Lots of issues

[nbarnstable]

Made a run at making a couple pies last weekend, and ran into several fundamental issues that I'm having trouble with.  It was basically a "if it CAN go wrong, it WILL" kind of day.

My formula:
Flour 100% (I'm using KABF, and for 2 12" pies I'm using 462g)
Water 70%
Yeast 0.5%
Salt 2%
Sugar 1%

Problem:  Dough consistency

The first time I tried this formula I barely kneaded it at all. After a 3 day cold ferment, the dough was still pretty rough, but I was able to stretch it into 2 pies.  The resulting crust was not bad, but it did tear pretty easily.  Last weekend's attempt I changed it a bit.  I let it knead on the dough hook on my Kitchenaid mixer for 20 minutes.  This dough was much smoother, and appeared to form bigger bubbles.  However, when trying to stretch this dough into a 12" pie it did still tear, however not as easily as the first attempt.  Im fully aware that my stretching technique could use some work, but watching people on youtube work the dough, theirs definitely appears more resilient.  Lastly, the dough still seems pretty sticky.  Even after a 3 day cold ferment in a proofing container that has been oiled, it still wants to stick to the container.  I end up pulling it out and deflating it far more than I imagine is ideal.  This also means that it sticks to my peel despite a generous dusting of cornmeal.  This makes getting it onto my stone nearly impossible.

My oven doesn't get as hot as I'd like, but I'm willing to accept that.  I heated my stone on the floor of my oven for 45 minutes before dusting it with cornmeal.  Unfortunately I didn't get the pie onto it fast enough, and boy did that stuff smoke.  Wound up having to pull that 500 degree stone out to scrape the burnt cornmeal off.  Then of course there was some water on the edge of the sink which was enough to crack the stone slightly, although not enough to keep me from putting it back into the oven.  It's in 2 pieces now though. 

Despite all of this the pies weren't terrible.  The crust was wayyyy too thin in the middle, but where there was a bit of thickness there was some nice open crumb, so that was close good. 

I'd appreciate any thoughts on the issues above with the crust.  I'm ordering a nice 1" thick stone to replace the broken one, so my next attempt is on hold for a bit.

[pizzaneer]

1. 70% hydration is on the high side.  I've found that 60-65% is a nice range to be in as far as stickiness vs oven spring.
2. Are you allowing the dough to come to room temp before stretching?  Cold dough will tear easier, and be harder to work with.

It would help if you had a few pictures.  I know, in the heat of the moment (sheer panic) it's hard to remember to snap a few. 

[anton-luigi]

sounds like overworked dough as well,  20 minutes on the KA mixer is an awfully long time.

[Chicago Bob]

Put the cornmeal on the peel. Sounds like you have a gas oven....if you're only getting 500 degrees in that stone with it sitting on the floor of the oven then something is wrong with your oven. Unless, of course, you had the temp. setting at around 400. Try stone on lowest rack and turn the oven up. And like the others said...70% is too high and 20 min. is too long.....62 and 5 should get you much closer. Might need the broiler for last min. or 2.

[anton-luigi]

Think 5 minutes is enough?  I havent had good luck with a knead that short myself,  but then I am not hand kneading AT ALL either.

[Chicago Bob]

Have you looked at any of the recent techniques over on the NY section?  Take a look at this thread....http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,18407.msg183390.html#msg183390