Forno Bravo Andiamo or Forno Classico Piccolo

[dellavecchia]

But, I wrote a note to ask if they would be on wheels for me.  Giuseppe responded: "The Piccolo  is a heavy duty oven and with the stand weighs around around 600 lbs.  For this reason, we do not provide or recommend wheels."

Stefano Ferrara ovens weigh 4000lbs and they come on wheels.

John

[shuboyje]

My oven weighs around 3000 pounds and is also on wheels.  I did however design the stand with special considerations.  I made the "wheelbase" as wide as possible and used very high grade industrial casters rated for the load.  I also eliminated the concrete slab by building on a very rigid metal base saving over 1000 pounds of weight.  This all resulted in an oven I can move by myself rather easily.

[mitchjg]

Hi All:

I am still comparing the Forno Bravo Andiamo vs. the FGM 700C.  From what I am learning the 700C is made tougher, stronger, better.  The wall and floor are 3 inch vs 2 inch, the door is insulated and a few other things that were pointed out.

IF I get the FGM (which is where I am leaning) I am still confused about the raised floor option.  Scott123 pointed out that the door height for the 700C seemed way to high relative to the dome height.  If I get the raised option the dome will be higher but the door relative to the dome will be improved.

If I understand the comments made by Scott, although neither is perfect, I would be better off with the lower dome.  That way the inside height is about 8 1/2 and the door the same, vs. an inside height of 11 1/2 with a door of 8 1/2 (assuming I am reading the specs right).

I would not be able to have as much versatility for non-pizza cooking with the lower one but I do not have a sense as to how important 8 1/2 vs 11 1/2 is for non-pizza. 

All comments and guidance welcome.  You people are great and I have very much appreciated your helpfulness.

- Mitch

[BrickStoneOven]

You don't need the raised floor. The stock 11.5" dome is fine, I don't know where people are getting the idea of having the lowest dome possible is best and that 9" is perfect. Is a low dome important for Neapolitan pizza, yes, but to a certain extent. Look at any hand built Neapolitan oven their dome heights adjust depending on the diameter. There isn't just one height fits all.

The dome in my WFO is ~12.4" which is just about perfect for my size(~42"), the fact that the 700c is lower and smaller shows that FGM knows what they are doing. The diameter of the oven is going to be indicative to the dome height. Like Craig's oven, bigger diameter, higher dome, relative to the size.

It's not like Wood Stones with 47" ovens with 20"+ domes. Those things IMO are horrible along with Mugnaini/Valoriani ovens.

[Woodfiredovenpizzero]

Giuseppe wont recommend wheels because of liability issues but you can use scaffold wheels, they are rated for more that a couple thousand pounds.

[Mangia Pizza]

FWIW, I just received my Forno Piccolo and been using it for a week.

I am very happy with the experience of talking to Giuseppe, the custom details he did for me and the overall experience I have had making pizze napoletane.

Good luck with your choice......

Paolo

[scott123]

I don't know where people are getting the idea of having the lowest dome possible is best and that 9" is perfect.

I've been the one spreading that idea.  It was a knee jerk reaction from finally seeing a pre-fab oven (the FGM) with a low dome and, after seeing so many ovens with top/bottom heat issues, making the assumption that if low is good, then really low is better. I've since toned back my 9" cheerleading.  I like 9" and still recommend it, but until I see more results with 9", there's no reason why 12" can't perform just as well, if not better, in an oven of the appropriate diameter.

Mitch, if the higher dome gives you more versatility, go for it.

[mitchjg]

For what it is worth, I got more specifics from Antoine about the FGM.  In the standard one, the door height is 8 1/2 inches and the interior dome height is 9.8.  The raised floor option, makes it and 11 1/2 door height and an interior dome height of 12.8.

I have decided to go ahead with the FGM but I am still (terribly) indecisive about the raised option.

I think the pros of the standard height are: a bit shorter heating time, a bit less wood, potential for greater ease in even cooking at high temps, less money.

I think the pros of the raised height is: more versatility of what can be cooked (taller things through the door).  My tallest dutch oven is 8.0.  It seems like it would be about things like a large turkey, a tagine, beer can chicken, other taller things one may imagine.

  

[RobynB]

It seems like it would be about things like a large turkey, a tagine, beer can chicken, other taller things one may imagine.

Specifically addressing your items:  I have the standard height 950 FGM, and I don't know if the extra 3" will give you enough height to make a significant difference for anything you just mentioned.  Maybe beer can chicken, I'm not real familiar with that.  A large turkey in a pan is taller than 12.8" in my experience and getting it through the door would definitely be a challenge, width-wise as well as height - and then managing it while it cooks will be tricky.  What's the width on the door on the smaller oven that you're looking at?  Because you'd need to get the turkey in roasting pan in through the door, and the door is going to be narrower as well as shorter than the inside of the oven.  And I guess it would depend on the tagine but I think you'd be tight even in the taller oven.  The two I just looked at on Amazon, you could probably fit the Emile Henry tagine but I'm not sure about the Le Creuset one. 

