Author Topic: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven  (Read 19884 times)

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Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #25 on: July 10, 2012, 04:08:14 PM »
Probably the pizza turning device will have minimal effect on the heat reaching the stone, the stone will be about 1/2" higher than the grill grates and the pizza turning device surfaces will block some direct heat. I tried to limit the surfaces of the turning device to a minimum. Plus, I will be adding some large holes on the pizza turning device disc to maximize direct heat reaching the stone..


Offline pizzaneer

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #26 on: July 10, 2012, 07:03:25 PM »
Did we mention our consultancy fee?
I'd rather eat one good meal a day than 3 squares of garbage.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #27 on: July 10, 2012, 10:05:22 PM »
. In fact, the Mighty Pizza Oven gives you similar results to a brick oven, without any of the drawbacks.

-   The baking quality of the Mighty Pizza Oven is comparable to that of a brick oven.

-   It has the same short baking time as a brick oven but heats up much faster.

-   
If you are able to truly reach these parameters in your upcoming tests then I would be proud to be your first customer sir. I wish you success!

Bob
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Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #28 on: July 18, 2012, 07:35:36 AM »
Gene you were correct, I covered unused area of the grill with aluminum foil. The temperature in the oven did go increase by 100 Deg F.

The temperature inside the pizza oven reached 700 Deg F within 1/2 hour using my old grill. I will try to test the oven on a higher end gas grill.
The bottom stone temperature varied between 600 deg. F at front of the stone to 800 deg. F at the back of stone, which will be solved by rotating the stone using my pizza rotating device. I am planning to test the device later this week.

And, I have been looking to buy Member's Mark Gas Fired Ignition Charcoal Grill from Sam's Club to test my oven using charcoal. It is on sale for $100, pretty good deal for all the features included.

Will keep you posted.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #29 on: July 18, 2012, 09:14:38 AM »
What do you think your oven will  retail for $$?
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
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Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #30 on: July 18, 2012, 10:31:15 AM »
TXCraig1,

Based on the recommendation from the Kitchen Inventors show on the Food Network, the retail price should be 5 time the cost. Which make the unit cost extreemly high. I am still evaluating the basis of this factor, to stay competetive with existing pizza oven inserts in the market, my factor is two time the cost, which I am still evaluating if it is worth the risk, time and efforts, it all depend on the intrest level in my oven. If decided to proceed with the oven, most likely I will use kickstarter.com to generate funding for the minimum order required by the manufacturer.

Bert 

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #31 on: July 18, 2012, 10:43:32 AM »
5x the cost of production is insane.  A more realistic view for direct sales would be a margin of 40-50% of cost, 20-30 to re-sellers.

Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #32 on: July 18, 2012, 10:57:28 AM »
5x make sense for items that cost few dollars, still not sure why they refrence this factor on every episod regardless of the procution cost.

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #33 on: July 18, 2012, 11:03:14 AM »
Because they are a show about dreams?


Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #34 on: July 18, 2012, 11:14:37 AM »
my wife (the dream popper) keep in check.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #35 on: July 18, 2012, 11:22:00 AM »
My older sister an I call it "our gimmick"....we are still looking for it.... ;)
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #36 on: July 18, 2012, 11:52:44 AM »
Its kind of interesting though, to see how much some the inventors on that show have invested into their product/ dreams... I am not that brave...

Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #37 on: July 18, 2012, 01:05:32 PM »
The other thing I tested last night is the chimney,

notice the temperature guage on top of the oven when the chimney is closed and when it is open. The thermometer temperature increased due to the hot air flowing by and out through the open chimney, which you really need to cook your pizza top in addition to the heat form the top stone.

Note: This thermometer does not reflect the true oven temperature due to its location

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #38 on: July 18, 2012, 06:59:13 PM »
Bert, you seem like a great guy and I'm always appreciative when equipment developers seek out this forum's advice. I hate to be the bearer of bad tidings, but I really don't see this going anywhere.

The overall design is incredibly sexy, but, with all that stainless, there's no way you're clocking in with a retail below 2stone.  I've made it clear, on many occasions, that the 2stone insert is a waste of money, and that, for someone with minimal DIY skills, it can be built for a fraction of the cost.  The sexy look of the MPO, the adjustable stone height, the chimney and portability are all really nice, but I don't see these features being worth the minimum of $150 difference between this device and making something similar yourself.

And then you've got licensing concerns.  I am by no means an expert in patent law, but, when a person invents something and patents it, doesn't another inventor who invents something similar have to prove the new item's uniqueness?  There's no court in the land that would ever consider this a unique invention.  This is a 2stone + additional features, and, since 2stone has applied for a patent, should you decide to manufacture this device, I don't see how you can avoid paying them a licensing fee (if they even grant you the rights).  Am I missing some aspect of the law here?

Offline pizzaneer

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #39 on: July 18, 2012, 08:42:39 PM »
Scott, good points on patent law - but you missed the possible infringement lawsuit danger.

Bert, the only way I can see all this hard work and effort bringing you some joy is to sell the concept directly to a high-end grill manufacturer, as an add-on.  Theres grills that sell for obscene amounts of money, marketed to an audience that A: doesn't have a clue how to use them, and B: just likes to be able to say, Yeah my grill can do that.

