Author Topic: Craig's Neapolitan Garage  (Read 239939 times)

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Offline f.montoya

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1900 on: May 17, 2015, 12:50:21 PM »
That is correct, and Motorino's oven is UPN's oven that Anthony left behind when he went to SF (Gianni Acunto - also the same make of oven he just put in UPN/SF replacing the original Ferrara).

I ate at UPN in NYC/EV shortly before it closed and moved to SF (have not been to UPN/SF). I've been to Motorino several times. UPN was very good; IMO, Motorino is significantly better however.

Wow! "Significantly better" is quite a statement. Can you elaborate? With Mangieri, it's his own. With Motorino who is the artist and what is she/he doing better?


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1901 on: May 17, 2015, 01:40:41 PM »
I had a margherita at UPN, walked around the corner to Luzzo's and ate another there. They were the two best pies I had ever eaten at that point. Since then, I've put a WFO in my garage and been lucky enough to try Paulie Gee's, Motorino, Franny's, A16, 2Amys, Tony's Pizzeria Napoletana, Roberta's, Cane Rosso, and a host of others.

Obviously UPN inspired me. It's the only pizza I've tried to truly reverse engineer (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=10237.0). That being said, when I think about the pies I've eaten, outside of a few I've made in the Garage, only a few stick out for being transcendentally good: Motorino's sopressata pie, Motorino's Brussels sprout pie, and Franny's clam pie. That's it. That's the whole list. Tony's Margherita was way up there as was Roberta's Bee Sting. UPN is one tier lower. To me, it crosses into the world of being bready. It doesn't have the level of tenderness I want in NP. This is why I use the method described in this thread: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=20479.0 rather than the Reverse Engineering UPN thread. The method in the RE-UPN thread will make a pie that is all but identical to UPN.

UPN played a large role in opening my eyes to how good pizza can be, but my personal tastes pushed me in another direction.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Ogwoodfire

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1902 on: May 17, 2015, 02:51:11 PM »
Very interesting Craig. Obviously there's a lot of information out there for UPN (at least a decent amount), however there is not so much about Motorinos process. It appears a lock they use 00 flour, but the rest to me is a mystery, in terms of process and percentages. I find it unlikely that they use a starter, due to the fact that they do such high volume it would be hard to be consistent IMO. I'll make it down there this fall and do some research.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1903 on: May 17, 2015, 04:42:05 PM »
Very interesting Craig. Obviously there's a lot of information out there for UPN (at least a decent amount), however there is not so much about Motorinos process. It appears a lock they use 00 flour, but the rest to me is a mystery, in terms of process and percentages. I find it unlikely that they use a starter, due to the fact that they do such high volume it would be hard to be consistent IMO. I'll make it down there this fall and do some research.

Follow this: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=20479.0, tune it to your own specific situation, and you can make a pie better that any of them.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Ogwoodfire

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1904 on: May 18, 2015, 10:22:52 PM »
Yeah I've tried this, works great. For some reason I always do autolyse, can't get away from it.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1905 on: May 18, 2015, 10:35:32 PM »
"Autolyse" (which can mean pretty much anything nowadays) probably isn't hurting anything in your dough, but I've never seen anything that leads me to believe it contributes anything to pizzamaking.
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Ogwoodfire

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1906 on: May 19, 2015, 05:33:46 PM »
Learned it from a great chef long ago, just never stopped doing it I guess. If anything I beleive it allows me to work my dough less and makes things easier as I don't have or use a mixer. I agree with you though, probably not a big deal for pizza but also not hurting.

Offline Ogwoodfire

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1907 on: May 19, 2015, 06:04:01 PM »
My definition of autolyse is pretty traditional, combine flour and water only, and rest. The only thing I do differently is reserve some flour and combine with the salt for te remaining hand kneeding. If you think about it there are some parts of this that make sense, such a as the fact that salt expels moisture. So if salt is added to your water and flour mixture does it inhibit your flour from maximum absorption during the initial mixing stage? I'm theory it could, in reality I do not know. At some point I will have to conduct a side by side and see.
Either way I fired my new oven yesterday and am excited just to be using it, once I calm down again I'll run the expirament and post.

Offline dylandylan

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1908 on: May 20, 2015, 04:43:33 AM »
Learned it from a great chef long ago, just never stopped doing it I guess. If anything I beleive it allows me to work my dough less and makes things easier as I don't have or use a mixer. I agree with you though, probably not a big deal for pizza but also not hurting.

For what it's worth, making a 48hr dough without a mixer I neither autolyze or work my dough for long at all.   I do leave the dough to rest for about 20 minutes before first working it, but that's with all ingredients mixed, so not an autolyze by your definition.  These days I do about one minute's "work", plus a few stretch and folds, then let time do the rest.


Offline Ogwoodfire

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1909 on: May 22, 2015, 07:30:45 PM »
I see what your saying but the kneading gets more difficult with large batches. Kneading 5lbs of dough by hand is much different than 50 that's where it comes in helpful to me.

Offline David Esq.

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1910 on: Yesterday at 02:48:23 AM »
I just read about your setting up that oven. Respect!

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Craig's Neapolitan Garage
« Reply #1911 on: Yesterday at 08:01:00 AM »
I just read about your setting up that oven. Respect!

Thank you. It was quite a bit more of an experience than I expected. 
Pizza is not bread. Craig's Neapolitan Garage