By the same token, I'm not sure you're sacrificing that much for Neapolitan pizza if you go with the taller oven.  I haven't cooked in the taller FGM but I have cooked in an Italian oven with a much higher ceiling and bigger opening than the FGM and it cooked beautifully.  It's a management issue more than a good/bad issue for a household oven, IMHO.  You're not putting in a restaurant oven that has to perform at maximum efficiency for a multitude of users, you can spend a little more time managing it if you need to, and you'll learn your own oven and how best to cook in it, and that trade-off for the versatility of the taller oven may be justified for you.  When we bought ours, we didn't have the taller option available so it was an easy decision.  If we had had to choose, I'm not sure we wouldn't have opted for the taller oven.  It would be nice to have, and my 950 is so efficient, I can't imagine loosing that much with the taller/bigger opening. 

I haven't gone back through this thread - have you looked at either actual oven in person?  I think that would really help, it's very hard to imagine the size without seeing it in reality. 

[mitchjg]

Specifically addressing your items:  I have the standard height 950 FGM, and I don't know if the extra 3" will give you enough height to make a significant difference for anything you just mentioned.  Maybe beer can chicken, I'm not real familiar with that.  A large turkey in a pan is taller than 12.8" in my experience and getting it through the door would definitely be a challenge, width-wise as well as height - and then managing it while it cooks will be tricky.  What's the width on the door on the smaller oven that you're looking at?  Because you'd need to get the turkey in roasting pan in through the door, and the door is going to be narrower as well as shorter than the inside of the oven.  And I guess it would depend on the tagine but I think you'd be tight even in the taller oven.  The two I just looked at on Amazon, you could probably fit the Emile Henry tagine but I'm not sure about the Le Creuset one. 

By the same token, I'm not sure you're sacrificing that much for Neapolitan pizza if you go with the taller oven.  I haven't cooked in the taller FGM but I have cooked in an Italian oven with a much higher ceiling and bigger opening than the FGM and it cooked beautifully.  It's a management issue more than a good/bad issue for a household oven, IMHO.  You're not putting in a restaurant oven that has to perform at maximum efficiency for a multitude of users, you can spend a little more time managing it if you need to, and you'll learn your own oven and how best to cook in it, and that trade-off for the versatility of the taller oven may be justified for you.  When we bought ours, we didn't have the taller option available so it was an easy decision.  If we had had to choose, I'm not sure we wouldn't have opted for the taller oven.  It would be nice to have, and my 950 is so efficient, I can't imagine loosing that much with the taller/bigger opening. 

I haven't gone back through this thread - have you looked at either actual oven in person?  I think that would really help, it's very hard to imagine the size without seeing it in reality. 

Hi Robyn:

The door size in the 700c is 17 X 8 1/2.  The interior max height is 9.8 inches.  From the website for Bread Stone Ovens, the dimensions of your 950C are:

Weight 925 lb
Total Height   16″
Inside Height 9″1/2
Cooking Surface 7.5 square feet
Wall Thickness 3″1/8
Door Opening   17″ wide x 8″1/2 high or 11"1/2 high with the raised option

So, the door dimensions are the same and the interior max height is the same.  Although the height is the same yours is much bigger 7.5 square feet of cooking area vs 4.0.  So, I can imagine that the interior height of the 700c is drops down faster, etc.

So, assuming your door measures this way - 17 X 8 1/2, then you can say if you have ever felt restricted by that!

No, I have not seen them in person.  I am in California and the oven is on the east coast.

- Mitch

[RobynB]

I just sent you a message 

[mitchjg]

After significant research, inquiry and hand wringing, I made my decision.  I have contracted for the FGM 700C from Bread Stone Ovens.  I went for the raised option.   My thinking was that it will give me more flexibility over time to cook non-pizza items (heresy?) and make it more generally useful in the house and maybe give me a little more "elbow room." 

Antoine is custom building a stand on wheels for me as well as some decorative slate around the opening to match my courtyard.  He is also customizing a little stand for tools that will integrate with the oven.  It should ship in around 10 days or so.

Thanks to each of you for all of the opinions, feedback and guidance - very much appreciated.

Now, I have to wait...............................

- Mitch

[pizzaneer]

Congrats!

Can't wait to see your pics of the installation, I'm sure it will be beautiful.

[cuznvin]

After significant research, inquiry and hand wringing, I made my decision.  I have contracted for the FGM 700C from Bread Stone Ovens.  I went for the raised option.   My thinking was that it will give me more flexibility over time to cook non-pizza items (heresy?) and make it more generally useful in the house and maybe give me a little more "elbow room." 

Antoine is custom building a stand on wheels for me as well as some decorative slate around the opening to match my courtyard.  He is also customizing a little stand for tools that will integrate with the oven.  It should ship in around 10 days or so.

Thanks to each of you for all of the opinions, feedback and guidance - very much appreciated.

Now, I have to wait...............................

- Mitch

This thread has been very helpful to me. I am also leaning towards the FGM, probably the 950. Would love to see pictures of yours as soon as you get it!! Thanks!

[JConk007]

I will be cooking in the FGM 950 (standard) in 2 weeks for a proud new  owner
Bringing 75 pizzas and will post reviews. I recommended this oven and he went with it
Hope it cooks as good as it looks they are sweet!
John