I'd rather eat one good meal a day than 3 squares of garbage.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #40 on: July 19, 2012, 02:23:45 AM »
And then you've got licensing concerns.  I am by no means an expert in patent law, but, when a person invents something and patents it, doesn't another inventor who invents something similar have to prove the new item's uniqueness?

If the other inventor sues him. If you are building something similar to something already granted patent protection, you should have a legal opinion in your back packet stating why it is not infringing or else face a serious risk of enhanced damages (up to 3X).

Quote
There's no court in the land that would ever consider this a unique invention.  This is a 2stone + additional features, and, since 2stone has applied for a patent, should you decide to manufacture this device, I don't see how you can avoid paying them a licensing fee (if they even grant you the rights).  Am I missing some aspect of the law here?

It’s not that cut and dried. It’s all about the claims and how they are written - and more specifically, the claims allowed by the examiner. You are probably correct, but without reviewing the application and ultimately the granted patent (if granted), it is impossible to make such a blanket statement. It can also be surprisingly easy to get around patent claims. For example, simply enclosing the top stone in the unit with another sheet of stainless may be enough – maybe stick some ceramic insulation in there with it (5% royalty for me if you use that idea).  I don’t know if this would work, but you get the idea. I’ve seen patents circumvented with much much less.

Looking at his pictures, I would not say that it is out of the question that he could patent certain elements of his product. Are they things that would be meaningful and worth patenting? I don’t know. Having been through more than a few patent applications and examination processes, I can tell you it is an expensive, time consuming, and very frustrating process.

On the matter of price, “rules” like 5X are almost never a good way to price something. Clearly, the right price is the one that maximizes profit. There is a lot of science behind pricing – well beyond the scope of this note. Since you have already designed and built a prototype, as a first step, I would encourage you to do some research and try to determine what people might pay for it. Use similar products as a baseline and then list your additional (or reduced) features or utility. Try to estimate the value of those additional/less features and then adjust your price up or down accordingly. Gut check your net price with people who would be target customers. This forum would be a good place. If you are going to sell through a distributor or anyone who takes a cut, reduce your price by that amount. Then look at your costs and estimate your potential volume. Can you make enough $$ to make it worth your time? If not, consider how a redesign might make it suitably profitable.

Good luck. I admire your entrepreneurial and creative spirit.

Craig
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, commercial yeast when we must, but always great pizza."
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #41 on: July 19, 2012, 05:17:33 AM »
I do appreciate everyone straight forward feedback….

My design contains and controls the flow of heat across the cooking chamber and the temperature in the heated gap between the cooking stones; all other existing designs do not. 

My objective at this stage is to prove that my design preform significantly better than any existing designs and it will add value.

FYI …Last night, I repeated previous night experiment, where I covered the unused area of the grill with aluminum foil. This time I covered all the rest of the unused areas (1” gap on left side of the oven), within ten minutes, the grease at the bottom of the grill combusted.  I quickly shutoff the burners, and closed and disconnected the propane tank, removed my oven and closed the grill lid, it took a while for the flame to go out. I guess it has been a while since the last time I cleaned my grill. I use for baking pizza more than grilling. Anyway, something to make a note of and share with the forum DIY members  to be careful when experimenting


Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #42 on: July 19, 2012, 07:30:30 AM »
Any input on how guage performance in comparison to other oven inserts?

Thanks

Bert

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #43 on: July 19, 2012, 07:54:10 AM »
Side by side with the best known competitor on a larger grill. Could then use that unit as a demonstrator/marketing tool further on down the road.
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Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #44 on: July 19, 2012, 08:12:28 AM »
The performance test is more for my own piece of mind than for marketing… Does anyone knows if there is any independent testing facilities for such a thing.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #45 on: July 19, 2012, 08:33:16 AM »
The performance test is more for my own piece of mind than for marketing… Does anyone knows if there is any independent testing facilities for such a thing.
'independent testing facilities" ......to test the performance of your unit AND other inserts available on the market?
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Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #46 on: July 19, 2012, 09:02:07 AM »
Bob,  to test my oven, is there any certification or test that these grill accessories need to meet or comply with.

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #47 on: July 19, 2012, 09:13:36 AM »
I would contact Serious Eats/ Slice and send one to a staff writer there, have them put it through it's paces and give you their impressions. Same thing here. Get one in the hands of someone who knows how to bake pizza. Keep the correspondence confidential until the reviewers and yourself are satisfied that out of the box your unit will perform as advertised. I mention this so as to avoid the pitfalls of the inventor of the Pizza Kettle Insert.
Don

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=19669.0
« Last Edit: July 19, 2012, 09:23:45 AM by buceriasdon »

Offline MightyPizzaOven

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #48 on: July 19, 2012, 09:40:37 AM »
I will try a reviewer first...

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Introducing Mighty Pizza Oven
« Reply #49 on: July 19, 2012, 09:51:48 AM »
I would contact Serious Eats/ Slice and send one to a staff writer there, have them put it through it's paces and give you their impressions. Same thing here. Get one in the hands of someone who knows how to bake pizza. Keep the correspondence confidential until the reviewers and yourself are satisfied that out of the box your unit will perform as advertised. I mention this so as to avoid the pitfalls of the inventor of the Pizza Kettle Insert.
Don

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=19669.0
In a way this was not a pitfall.....they showed him how to make his product do much, much more. Not good though I guess if all you want to do is sell a piece of crap!  ;D
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