphold it themselves, without a legislation to support it.
Ryan

Online Don Luigi

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #88 on: July 20, 2016, 10:57:36 AM »
Yes, the pizza should be great because of Italian culture and tradition of Neapolitan pizza. Not because of AVPN sticker in the window. People should respect the tradition enough to uphold it themselves, without a legislation to support it.

I absolutely agree but seeing a Pizzeria with AVPN Sigil means that the Pizza will live up to certain standards. I've eaten alot of catastrophic Pizza in Italy.
On a neapolitan pizza journey with Wood fired oven Pizza Party 70x70
My Pizza

Offline Antilife

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #89 on: July 20, 2016, 11:27:16 AM »
I absolutely agree but seeing a Pizzeria with AVPN Sigil means that the Pizza will live up to certain standards. I've eaten alot of catastrophic Pizza in Italy.
You're right . the problem is just that; if you follow the specification is impossible to make a crappy pizza. If you are a good baker get amazing results, but if you make a terrible pizza means you have not followed a standard.
« Last Edit: July 20, 2016, 11:29:32 AM by Antilife »

Offline fagilia

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Re: 3 dough for Sunday's Pizza!!!!
« Reply #90 on: July 20, 2016, 12:59:59 PM »
Hmm i think we mean the same thing here antilife or more or less dispite language difference. For a man with information source like yourself no need for AVPN naturally.
But there are alot of people outside like myself that are very greatful for some guidance. Then its up to myself to decide what i want to use or not.
IF you search the internet it is pretty clear that many like me outside naples that is on the wrong track if you want to make traditional pizza Napoletana. Not long ago i was a person that thought i knew alot when in fact i Know sooo little. Iam just scratching the surface and i will always respect what s maestro tells me as it usually turns out to be correct.


 

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